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John Hauck
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)
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 Posted: Tue Apr 12, 2016 4:00 am Post subject: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention |
 |
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Only thing I Alodine on my MKIII is the engine mounts for the 912. I do not paint them. Initially, I did paint them and had a problem with lose engine mount bolts when the primer and paint wore between the two surfaces.
Haven't found it necessary to use a corrosion preventive treatment on alclad aluminum tubing.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
Started on the stabilizers of my Firestar kit Saturday, got one side cut, fitted and Clecoed, and was able to start cutting tubes for the second one. Does anyone have a recommendation for or againsit using Alodine chemical conversion as a no-weight corrosion preventive treatment on the aluminum tails?
Bill Berle
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
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_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama |
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rickofudall
Joined: 19 Sep 2009
Posts: 1392
Location: Udall, KS, USA
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| Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2016 9:29 am Post subject: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention |
|
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Alodine works better if its used under an epoxy coating. As I believe the Poly Fiber book recommends.One sure way to get your Kolb wing or tail to corrode whether you alodine or not; don't install drain grommets. Once again, as the Poly Fiber book recommends.
Tip on Alodine. It doesn't work forever. Look at the product usage and see how many square feet it will convert and protect. The Alumiprep that Spruce sells is good for 100 sq. ft. of coverage per quart. Sounds like a lot until you consider that a single 4 X 8 sheet of aluminum is 96 square feet (both sides).
Years ago a fellow in EAA Chapter 1000 (Edwards Air Force Base) noted that you're paying a hell of a lot for water when you buy premixed alodine. He bought the powder from Henkel Technologies and bought his own distilled water. Unfortunately the minimum purchase size was $100 (early 2000's) but he had enough to do something like 4 RV style aluminum airplanes. On the other hand, if you buy quarts from Spruce you won't even get a gallon of premix for $100.
So, buy the gallon for $42 and get 4 times as much for 1.5 times greater price. Or better yet, go to your local auto body materials distributor and avoid the hazardous materials fees for shipping.
Rick Girard
On Tue, Apr 12, 2016 at 7:00 AM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)>
Only thing I Alodine on my MKIII is the engine mounts for the 912. I do not paint them. Initially, I did paint them and had a problem with lose engine mount bolts when the primer and paint wore between the two surfaces.
Haven't found it necessary to use a corrosion preventive treatment on alclad aluminum tubing.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
Started on the stabilizers of my Firestar kit Saturday, got one side cut, fitted and Clecoed, and was able to start cutting tubes for the second one. Does anyone have a recommendation for or againsit using Alodine chemical conversion as a no-weight corrosion preventive treatment on the aluminum tails?
Bill Berle
===========
br> fts!)
r> > w.buildersbooks.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
===========
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eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
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“Blessed are the cracked, for they shall let in the light.” Groucho Marx
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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The smallest miracle right in front of you is enough to make you happy.... |
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John Hauck
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2016 9:46 am Post subject: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention |
|
|
Rick G/Kolbers:
Anything on my MKIII that could possible hold water gets a drain hole at its lowest point when in its 3 point stance. I tried drain grommets on previous Kolb models, but they turned out to be a pain in the butt.
Instead of drain grommets I use 50 cent sized patches and a pencil soldering iron. I make a 3/16" drain hole approximately. Works well for me.
One drawback down here in the sunny south is mud daubers. Some of them can get inside the drain holes to build mud nest. I discovered that when I pulled fabric to repair wing and aileron 15 years ago. They are nasty.
I have to constantly keep a look out for their nest in places on my engine.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Girard
Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2016 12:29 PM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention
Alodine works better if its used under an epoxy coating. As I believe the Poly Fiber book recommends.
One sure way to get your Kolb wing or tail to corrode whether you alodine or not; don't install drain grommets. Once again, as the Poly Fiber book recommends.
Tip on Alodine. It doesn't work forever. Look at the product usage and see how many square feet it will convert and protect. The Alumiprep that Spruce sells is good for 100 sq. ft. of coverage per quart. Sounds like a lot until you consider that a single 4 X 8 sheet of aluminum is 96 square feet (both sides).
Years ago a fellow in EAA Chapter 1000 (Edwards Air Force Base) noted that you're paying a hell of a lot for water when you buy premixed alodine. He bought the powder from Henkel Technologies and bought his own distilled water. Unfortunately the minimum purchase size was $100 (early 2000's) but he had enough to do something like 4 RV style aluminum airplanes. On the other hand, if you buy quarts from Spruce you won't even get a gallon of premix for $100.
So, buy the gallon for $42 and get 4 times as much for 1.5 times greater price. Or better yet, go to your local auto body materials distributor and avoid the hazardous materials fees for shipping.
Rick Girard
On Tue, Apr 12, 2016 at 7:00 AM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)> wrote:
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)>
Only thing I Alodine on my MKIII is the engine mounts for the 912. I do not paint them. Initially, I did paint them and had a problem with lose engine mount bolts when the primer and paint wore between the two surfaces.
Haven't found it necessary to use a corrosion preventive treatment on alclad aluminum tubing.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
Started on the stabilizers of my Firestar kit Saturday, got one side cut, fitted and Clecoed, and was able to start cutting tubes for the second one. Does anyone have a recommendation for or againsit using Alodine chemical conversion as a no-weight corrosion preventive treatment on the aluminum tails?
Bill Berle
===========
br> fts!)
r> > w.buildersbooks.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
===========
-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
===========
FORUMS -
eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
===========
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
===========
-- “Blessed are the cracked, for they shall let in the light.” Groucho Marx
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
|
_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama |
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rickofudall
Joined: 19 Sep 2009
Posts: 1392
Location: Udall, KS, USA
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2016 10:19 am Post subject: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention |
|
|
John, This is a PBI (partially baked idea). I have used it on an LED porch light and it has been holding the mud daubbers at bay for two years now. I just haven't tried it in this manner.When you do your drain grommets, however your method, make the hole, then cover it with small piece of fiberglass screen and place a patch, with hole, over the top to hold the screen insert. You'll have to take some care to keep the screen from filling up with Poly Tone or whatever your final coat is but at least the wasps won't be in your wings or tail feathers.
Wish I could do this to keep the little buggers out of my trike wing.
Also, don't forget if you leave the locator hole on your prop hub open they'll get in there, too.
Rick
On Wed, Apr 13, 2016 at 12:44 PM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)> wrote:
| Quote: |
Rick G/Kolbers:
Anything on my MKIII that could possible hold water gets a drain hole at its lowest point when in its 3 point stance. I tried drain grommets on previous Kolb models, but they turned out to be a pain in the butt.
Instead of drain grommets I use 50 cent sized patches and a pencil soldering iron. I make a 3/16" drain hole approximately. Works well for me.
One drawback down here in the sunny south is mud daubers. Some of them can get inside the drain holes to build mud nest. I discovered that when I pulled fabric to repair wing and aileron 15 years ago. They are nasty.
I have to constantly keep a look out for their nest in places on my engine.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of Richard Girard
Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2016 12:29 PM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com (kolb-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention
Alodine works better if its used under an epoxy coating. As I believe the Poly Fiber book recommends.
One sure way to get your Kolb wing or tail to corrode whether you alodine or not; don't install drain grommets. Once again, as the Poly Fiber book recommends.
Tip on Alodine. It doesn't work forever. Look at the product usage and see how many square feet it will convert and protect. The Alumiprep that Spruce sells is good for 100 sq. ft. of coverage per quart. Sounds like a lot until you consider that a single 4 X 8 sheet of aluminum is 96 square feet (both sides).
Years ago a fellow in EAA Chapter 1000 (Edwards Air Force Base) noted that you're paying a hell of a lot for water when you buy premixed alodine. He bought the powder from Henkel Technologies and bought his own distilled water. Unfortunately the minimum purchase size was $100 (early 2000's) but he had enough to do something like 4 RV style aluminum airplanes. On the other hand, if you buy quarts from Spruce you won't even get a gallon of premix for $100.
So, buy the gallon for $42 and get 4 times as much for 1.5 times greater price. Or better yet, go to your local auto body materials distributor and avoid the hazardous materials fees for shipping.
Rick Girard
On Tue, Apr 12, 2016 at 7:00 AM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)> wrote:
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)>
Only thing I Alodine on my MKIII is the engine mounts for the 912. I do not paint them. Initially, I did paint them and had a problem with lose engine mount bolts when the primer and paint wore between the two surfaces.
Haven't found it necessary to use a corrosion preventive treatment on alclad aluminum tubing.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
Started on the stabilizers of my Firestar kit Saturday, got one side cut, fitted and Clecoed, and was able to start cutting tubes for the second one. Does anyone have a recommendation for or againsit using Alodine chemical conversion as a no-weight corrosion preventive treatment on the aluminum tails?
Bill Berle
===========
br> fts!)
r> > w.buildersbooks.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
===========
-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
===========
FORUMS -
eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
===========
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
===========
-- “Blessed are the cracked, for they shall let in the light.” Groucho Marx
|
--
“Blessed are the cracked, for they shall let in the light.” Groucho Marx
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
|
_________________
The smallest miracle right in front of you is enough to make you happy.... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2016 10:28 am Post subject: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention |
|
|
Has anyone tried small pieces of window screen to cover the drain holes? Regular back door window screen could be cut into little patches and glued over the hole in the fabric at the drain location. Seems to me like it would keep the mud daubers out, let the moisture drain out, and allow air circulation. But we don't have those little critters here as bad as they do in the south so it's not something we have to deal with here as much.
Bill Berle
www.ezflaphandle.com - safety & performance upgrade for light aircraft
www.grantstar.net - winning proposals for non-profit and for-profit entities
--------------------------------------------
On Wed, 4/13/16, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> wrote:
Subject: RE: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Wednesday, April 13, 2016, 10:44 AM
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#yiv3134528233 Rick G/Kolbers: Anything on my MKIII that could
possible hold water gets a drain hole at its lowest point
when in its 3 point stance. I tried drain grommets on
previous Kolb models, but they turned out to be a pain in
the butt. Instead of drain grommets I use 50
cent sized patches and a pencil soldering iron. I make a
3/16" drain hole approximately. Works well for
me. One drawback down here in the
sunny south is mud daubers. Some of them can get inside
the drain holes to build mud nest. I discovered that when
I pulled fabric to repair wing and aileron 15 years ago.
They are nasty. I have to constantly keep a look
out for their nest in places on my engine. john hmkIIITitus, Alabama From:
owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf
Of Richard Girard
Sent:
Wednesday, April 13, 2016 12:29 PM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Last Flight
2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention Alodine works better if its
used under an epoxy coating. As I believe the Poly Fiber
book recommends.One sure way to get your Kolb
wing or tail to corrode whether you alodine or not;
don't install drain grommets. Once again, as the Poly
Fiber book recommends.Tip on Alodine. It
doesn't work forever. Look at the product usage and see
how many square feet it will convert and protect. The
Alumiprep that Spruce sells is good for 100 sq. ft. of
coverage per quart. Sounds like a lot until you consider
that a single 4 X 8 sheet of aluminum is 96 square feet
(both sides). Years ago a fellow in EAA
Chapter 1000 (Edwards Air Force Base) noted that you're
paying a hell of a lot for water when you buy premixed
alodine. He bought the powder from Henkel Technologies and
bought his own distilled water. Unfortunately the minimum
purchase size was $100 (early 2000's) but he had enough
to do something like 4 RV style aluminum airplanes. On the
other hand, if you buy quarts from Spruce you won't even
get a gallon of premix for $100. So, buy the gallon for $42
and get 4 times as much for 1.5 times greater price. Or
better yet, go to your local auto body materials distributor
and avoid the hazardous materials fees for
shipping.
Rick
Girard On Tue, Apr 12, 2016 at 7:00
AM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
wrote:--> Kolb-List message
posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Only thing I Alodine on my
MKIII is the engine mounts for the 912. I do not paint
them. Initially, I did paint them and had a problem with
lose engine mount bolts when the primer and paint wore
between the two surfaces.
Haven't found it necessary to use a
corrosion preventive treatment on alclad aluminum tubing.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
Started on the stabilizers of my Firestar kit
Saturday, got one side cut, fitted and Clecoed, and was able
to start cutting tubes for the second one. Does anyone have
a recommendation for or againsit using Alodine chemical
conversion as a no-weight corrosion preventive treatment on
the aluminum tails?
Bill
Berle
===========
br> fts!)
r> > w.buildersbooks.com"
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com
rel="noreferrer"
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
===========
-List"
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
===========
FORUMS -
eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
===========
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
rel="noreferrer"
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
===========
--
“Blessed are the cracked, for
they shall let in the light.” Groucho
Marx
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
|
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| Back to top |
|
|
John Hauck
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2016 10:42 am Post subject: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention |
|
|
The crush plate and spinner keep bugs out of the centering hole. Open holes in the back of the prop flange get a little dab of silicone seal, because the mud daubers homesteaded there.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard Girard
Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2016 1:17 PM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention
John, This is a PBI (partially baked idea). I have used it on an LED porch light and it has been holding the mud daubbers at bay for two years now. I just haven't tried it in this manner.
When you do your drain grommets, however your method, make the hole, then cover it with small piece of fiberglass screen and place a patch, with hole, over the top to hold the screen insert. You'll have to take some care to keep the screen from filling up with Poly Tone or whatever your final coat is but at least the wasps won't be in your wings or tail feathers.
Wish I could do this to keep the little buggers out of my trike wing.
Also, don't forget if you leave the locator hole on your prop hub open they'll get in there, too.
Rick
On Wed, Apr 13, 2016 at 12:44 PM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)> wrote:
Rick G/Kolbers:
Anything on my MKIII that could possible hold water gets a drain hole at its lowest point when in its 3 point stance. I tried drain grommets on previous Kolb models, but they turned out to be a pain in the butt.
Instead of drain grommets I use 50 cent sized patches and a pencil soldering iron. I make a 3/16" drain hole approximately. Works well for me.
One drawback down here in the sunny south is mud daubers. Some of them can get inside the drain holes to build mud nest. I discovered that when I pulled fabric to repair wing and aileron 15 years ago. They are nasty.
I have to constantly keep a look out for their nest in places on my engine.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of Richard Girard
Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2016 12:29 PM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com (kolb-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention
Alodine works better if its used under an epoxy coating. As I believe the Poly Fiber book recommends.
One sure way to get your Kolb wing or tail to corrode whether you alodine or not; don't install drain grommets. Once again, as the Poly Fiber book recommends.
Tip on Alodine. It doesn't work forever. Look at the product usage and see how many square feet it will convert and protect. The Alumiprep that Spruce sells is good for 100 sq. ft. of coverage per quart. Sounds like a lot until you consider that a single 4 X 8 sheet of aluminum is 96 square feet (both sides).
Years ago a fellow in EAA Chapter 1000 (Edwards Air Force Base) noted that you're paying a hell of a lot for water when you buy premixed alodine. He bought the powder from Henkel Technologies and bought his own distilled water. Unfortunately the minimum purchase size was $100 (early 2000's) but he had enough to do something like 4 RV style aluminum airplanes. On the other hand, if you buy quarts from Spruce you won't even get a gallon of premix for $100.
So, buy the gallon for $42 and get 4 times as much for 1.5 times greater price. Or better yet, go to your local auto body materials distributor and avoid the hazardous materials fees for shipping.
Rick Girard
On Tue, Apr 12, 2016 at 7:00 AM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)> wrote:
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)>
Only thing I Alodine on my MKIII is the engine mounts for the 912. I do not paint them. Initially, I did paint them and had a problem with lose engine mount bolts when the primer and paint wore between the two surfaces.
Haven't found it necessary to use a corrosion preventive treatment on alclad aluminum tubing.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
Started on the stabilizers of my Firestar kit Saturday, got one side cut, fitted and Clecoed, and was able to start cutting tubes for the second one. Does anyone have a recommendation for or againsit using Alodine chemical conversion as a no-weight corrosion preventive treatment on the aluminum tails?
Bill Berle
===========
br> fts!)
r> > w.buildersbooks.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
===========
-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
===========
FORUMS -
eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
===========
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
===========
-- “Blessed are the cracked, for they shall let in the light.” Groucho Marx
-- “Blessed are the cracked, for they shall let in the light.” Groucho Marx
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
|
_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama |
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victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2016 10:56 am Post subject: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention |
|
|
Just saw Richard's post similar to my idea... great minds think alike I guess 
You would not need to install the screen during the covering process and spend all the effort to prevent it from getting filled up with Poly-Brush etc.
Make a 3/4" round patch with a 1/2" hole in the center. Make the patch out of thin ABS plastic, same as some seaplane grommets. You can probably find pre-cut plastic washers or shims somewhere that are the right size. Cut small circles of window screen that are just UNDER 3/4" diameter. Glue the screen over this hole. You can even paint them now if you know the color of the airplane. Set the patches aside until the airplane is all covered. Then cut the hole with the soldering iron or knife or whatever. Then glue the patches on using Poly-Tak with the screen sandwiched between the patch and the fabric.
It will take a couple of hours to make up a dozen of the drain patches, but it will prevent the little critters from damaging your aircraft.
Speaking of mud daubers, they LOVE to get into your pitot tube and leave you with no airspeed indication. This is easy to solve, get a short piece of rubber tubing that slips over your pitot tube, and wrap a little piece of window screen material over one end of the rubber, then Ty-Rap (zip-tie) the screen onto the tube. Also make sure you capture a little orange or red streamer, ribbon, etc. with the zip tie as a "remove before flight" warning. Apply some glue (RTV, Shoe-Goo) to stick it all down around the rubber tube,m leaving the screen on the tip of the rubber to allow the pitot tube to "breathe" so your airspeed indicator does not get damaged by moisture or pressure. After the glue dries trim off the excess screen, and you have a safe way to prevent bugs and muyd from getting into the pitot.
Bill Berle
www.ezflaphandle.com - safety & performance upgrade for light aircraft
www.grantstar.net - winning proposals for non-profit and for-profit entities
--------------------------------------------
On Wed, 4/13/16, Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com> wrote:
Subject: Re: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention
To: "kolb-list(at)matronics.com" <kolb-list(at)matronics.com>
Date: Wednesday, April 13, 2016, 11:17 AM
John, This
is a PBI (partially baked idea). I have used it on an LED
porch light and it has been holding the mud daubbers at bay
for two years now. I just haven't tried it in this
manner.When you do your drain grommets, however your
method, make the hole, then cover it with small piece of
fiberglass screen and place a patch, with hole, over the top
to hold the screen insert. You'll have to take some care
to keep the screen from filling up with Poly Tone or
whatever your final coat is but at least the wasps won't
be in your wings or tail feathers.Wish I could do
this to keep the little buggers out of my trike
wing.Also, don't forget if you leave the
locator hole on your prop hub open they'll get in there,
too.
Rick
On Wed, Apr 13, 2016 at
12:44 PM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
wrote:
Rick
G/Kolbers: Anything on my MKIII that could
possible hold water gets a drain hole at its lowest point
when in its 3 point stance. I tried drain grommets on
previous Kolb models, but they turned out to be a pain in
the butt. Instead of drain grommets I use 50
cent sized patches and a pencil soldering iron. I make a
3/16" drain hole approximately. Works well for
me. One drawback down here in the
sunny south is mud daubers. Some of them can get inside
the drain holes to build mud nest. I discovered that when
I pulled fabric to repair wing and aileron 15 years ago.
They are nasty. I have to constantly keep a look
out for their nest in places on my
engine. john hmkIIITitus,
Alabama From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com]
On Behalf Of Richard Girard
Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2016 12:29
PM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Last Flight
2005/Alodine/Corrosion
Prevention Alodine works better if its
used under an epoxy coating. As I believe the Poly Fiber
book recommends.One sure way to get your Kolb
wing or tail to corrode whether you alodine or not;
don't install drain grommets. Once again, as the Poly
Fiber book recommends.Tip on Alodine. It
doesn't work forever. Look at the product usage and see
how many square feet it will convert and protect. The
Alumiprep that Spruce sells is good for 100 sq. ft. of
coverage per quart. Sounds like a lot until you consider
that a single 4 X 8 sheet of aluminum is 96 square feet
(both sides). Years ago a fellow in EAA
Chapter 1000 (Edwards Air Force Base) noted that you're
paying a hell of a lot for water when you buy premixed
alodine. He bought the powder from Henkel Technologies and
bought his own distilled water. Unfortunately the minimum
purchase size was $100 (early 2000's) but he had enough
to do something like 4 RV style aluminum airplanes. On the
other hand, if you buy quarts from Spruce you won't even
get a gallon of premix for
$100. So, buy the gallon for $42
and get 4 times as much for 1.5 times greater price. Or
better yet, go to your local auto body materials distributor
and avoid the hazardous materials fees for
shipping. Rick
Girard On Tue, Apr 12, 2016 at 7:00
AM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
wrote:
"John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Only thing I Alodine on my
MKIII is the engine mounts for the 912. I do not paint
them. Initially, I did paint them and had a problem with
lose engine mount bolts when the primer and paint wore
between the two surfaces.
Haven't found it necessary to use a
corrosion preventive treatment on alclad aluminum tubing.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
Started on the stabilizers of my Firestar kit
Saturday, got one side cut, fitted and Clecoed, and was able
to start cutting tubes for the second one. Does anyone have
a recommendation for or againsit using Alodine chemical
conversion as a no-weight corrosion preventive treatment on
the aluminum tails?
Bill
Berle
===========
br>
fts!)
r> > w.buildersbooks.com"
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com
rel="noreferrer"
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
===========
-List"
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
===========
FORUMS -
eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
===========
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
rel="noreferrer"
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
===========
--
“Blessed are the cracked, for
they shall let in the light.” Groucho
Marx
--
“Blessed are
the cracked, for they shall let in the light.” Groucho
Marx
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ceengland7(at)gmail.com
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2016 12:29 pm Post subject: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention |
|
|
Just to avoid any confusion, alumiprep is needed, but it ain't alodine. Alumiprep is the acid etch used *after* cleaning off all the oils/contaminates, and prior to the alodine process. Alumiprep strips off the oxide layer that's on all untreated aluminum, so the alodine can work on the alloy itself. Small parts can be dipped in the alumiprep, meaning it can be re-used multiple times before it loses its effectiveness. Same applies to alodine, but don't use it outdoors or where sunlight can hit it; sunlight (UV?) degrades it fairly quickly.
Good tip on the powder. Even the powder triggers hazmat fees even though it's non-toxic when dry, but still *much* cheaper if you mix yourself. Ask for Iridite powder if you can buy local. Best tip I ever heard was to mix a large batch in a plastic drum or even a black plastic garbage can, if you can seal it up when not in use. If kept away from light, it will remain active for a long time, and timed 'dipping' is a lot easier & more effective than trying to flow it, or mop it on with sponges or rags.
Toughest thing to do with large surfaces is keep the entire surface wet (with either chemical) until the 'exposure time' has run and you rinse it off with clean water. One trick is to build a trough with plastic sheet suspended behind/above it, so runoff goes in the trough for re-use. A cheap fountain pump from Harbor Freight rigged to recycle fluid from the trough might last long enough to do the big stuff.
Don't forget, both are highly toxic, so use carefully. Full strength alumiprep will eat your concrete floor (I can testify). Alumiprep is a Chromate product, and Chromates are banned in a lot of states due to toxicity. No reason to be terrified of them, but you do need to respect them (eye protection, good gloves, etc).
Charlie
On Wed, Apr 13, 2016 at 12:29 PM, Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com (aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | Alodine works better if its used under an epoxy coating. As I believe the Poly Fiber book recommends.One sure way to get your Kolb wing or tail to corrode whether you alodine or not; don't install drain grommets. Once again, as the Poly Fiber book recommends.
Tip on Alodine. It doesn't work forever. Look at the product usage and see how many square feet it will convert and protect. The Alumiprep that Spruce sells is good for 100 sq. ft. of coverage per quart. Sounds like a lot until you consider that a single 4 X 8 sheet of aluminum is 96 square feet (both sides).
Years ago a fellow in EAA Chapter 1000 (Edwards Air Force Base) noted that you're paying a hell of a lot for water when you buy premixed alodine. He bought the powder from Henkel Technologies and bought his own distilled water. Unfortunately the minimum purchase size was $100 (early 2000's) but he had enough to do something like 4 RV style aluminum airplanes. On the other hand, if you buy quarts from Spruce you won't even get a gallon of premix for $100.
So, buy the gallon for $42 and get 4 times as much for 1.5 times greater price. Or better yet, go to your local auto body materials distributor and avoid the hazardous materials fees for shipping.
Rick Girard
On Tue, Apr 12, 2016 at 7:00 AM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)>
Only thing I Alodine on my MKIII is the engine mounts for the 912. I do not paint them. Initially, I did paint them and had a problem with lose engine mount bolts when the primer and paint wore between the two surfaces.
Haven't found it necessary to use a corrosion preventive treatment on alclad aluminum tubing.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
Started on the stabilizers of my Firestar kit Saturday, got one side cut, fitted and Clecoed, and was able to start cutting tubes for the second one. Does anyone have a recommendation for or againsit using Alodine chemical conversion as a no-weight corrosion preventive treatment on the aluminum tails?
Bill Berle
|
|
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ceengland7(at)gmail.com
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2016 12:40 pm Post subject: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention |
|
|
Never tried this with fabric, but a common trick in aluminum skin drain holes is to bend up a piece of stainless safety wire so it has a bit of a T shape or horizontal spiral on top, and enough of a zigzag or horizontal spiral on the bottom to keep it from going up through the hole. Vibration while flying makes it 'dance' a bit in the hole. This keeps any dirt/grit from clogging the hole, and will keep insects out, as well. Similar trick, except an inverted J shape, can be used in fuel vents, etc. Minimum airflow blockage, but breaks up the hole enough that mud daubers aren't interested. The crook at the bottom (top) is cut/bent to work like a fish hook when inserted into the tubing. Or just drill through the tubing twice at right angles and cross the opening with an X of safety wire. Obviously, this won't be as effective if you're using 3/8" or larger tubing, without some extra effort.
I've used 'proseal' (fuel tank sealant) to 'glue' small sections of aluminum window screen over the -4 A/N fittings (fuel tank vents) on my RV-4 & the -7 I'm building.
Charlie
On Wed, Apr 13, 2016 at 1:42 PM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)> wrote:
| Quote: |
The crush plate and spinner keep bugs out of the centering hole. Open holes in the back of the prop flange get a little dab of silicone seal, because the mud daubers homesteaded there.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of Richard Girard
Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2016 1:17 PM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com (kolb-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention
John, This is a PBI (partially baked idea). I have used it on an LED porch light and it has been holding the mud daubbers at bay for two years now. I just haven't tried it in this manner.
When you do your drain grommets, however your method, make the hole, then cover it with small piece of fiberglass screen and place a patch, with hole, over the top to hold the screen insert. You'll have to take some care to keep the screen from filling up with Poly Tone or whatever your final coat is but at least the wasps won't be in your wings or tail feathers.
Wish I could do this to keep the little buggers out of my trike wing.
Also, don't forget if you leave the locator hole on your prop hub open they'll get in there, too.
Rick
On Wed, Apr 13, 2016 at 12:44 PM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)> wrote:
Rick G/Kolbers:
Anything on my MKIII that could possible hold water gets a drain hole at its lowest point when in its 3 point stance. I tried drain grommets on previous Kolb models, but they turned out to be a pain in the butt.
Instead of drain grommets I use 50 cent sized patches and a pencil soldering iron. I make a 3/16" drain hole approximately. Works well for me.
One drawback down here in the sunny south is mud daubers. Some of them can get inside the drain holes to build mud nest. I discovered that when I pulled fabric to repair wing and aileron 15 years ago. They are nasty.
I have to constantly keep a look out for their nest in places on my engine.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of Richard Girard
Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2016 12:29 PM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com (kolb-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention
Alodine works better if its used under an epoxy coating. As I believe the Poly Fiber book recommends.
One sure way to get your Kolb wing or tail to corrode whether you alodine or not; don't install drain grommets. Once again, as the Poly Fiber book recommends.
Tip on Alodine. It doesn't work forever. Look at the product usage and see how many square feet it will convert and protect. The Alumiprep that Spruce sells is good for 100 sq. ft. of coverage per quart. Sounds like a lot until you consider that a single 4 X 8 sheet of aluminum is 96 square feet (both sides).
Years ago a fellow in EAA Chapter 1000 (Edwards Air Force Base) noted that you're paying a hell of a lot for water when you buy premixed alodine. He bought the powder from Henkel Technologies and bought his own distilled water. Unfortunately the minimum purchase size was $100 (early 2000's) but he had enough to do something like 4 RV style aluminum airplanes. On the other hand, if you buy quarts from Spruce you won't even get a gallon of premix for $100.
So, buy the gallon for $42 and get 4 times as much for 1.5 times greater price. Or better yet, go to your local auto body materials distributor and avoid the hazardous materials fees for shipping.
Rick Girard
On Tue, Apr 12, 2016 at 7:00 AM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)> wrote:
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)>
Only thing I Alodine on my MKIII is the engine mounts for the 912. I do not paint them. Initially, I did paint them and had a problem with lose engine mount bolts when the primer and paint wore between the two surfaces.
Haven't found it necessary to use a corrosion preventive treatment on alclad aluminum tubing.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
Started on the stabilizers of my Firestar kit Saturday, got one side cut, fitted and Clecoed, and was able to start cutting tubes for the second one. Does anyone have a recommendation for or againsit using Alodine chemical conversion as a no-weight corrosion preventive treatment on the aluminum tails?
Bill Berle
===========
br> fts!)
r> > w.buildersbooks.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
===========
-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
===========
FORUMS -
eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
===========
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
===========
-- “Blessed are the cracked, for they shall let in the light.” Groucho Marx
-- “Blessed are the cracked, for they shall let in the light.” Groucho Marx
|
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http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
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ceengland7(at)gmail.com
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2016 12:48 pm Post subject: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention |
|
|
Dirt might not be an issue in an elevator or even a wing, but I can testify that dirt will clog even an open 1/8" hole in the bottom of a fuselage. I once drained ~5 gallons of water from the tailcone of the Luscombe I was learning to fly in. And that was *after* I'd taken off, flown a few T&Gs, & discovered that I had to hold forward stick to flair for landing. (Water was moving aft, over the bulkheads, after each takeoff. Dirt will likely clog screen very quickly, unless you operate and store the plane in a dust free environment.
On my RV-4, I use one of the relatively inexpensive 'flapper' style pitot covers. Weight closes it when at rest, and dynamic air pressure opens it automatically when I start the takeoff roll. I always forget, and it never matters.
Charlie
On Wed, Apr 13, 2016 at 1:54 PM, Bill Berle <victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.net (victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.net)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> Kolb-List message posted by: Bill Berle <victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.net (victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.net)>
Just saw Richard's post similar to my idea... great minds think alike I guess
You would not need to install the screen during the covering process and spend all the effort to prevent it from getting filled up with Poly-Brush etc.
Make a 3/4" round patch with a 1/2" hole in the center. Make the patch out of thin ABS plastic, same as some seaplane grommets. You can probably find pre-cut plastic washers or shims somewhere that are the right size. Cut small circles of window screen that are just UNDER 3/4" diameter. Glue the screen over this hole. You can even paint them now if you know the color of the airplane. Set the patches aside until the airplane is all covered. Then cut the hole with the soldering iron or knife or whatever. Then glue the patches on using Poly-Tak with the screen sandwiched between the patch and the fabric.
It will take a couple of hours to make up a dozen of the drain patches, but it will prevent the little critters from damaging your aircraft.
Speaking of mud daubers, they LOVE to get into your pitot tube and leave you with no airspeed indication. This is easy to solve, get a short piece of rubber tubing that slips over your pitot tube, and wrap a little piece of window screen material over one end of the rubber, then Ty-Rap (zip-tie) the screen onto the tube. Also make sure you capture a little orange or red streamer, ribbon, etc. with the zip tie as a "remove before flight" warning. Apply some glue (RTV, Shoe-Goo) to stick it all down around the rubber tube,m leaving the screen on the tip of the rubber to allow the pitot tube to "breathe" so your airspeed indicator does not get damaged by moisture or pressure. After the glue dries trim off the excess screen, and you have a safe way to prevent bugs and muyd from getting into the pitot.
Bill Berle
www.ezflaphandle.com - safety & performance upgrade for light aircraft
www.grantstar.net - winning proposals for non-profit and for-profit entities
--------------------------------------------
On Wed, 4/13/16, Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com (aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
Subject: Re: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention
To: "kolb-list(at)matronics.com (kolb-list(at)matronics.com)" <kolb-list(at)matronics.com (kolb-list(at)matronics.com)>
Date: Wednesday, April 13, 2016, 11:17 AM
John, This
is a PBI (partially baked idea). I have used it on an LED
porch light and it has been holding the mud daubbers at bay
for two years now. I just haven't tried it in this
manner.When you do your drain grommets, however your
method, make the hole, then cover it with small piece of
fiberglass screen and place a patch, with hole, over the top
to hold the screen insert. You'll have to take some care
to keep the screen from filling up with Poly Tone or
whatever your final coat is but at least the wasps won't
be in your wings or tail feathers.Wish I could do
this to keep the little buggers out of my trike
wing.Also, don't forget if you leave the
locator hole on your prop hub open they'll get in there,
too.
Rick
On Wed, Apr 13, 2016 at
12:44 PM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)>
wrote:
Rick
G/Kolbers: Anything on my MKIII that could
possible hold water gets a drain hole at its lowest point
when in its 3 point stance. I tried drain grommets on
previous Kolb models, but they turned out to be a pain in
the butt. Instead of drain grommets I use 50
cent sized patches and a pencil soldering iron. I make a
3/16" drain hole approximately. Works well for
me. One drawback down here in the
sunny south is mud daubers. Some of them can get inside
the drain holes to build mud nest. I discovered that when
I pulled fabric to repair wing and aileron 15 years ago.
They are nasty. I have to constantly keep a look
out for their nest in places on my
engine. john hmkIIITitus,
Alabama From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com)
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com)]
On Behalf Of Richard Girard
Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2016 12:29
PM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com (kolb-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Last Flight
2005/Alodine/Corrosion
Prevention Alodine works better if its
used under an epoxy coating. As I believe the Poly Fiber
book recommends.One sure way to get your Kolb
wing or tail to corrode whether you alodine or not;
don't install drain grommets. Once again, as the Poly
Fiber book recommends.Tip on Alodine. It
doesn't work forever. Look at the product usage and see
how many square feet it will convert and protect. The
Alumiprep that Spruce sells is good for 100 sq. ft. of
coverage per quart. Sounds like a lot until you consider
that a single 4 X 8 sheet of aluminum is 96 square feet
(both sides). Years ago a fellow in EAA
Chapter 1000 (Edwards Air Force Base) noted that you're
paying a hell of a lot for water when you buy premixed
alodine. He bought the powder from Henkel Technologies and
bought his own distilled water. Unfortunately the minimum
purchase size was $100 (early 2000's) but he had enough
to do something like 4 RV style aluminum airplanes. On the
other hand, if you buy quarts from Spruce you won't even
get a gallon of premix for
$100. So, buy the gallon for $42
and get 4 times as much for 1.5 times greater price. Or
better yet, go to your local auto body materials distributor
and avoid the hazardous materials fees for
shipping. Rick
Girard On Tue, Apr 12, 2016 at 7:00
AM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)>
wrote:--> Kolb-List message posted by:
"John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)>
Only thing I Alodine on my
MKIII is the engine mounts for the 912. I do not paint
them. Initially, I did paint them and had a problem with
lose engine mount bolts when the primer and paint wore
between the two surfaces.
Haven't found it necessary to use a
corrosion preventive treatment on alclad aluminum tubing.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
Started on the stabilizers of my Firestar kit
Saturday, got one side cut, fitted and Clecoed, and was able
to start cutting tubes for the second one. Does anyone have
a recommendation for or againsit using Alodine chemical
conversion as a no-weight corrosion preventive treatment on
the aluminum tails?
Bill
Berle
===========
br>
fts!)
r> > w.buildersbooks.com"
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com
rel="noreferrer"
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
===========
-List"
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
===========
FORUMS -
eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
===========
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
rel="noreferrer"
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
===========
--
“Blessed are the cracked, for
they shall let in the light.” Groucho
Marx
--
“Blessed are
the cracked, for they shall let in the light.” Groucho
Marx
===========
br> fts!)
r> > w.buildersbooks.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
===========
-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
===========
FORUMS -
eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
===========
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
===========
|
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http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
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| Back to top |
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|
victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Apr 13, 2016 12:56 pm Post subject: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention |
|
|
Good advice Charlie!
If I decide to use Alodine on my Kolb project, I figured I could cut a piece of 6 or 8 inch plastic pipe (with caps on the ends) in half lengthwise, and have two troughs for the Alumiprep and Alodine.
Bill Berle
www.ezflaphandle.com - safety & performance upgrade for light aircraft
www.grantstar.net - winning proposals for non-profit and for-profit entities
--------------------------------------------
On Wed, 4/13/16, Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com> wrote:
Subject: Re: Last Flight 2005/Alodine/Corrosion Prevention
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Wednesday, April 13, 2016, 1:29 PM
Just to avoid any
confusion, alumiprep is needed, but it ain't alodine.
Alumiprep is the acid etch used *after* cleaning off all the
oils/contaminates, and prior to the alodine process.
Alumiprep strips off the oxide layer that's on all
untreated aluminum, so the alodine can work on the alloy
itself. Small parts can be dipped in the alumiprep, meaning
it can be re-used multiple times before it loses its
effectiveness. Same applies to alodine, but don't use it
outdoors or where sunlight can hit it; sunlight (UV?)
degrades it fairly quickly.
Good tip on the powder. Even the powder triggers
hazmat fees even though it's non-toxic when dry, but
still *much* cheaper if you mix yourself. Ask for Iridite
powder if you can buy local. Best tip I ever heard was to
mix a large batch in a plastic drum or even a black plastic
garbage can, if you can seal it up when not in use. If kept
away from light, it will remain active for a long time, and
timed 'dipping' is a lot easier & more effective
than trying to flow it, or mop it on with sponges or
rags.
Toughest thing to do with large surfaces is keep
the entire surface wet (with either chemical) until the
'exposure time' has run and you rinse it off with
clean water. One trick is to build a trough with plastic
sheet suspended behind/above it, so runoff goes in the
trough for re-use. A cheap fountain pump from Harbor Freight
rigged to recycle fluid from the trough might last long
enough to do the big stuff.
Don't forget, both are highly toxic, so use
carefully. Full strength alumiprep will eat your concrete
floor (I can testify). Alumiprep is a Chromate product, and
Chromates are banned in a lot of states due to toxicity. No
reason to be terrified of them, but you do need to respect
them (eye protection, good gloves, etc).
Charlie
On Wed, Apr 13, 2016
at 12:29 PM, Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com>
wrote:
Alodine works better if its used under an epoxy
coating. As I believe the Poly Fiber book
recommends.One sure way to get your Kolb wing or tail
to corrode whether you alodine or not; don't install
drain grommets. Once again, as the Poly Fiber book
recommends.Tip on Alodine. It doesn't work
forever. Look at the product usage and see how many square
feet it will convert and protect. The Alumiprep that Spruce
sells is good for 100 sq. ft. of coverage per quart. Sounds
like a lot until you consider that a single 4 X 8 sheet of
aluminum is 96 square feet (both sides). Years
ago a fellow in EAA Chapter 1000 (Edwards Air Force Base)
noted that you're paying a hell of a lot for water when
you buy premixed alodine. He bought the powder from Henkel
Technologies and bought his own distilled water.
Unfortunately the minimum purchase size was $100 (early
2000's) but he had enough to do something like 4 RV
style aluminum airplanes. On the other hand, if you buy
quarts from Spruce you won't even get a gallon of premix
for $100. So, buy the gallon for $42 and get 4
times as much for 1.5 times greater price. Or better yet, go
to your local auto body materials distributor and avoid the
hazardous materials fees for shipping.
Rick Girard
On Tue, Apr 12, 2016
at 7:00 AM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
wrote:
-->
Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
Only thing I Alodine on my MKIII is the engine mounts for
the 912. I do not paint them. Initially, I did paint
them and had a problem with lose engine mount bolts when the
primer and paint wore between the two surfaces.
Haven't found it necessary to use a corrosion preventive
treatment on alclad aluminum tubing.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
Started on the stabilizers of my Firestar kit Saturday, got
one side cut, fitted and Clecoed, and was able to start
cutting tubes for the second one. Does anyone have a
recommendation for or againsit using Alodine chemical
conversion as a no-weight corrosion preventive treatment on
the aluminum tails?
Bill Berle
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