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Herbgh(at)nctc.com
Guest
|
 Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 8:18 am Post subject: snow what??? |
 |
|
Guys ...after learning that the new owner was not the one flying the Firefly..and seeing the latest post on the youtube site...
this is my email to the owner....can I do more?? Herb
I understand that you were not the one flying the Firefly in that video?
I cannot emphasize enough...this plane will kill you dead....Kolbs have a very sharp stall!! Typically getting too slow on landing and dropping a wing and hitting the ground Very Bad!!! If you are lucky , it will mush in and bend the landing gear and bend the frame...but you will still get something broken....
You must get some dual instruction in another plane of similar characteristics..!! Mark III or Firestar II...
Please do not orphan those kids!!! I will buy it back and come and get it...Herb
On 05/03/2016 11:04 AM, Herb wrote:
| Quote: | Rick
My day is ruined....check the latest comment on You tube at the link below!!! I am sick!!! Herb
On 05/03/2016 10:31 AM, Richard Girard wrote:
| Quote: | After my experience with the "Plane from Hell", I think a additional project should be a "how to inspect a Kolb (model). There are some real morons out there when it comes to building and absolutely unscrupulous when it comes to selling. You can have all the flying manuals you want but if the plane is poorly built it probably won't fly within the manual parameters and a pilot with little skill can find himself in real trouble.
Rick Girard
On Tue, May 3, 2016 at 8:04 AM, Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com (Herbgh(at)nctc.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> Kolb-List message posted by: Herb <[url=mailto:Herbgh(at)nctc.com]Herbgh(at)nctc.com (Herbgh(at)nctc.com)[/url]>
When I sold the Firefly last month...I was naturally worried about a low time pilot....but this video seems to indicate that he is doing very well...guide or no...I notice he installed a BRS... I mentioned on the comments that it was a Herbup to not have painted the instrument panel...must have been dozing that day?? Not sure what happened to the foam joy stick grip?? Herb
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmmXDbhcTwY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZWZ4smwWOg
On 05/03/2016 12:49 AM, Bill Berle wrote:
| Quote: | --> Kolb-List message posted by: Bill Berle <[url=mailto:victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.net]victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.net (victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.net)[/url]>
Great idea on the piloting tips, so long as you can protect the authors of those tips from liability or blame when the s**t hits the fan.
On a similar note, as a new Kolb builder but an experienced "airplane guy", I believe there is also a strong need for an improved assembly manual. I have written assembly and construction manuals professionally, and I have sent the factory an e-mail that mentioned this and offered my services. I would be very glad to participate in the assembly manual rewrite if the factory is interested. But it is their decision, and they may not agree that there is a need for a better manual..
Bill Berle
www.ezflaphandle.com - safety & performance upgrade for light aircraft
www.grantstar.net - winning proposals for non-profit and for-profit entities
--------------------------------------------
On Mon, 5/2/16, Nick Cassara <[url=mailto:nickc(at)mtaonline.net]nickc(at)mtaonline.net (nickc(at)mtaonline.net)[/url]> wrote:
Subject: How about a new Pilot Guide to Kolb flying?
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com (kolb-list(at)matronics.com)
Date: Monday, May 2, 2016, 9:26 PM
--> Kolb-List message posted by:
Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net (nickc(at)mtaonline.net)>
Kolbers,
Ever year we have several “members” finish their
projects, or buy a Kolb and joint our group. I think it
would be a good thing if those of you with Kolb flying
experience could create a “Kolb Flying Tips “ document
of some sort. I hope to joint the group of completed
projects this summer, and I know the best think to do is to
get more time in a Champ, but I know, that flying my Kolb
will be different than flying the Champ. So how about a
do’s and don’t of fly the Kolb. I know that there will
be differences in every Kolb built and each model, but what
are the average V speeds for each model? I would think that
one of the company owner would have printed some of the
information, but if they have I have never heard a reference
to it. What do you think?
Thanks as always, I would have never gotten this far without
the support and knowledge of this group!
Nick Cassara
Palmer, Alaska
PAAQ
Kolbra Kit #1
Forum -
- MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
MATRONICS LIST WIKI -
List Contribution Web Site -
-Matt
Dralle, List Admin.
|
--
Signature text; Fort Marcy Park? Sure...Mr. Foster...Third red light and turn left.
===========
-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
===========
FORUMS -
eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
===========
WIKI -
errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com
===========
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
===========
|
--
“Blessed are the cracked, for they shall let in the light.” Groucho Marx
--
Signature text; Fort Marcy Park? Sure...Mr. Foster...Third red light and turn left.
|
--
Signature text; Fort Marcy Park? Sure...Mr. Foster...Third red light and turn left.
|
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 9:59 am Post subject: snow what??? |
|
|
Looking at the youtube video, it appears as though the pilot is having to hold the stick 10 degrees to the right for "normal" level flight.
Experienced Kolb pilots - is this correct? Is this just camera parallax? Is this particular airplane not rigged right?
Bill Berle
www.ezflaphandle.com - safety & performance upgrade for light aircraft
www.grantstar.net - winning proposals for non-profit and for-profit entities
--------------------------------------------
On Tue, 5/3/16, Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> wrote:
Subject: snow what???
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Tuesday, May 3, 2016, 9:17 AM
Guys ...after learning that the new owner was not the
one flying the
Firefly..and seeing the latest post on the youtube
site...
this is my email to the owner....can I do more??
Herb
I understand that you were not the one flying the
Firefly in that
video?
I cannot emphasize enough...this plane will kill you
dead....Kolbs
have a very sharp stall!! Typically getting too slow on
landing and
dropping a wing and hitting the ground Very Bad!!!
If you are
lucky , it will mush in and bend the landing gear and
bend the
frame...but you will still get something broken....
You must get some dual instruction in another
plane of similar
characteristics..!! Mark III or Firestar II...
Please do not orphan those kids!!! I will buy it
back and come
and get it...Herb
On 05/03/2016
11:04 AM, Herb wrote:
Rick
My day is ruined....check the latest comment on You
tube at the
link below!!! I am sick!!! Herb
On
05/03/2016 10:31 AM, Richard
Girard wrote:
After my experience with the
"Plane from Hell", I
think a additional project should be a "how
to inspect a Kolb
(model). There are some real morons out there when
it comes to
building and absolutely unscrupulous when it comes
to selling.
You can have all the flying manuals you want but
if the plane
is poorly built it probably won't fly within
the manual
parameters and a pilot with little skill can find
himself in
real trouble.
Rick Girard
On Tue, May
3, 2016 at 8:04 AM, Herb
<Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
wrote:
-->
Kolb-List message posted by: Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
When I sold the Firefly last month...I was
naturally
worried about a low time pilot....but this
video seems to
indicate that he is doing very well...guide or
no...I
notice he installed a BRS... I mentioned
on the
comments that it was a Herbup to not have
painted the
instrument panel...must have been dozing that
day?? Not
sure what happened to the foam joy stick
grip?? Herb
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmmXDbhcTwY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZWZ4smwWOg
On 05/03/2016 12:49 AM, Bill Berle wrote:
Berle <victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.net>
Great idea on the piloting tips, so
long as you can
protect the authors of those tips from
liability or
blame when the s**t hits the fan.
On a similar note, as a new Kolb builder
but an
experienced "airplane guy", I
believe there is also
a strong need for an improved assembly
manual. I
have written assembly and construction
manuals
professionally, and I have sent the
factory an
e-mail that mentioned this and offered
my services.
I would be very glad to participate in
the assembly
manual rewrite if the factory is
interested. But it
is their decision, and they may not
agree that there
is a need for a better manual..
Bill Berle
www.ezflaphandle.com
- safety & performance upgrade for
light
aircraft
www.grantstar.net
-
winning proposals for non-profit and
for-profit
entities
--------------------------------------------
On Mon, 5/2/16, Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net>
wrote:
Subject: How about a new
Pilot Guide to
Kolb flying?
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Monday, May 2, 2016, 9:26 PM
--> Kolb-List message posted
by:
Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net>
Kolbers,
Ever year we have several
“members” finish their
projects, or buy a Kolb and joint our
group. I
think it
would be a good thing if those of you
with Kolb
flying
experience could create a “Kolb
Flying Tips “
document
of some sort. I hope to joint the
group of
completed
projects this summer, and I know the
best think to
do is to
get more time in a Champ, but I know,
that flying
my Kolb
will be different than flying the
Champ. So how
about a
do’s and don’t of fly the Kolb. I
know that there
will
be differences in every Kolb built
and each model,
but what
are the average V speeds for each
model? I would
think that
one of the company owner would have
printed some
of the
information, but if they have I have
never heard a
reference
to it. What do you think?
Thanks as always, I would have
never gotten this
far without
the support and knowledge of this
group!
Nick Cassara
Palmer, Alaska
PAAQ
Kolbra Kit #1
Forum -
- MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
MATRONICS LIST WIKI -
List Contribution Web Site -
-Matt
Dralle, List Admin.
--
Signature text; Fort Marcy Park?
Sure...Mr.
Foster...Third red light and turn
left.
===========
-List" rel="noreferrer"
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
===========
FORUMS -
eferrer"
target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
===========
WIKI -
errer"
target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com
===========
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
rel="noreferrer"
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
===========
--
“Blessed are
the cracked, for they shall let in the
light.” Groucho
Marx
--
Signature text; Fort Marcy Park? Sure...Mr. Foster...Third
red light and turn left.
--
Signature text; Fort Marcy Park? Sure...Mr. Foster...Third
red light and turn left.
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
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John Hauck
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)
|
| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 10:09 am Post subject: snow what??? |
|
|
I didn't notice the position of the stick. Was too busy looking out at the countryside.
One can rig the stick anywhere it is comfortable for him, by adjusting aileron push/pull tubes, and elevator cable turn buckles.
I like mine to fall into my hand when I am in a nice comfortable relaxed position with my right elbow on my right thigh.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
--
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
|
_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama |
|
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Herbgh(at)nctc.com
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 10:44 am Post subject: snow what??? |
|
|
I noticed that and have just chatted with the guy who flew the
plane...he said it flew perfectly...no problems at all...and he has 20+
plus years in Kolbs... owns a Fly... Several Kolbs at the field...
I then assumed camera angle...but did not think to ask...after his
"perfectly" statement...
Up shot...the new owner put it on its back..and did considerable
damage which the club members (a lot of expertise in that club!!) have
repaired..to the extent that the repair is hardly noticeable...
To be honest, after all that I have heard,, it would have been great
if it was not fixable!!! 
We have developed a plan to help save this guy.... lets hope....
(wife and kids are last resort!!) Herb
On 05/03/2016 12:56 PM, Bill Berle wrote:
| Quote: |
Looking at the youtube video, it appears as though the pilot is having to hold the stick 10 degrees to the right for "normal" level flight.
Experienced Kolb pilots - is this correct? Is this just camera parallax? Is this particular airplane not rigged right?
Bill Berle
www.ezflaphandle.com - safety & performance upgrade for light aircraft
www.grantstar.net - winning proposals for non-profit and for-profit entities
--------------------------------------------
On Tue, 5/3/16, Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> wrote:
Subject: snow what???
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Tuesday, May 3, 2016, 9:17 AM
Guys ...after learning that the new owner was not the
one flying the
Firefly..and seeing the latest post on the youtube
site...
this is my email to the owner....can I do more??
Herb
I understand that you were not the one flying the
Firefly in that
video?
I cannot emphasize enough...this plane will kill you
dead....Kolbs
have a very sharp stall!! Typically getting too slow on
landing and
dropping a wing and hitting the ground Very Bad!!!
If you are
lucky , it will mush in and bend the landing gear and
bend the
frame...but you will still get something broken....
You must get some dual instruction in another
plane of similar
characteristics..!! Mark III or Firestar II...
Please do not orphan those kids!!! I will buy it
back and come
and get it...Herb
On 05/03/2016
11:04 AM, Herb wrote:
Rick
My day is ruined....check the latest comment on You
tube at the
link below!!! I am sick!!! Herb
On
05/03/2016 10:31 AM, Richard
Girard wrote:
After my experience with the
"Plane from Hell", I
think a additional project should be a "how
to inspect a Kolb
(model). There are some real morons out there when
it comes to
building and absolutely unscrupulous when it comes
to selling.
You can have all the flying manuals you want but
if the plane
is poorly built it probably won't fly within
the manual
parameters and a pilot with little skill can find
himself in
real trouble.
Rick Girard
On Tue, May
3, 2016 at 8:04 AM, Herb
<Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
wrote:
-->
Kolb-List message posted by: Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
When I sold the Firefly last month...I was
naturally
worried about a low time pilot....but this
video seems to
indicate that he is doing very well...guide or
no...I
notice he installed a BRS... I mentioned
on the
comments that it was a Herbup to not have
painted the
instrument panel...must have been dozing that
day?? Not
sure what happened to the foam joy stick
grip?? Herb
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmmXDbhcTwY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZWZ4smwWOg
On 05/03/2016 12:49 AM, Bill Berle wrote:
Berle <victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.net>
Great idea on the piloting tips, so
long as you can
protect the authors of those tips from
liability or
blame when the s**t hits the fan.
On a similar note, as a new Kolb builder
but an
experienced "airplane guy", I
believe there is also
a strong need for an improved assembly
manual. I
have written assembly and construction
manuals
professionally, and I have sent the
factory an
e-mail that mentioned this and offered
my services.
I would be very glad to participate in
the assembly
manual rewrite if the factory is
interested. But it
is their decision, and they may not
agree that there
is a need for a better manual..
Bill Berle
www.ezflaphandle.com
- safety & performance upgrade for
light
aircraft
www.grantstar.net
-
winning proposals for non-profit and
for-profit
entities
--------------------------------------------
On Mon, 5/2/16, Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net>
wrote:
Subject: How about a new
Pilot Guide to
Kolb flying?
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Monday, May 2, 2016, 9:26 PM
--> Kolb-List message posted
by:
Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net>
Kolbers,
Ever year we have several
“members” finish their
projects, or buy a Kolb and joint our
group. I
think it
would be a good thing if those of you
with Kolb
flying
experience could create a “Kolb
Flying Tips “
document
of some sort. I hope to joint the
group of
completed
projects this summer, and I know the
best think to
do is to
get more time in a Champ, but I know,
that flying
my Kolb
will be different than flying the
Champ. So how
about a
do’s and don’t of fly the Kolb. I
know that there
will
be differences in every Kolb built
and each model,
but what
are the average V speeds for each
model? I would
think that
one of the company owner would have
printed some
of the
information, but if they have I have
never heard a
reference
to it. What do you think?
Thanks as always, I would have
never gotten this
far without
the support and knowledge of this
group!
Nick Cassara
Palmer, Alaska
PAAQ
Kolbra Kit #1
Forum -
- MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
MATRONICS LIST WIKI -
List Contribution Web Site -
-Matt
Dralle, List Admin.
--
Signature text; Fort Marcy Park?
Sure...Mr.
Foster...Third red light and turn
left.
===========
-List" rel="noreferrer"
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
===========
FORUMS -
eferrer"
target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
===========
WIKI -
errer"
target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com
===========
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
rel="noreferrer"
target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
===========
--
“Blessed are
the cracked, for they shall let in the
light.” Groucho
Marx
--
Signature text; Fort Marcy Park? Sure...Mr. Foster...Third
red light and turn left.
--
Signature text; Fort Marcy Park? Sure...Mr. Foster...Third
red light and turn left.
|
--
Signature text; Fort Marcy Park? Sure...Mr. Foster...Third red light and turn left.
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
|
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| Back to top |
|
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w0odi
Joined: 05 Apr 2015
Posts: 20
Location: Ozarks Hills
|
| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 11:08 am Post subject: Re: snow what??? |
|
|
you can't fix arrogance or stupid but you can hopefully nip in the bud with the wife.... sounds like the kind of person that knows it all and in reality don't know JACK!! I don't own a kolb but I do have enough sense to know that I would need training to fly it... that would be like climbing in a citabria and having never flown and expecting to fly it like the experts.....Good luck guys.. the story scares me.. I fly a quicksilver and just lurk around here because of the good info about flying in general.. I love the kolb and have ever since seeing my first one at Oshkosh in 91.. This guy needs to re think his abilities.. I have seen these types.. they usually don't last to long.. I think he maybe one of these the warning labels have been created for..
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 11:16 am Post subject: snow what??? |
|
|
Can someone explain to me what is being discussed here, I'm afraid that I'm not getting something that's important. What I am reading on this discussion forum sounds like it is different than what people are upset or irritated about. I must be missing a big piece of this story.
Here is what I am "hearing" on the discussion forum :
1) Herb sold his beautiful Firefly to someone, and
2) that someone (the buyer) allowed someone else (with 20+ years in Kolbs) to fly it for that video, and
3) that highly experienced Kolb pilot did two traditional wingover maneuvers on camera, and
4) the buyer of Herb's Firefly (who was not shown in the video) now needs to be saved before something awful happens to his family.
I am NOT being a smart-ass (my usual self), I'm just missing part of the story and I do not understand what specific thing happened that has ruined Herb's day, made him so upset, who crashed the airplane and when, and why he would rather have seen the airplane destroyed.
Another thing I think I noticed is that the farm where this video was taken APPEARS to be the same farm where a previous youtube video was done showing the Kolb doing numerous slow takeoffs and landings by a pretty good quality pilot.
Like I said, I am probably missing something significant... can someone clue me in?
Bill Berle
www.ezflaphandle.com - safety & performance upgrade for light aircraft
www.grantstar.net - winning proposals for non-profit and for-profit entities
--------------------------------------------
On Tue, 5/3/16, Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> wrote:
Subject: Re: snow what???
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Tuesday, May 3, 2016, 11:44 AM
Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
I noticed that and have just chatted with the guy who flew
the
plane...he said it flew perfectly...no problems at all...and
he has 20+
plus years in Kolbs... owns a Fly... Several Kolbs at the
field...
I then assumed camera angle...but did not
think to ask...after his
"perfectly" statement...
Up shot...the new owner put it on its
back..and did considerable
damage which the club members (a lot of expertise in that
club!!) have
repaired..to the extent that the repair is hardly
noticeable...
To be honest, after all that I have heard,, it would
have been great
if it was not fixable!!!
We have developed a plan to help save this
guy.... lets hope....
(wife and kids are last resort!!) Herb
On 05/03/2016 12:56 PM, Bill Berle wrote:
>
>
> Looking at the youtube video, it appears as though the
pilot is having to hold the stick 10 degrees to the right
for "normal" level flight.
>
> Experienced Kolb pilots - is this correct? Is this just
camera parallax? Is this particular airplane not rigged
right?
>
> Bill Berle
> www.ezflaphandle.com - safety & performance
upgrade for light aircraft
> www.grantstar.net
- winning proposals for non-profit and
for-profit entities
>
> --------------------------------------------
> On Tue, 5/3/16, Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
wrote:
>
> Subject: snow what???
> To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Tuesday, May 3, 2016, 9:17 AM
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Guys ...after learning
that the new owner was not the
> one flying the
> Firefly..and seeing the
latest post on the youtube
> site...
>
>
>
> this is my email
to the owner....can I do more??
> Herb
>
>
>
>
>
> I understand that you
were not the one flying the
> Firefly in that
> video?
>
>
>
> I cannot emphasize
enough...this plane will kill you
> dead....Kolbs
> have a very sharp
stall!! Typically getting too slow on
> landing and
> dropping a wing and
hitting the ground Very Bad!!!
> If you are
> lucky , it will mush in
and bend the landing gear and
> bend the
> frame...but you will
still get something broken....
>
>
>
> You must
get some dual instruction in another
> plane of similar
>
characteristics..!! Mark III or
Firestar II...
>
>
>
> Please do not
orphan those kids!!! I will buy it
> back and come
> and get it...Herb
>
> On 05/03/2016
> 11:04 AM, Herb wrote:
>
>
>
>
> Rick
>
>
>
> My day is
ruined....check the latest comment on You
> tube at the
> link
below!!! I am sick!!! Herb
>
>
>
> On
> 05/03/2016 10:31 AM, Richard
> Girard
wrote:
>
>
>
> After my
experience with the
> "Plane from Hell", I
>
think a additional project should be a
"how
> to inspect a Kolb
>
(model). There are some real morons out
there when
> it comes to
>
building and absolutely unscrupulous when
it comes
> to selling.
> You
can have all the flying manuals you want but
> if the plane
> is
poorly built it probably won't fly within
> the manual
>
parameters and a pilot with little skill
can find
> himself in
>
real trouble.
>
>
>
>
Rick Girard
>
>
>
> On
Tue, May
> 3, 2016 at 8:04 AM, Herb
>
<Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
>
wrote:
>
>
-->
>
Kolb-List message posted by: Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
>
>
>
>
When I sold the Firefly last month...I
was
> naturally
>
worried about a low time pilot....but
this
> video seems to
>
indicate that he is doing very
well...guide or
> no...I
>
notice he installed a BRS... I
mentioned
> on the
>
comments that it was a Herbup to not have
> painted the
>
instrument panel...must have been dozing
that
> day?? Not
>
sure what happened to the foam joy stick
> grip?? Herb
>
>
>
>
>
>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmmXDbhcTwY
>
>
>
>
>
>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZWZ4smwWOg
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
On 05/03/2016 12:49 AM, Bill Berle
wrote:
>
>
>
--> Kolb-List message
posted by: Bill
> Berle <victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.net>
>
>
>
>
Great idea on the
piloting tips, so
> long as you can
>
protect the authors of those
tips from
> liability or
>
blame when the s**t hits the
fan.
>
>
>
>
On a similar note, as a new
Kolb builder
> but an
>
experienced "airplane guy",
I
> believe there is also
>
a strong need for an
improved assembly
> manual. I
>
have written assembly and
construction
> manuals
>
professionally, and I have
sent the
> factory an
>
e-mail that mentioned this
and offered
> my services.
>
I would be very glad to
participate in
> the assembly
>
manual rewrite if the
factory is
> interested. But it
>
is their decision, and they
may not
> agree that there
>
is a need for a better
manual..
>
>
>
>
Bill Berle
>
>
www.ezflaphandle.com
>
- safety & performance
upgrade for
> light
>
aircraft
>
>
www.grantstar.net
> -
>
winning proposals for
non-profit and
> for-profit
>
entities
>
>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------
>
>
On Mon, 5/2/16, Nick Cassara
<nickc(at)mtaonline.net>
>
>
wrote:
>
>
>
>
Subject: Kolb-List:
How about a new
> Pilot Guide to
>
Kolb flying?
>
>
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
>
>
Date: Monday, May 2,
2016, 9:26 PM
>
>
-->
Kolb-List message posted
> by:
>
>
Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net>
>
>
Kolbers,
>
>
Ever year we
have several
> “members” finish their
>
>
projects, or buy a
Kolb and joint our
> group. I
>
think it
>
>
would be a good thing
if those of you
> with Kolb
>
flying
>
>
experience could
create a “Kolb
> Flying Tips “
>
document
>
>
of some sort. I hope
to joint the
> group of
>
completed
>
>
projects this summer,
and I know the
> best think to
>
do is to
>
>
get more time in a
Champ, but I know,
> that flying
>
my Kolb
>
>
will be different
than flying the
> Champ. So how
>
about a
>
>
do’s and don’t of
fly the Kolb. I
> know that there
>
will
>
>
be differences in
every Kolb built
> and each model,
>
but what
>
>
are the average V
speeds for each
> model? I would
>
think that
>
>
one of the company
owner would have
> printed some
>
of the
>
>
information, but if
they have I have
> never heard a
>
reference
>
>
to it. What do you
think?
>
>
Thanks as
always, I would have
> never gotten this
>
far without
>
>
the support and
knowledge of this
> group!
>
>
Nick Cassara
>
>
Palmer, Alaska
>
>
PAAQ
>
>
Kolbra Kit #1
>
>
Forum -
>
>
- MATRONICS WEB
FORUMS -
>
>
MATRONICS LIST WIKI
-
>
>
List Contribution Web
Site -
>
>
-Matt
>
>
Dralle, List Admin.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
>
>
Signature text; Fort Marcy Park?
> Sure...Mr.
>
Foster...Third red light and turn
> left.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
===========
>
>
-List" rel="noreferrer"
> target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
>
>
===========
>
>
FORUMS -
>
>
eferrer"
> target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
>
>
===========
>
>
WIKI -
>
>
errer"
> target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com
>
>
===========
>
>
b Site -
>
>
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
>
>
rel="noreferrer"
> target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
>
>
===========
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
“Blessed are
>
the cracked, for they
shall let in the
> light.” Groucho
>
Marx
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Signature text; Fort Marcy Park?
Sure...Mr. Foster...Third
> red light and turn left.
>
>
>
>
> --
> Signature text; Fort Marcy Park?
Sure...Mr. Foster...Third
> red light and turn left.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
Signature text; Fort Marcy Park? Sure...Mr.
Foster...Third red light and turn left.
Forum -
- MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
MATRONICS LIST WIKI -
List Contribution Web Site -
-Matt
Dralle, List Admin.
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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John Hauck
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)
|
| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 12:18 pm Post subject: snow what??? |
|
|
You are missing somethings.
All Kolb models are very maneuverable aircraft. They are a lot of fun to fly. They are not rated for aerobatics, but will do most aerobatic maneuvers with ease.
The two most agile models of Kolbs are the Slingshot and the Firefly, because of their short wing span, primarily. The long wing models are slower to role, but, as Homer Kolb explained to me many years ago when I was complaining about how slow they rolled, "Be gentle and the aircraft will do what you want it to do."
Many Kolb pilots never experience any maneuver more than straight and level and slow turns. By pushing the limits of the Kolb I learned how to better fly it, especially when I got myself into serious wind and weather problems. One will never know what his Kolb will do unless he pushes out of his comfort zone a little.
I find it very disappointing and sad that many Kolb owners think they can fly without instruction and/or indoctrination. We have lost a lot of Kolb people because of ego and stupidity. It is not necessary. I guess it is very similar to jumping in the water over your head and not knowing how to swim, but have heard how, read the manual, jump in and drown.
Not recommending anyone do as I do. Simply expressing how I have experienced my Kolbs over the years.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
--
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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|
_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
lcottrell
Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 1494
Location: Jordan Valley, Or
|
| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 12:25 pm Post subject: snow what??? |
|
|
On Tue, May 3, 2016 at 12:44 PM, Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com (Herbgh(at)nctc.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> Kolb-List message posted by: Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com (Herbgh(at)nctc.com)>
Up shot...the new owner put it on its back..and did considerable damage which the club members (a lot of expertise in that club!!) have repaired..to the extent that the repair is hardly noticeable...
To be honest, after all that I have heard,, it would have been great if it was not fixable!!!
We have developed a plan to help save this guy.... lets hope... (wife and kids are last resort!!) Herb
| Quote: | | ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ |
|
I'm not sure what you are so worried about. If the guy had it on its back already, he should be getting the message, don't you think? Nothing like a little personal up close experience to tell a guy what he does and does not know. Sounds like a great bunch of guy's that would help him put it back together. I am sure that he will now be open to suggestions.
Larry
--
The older I get, the less tolerant I am of those who are intolerant of others.
If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending.
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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|
_________________
do not archive |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 1:02 pm Post subject: snow what??? |
|
|
Good advice of course, thank you. When my Firestar is completed I will seek out someone in this area with a two place Kolb and see if I can get some familiarization and indoctrination.
I had one brief flight in a Twinstar or Mark 3 many years ago, but it was just a ride with no actual stick time. The speeds, takeoff and landing distances, and general "buoyancy" of that airplane (with two heavy people aboard) seemed about like the Taylorcraft I had at the time. But we did not do any sudden power reductions, and he did not demonstrate anything having to do with the high thrust line, so I do not have any useful experience to compare.
As far as the video referenced earlier in this thread.... so it appears that it was indeed the "wingover" maneuver that has caused the discomfort and concern Herb and others are feeling? Was there any other instance of the "overconfidence" or recklessness that I have missed?
Once again, what I am hearing is that the guy in the video has 20+ years in Kolbs (almost as much as John and other highly experienced Kolbers), and his wingover maneuver was seen by some as being very reckless. What ELSE happened (besides that wingover) that has people so upset? A comment was made about the over-confidence of the buyer (not the guy flying in the video). What did the buyer do that has people thinking he is being reckless or irresponsible?
Bill Berle
www.ezflaphandle.com - safety & performance upgrade for light aircraft
www.grantstar.net - winning proposals for non-profit and for-profit entities
--------------------------------------------
On Tue, 5/3/16, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> wrote:
Subject: RE: snow what???
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Tuesday, May 3, 2016, 1:17 PM
"John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
You are missing somethings.
All Kolb models are very maneuverable aircraft. They
are a lot of fun to fly. They are not rated for
aerobatics, but will do most aerobatic maneuvers with ease.
The two most agile models of Kolbs are the Slingshot and the
Firefly, because of their short wing span, primarily.
The long wing models are slower to role, but, as Homer Kolb
explained to me many years ago when I was complaining about
how slow they rolled, "Be gentle and the aircraft will do
what you want it to do."
Many Kolb pilots never experience any maneuver more than
straight and level and slow turns. By pushing the
limits of the Kolb I learned how to better fly it,
especially when I got myself into serious wind and weather
problems. One will never know what his Kolb will do
unless he pushes out of his comfort zone a little.
I find it very disappointing and sad that many Kolb owners
think they can fly without instruction and/or
indoctrination. We have lost a lot of Kolb people
because of ego and stupidity. It is not
necessary. I guess it is very similar to jumping in
the water over your head and not knowing how to swim, but
have heard how, read the manual, jump in and drown.
Not recommending anyone do as I do. Simply expressing
how I have experienced my Kolbs over the years.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
--
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Herbgh(at)nctc.com
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 1:24 pm Post subject: snow what??? |
|
|
I am in contact with another guy on the field who witnessed the accident and who did the test flight,sent me the video, (do not ask for it is restricted.) ...and he is not hopeful...!! And I am looking at emails that have been exchanged by several others who saw it...most are discouraged... absolutely no instincts that are necessary for take off , let alone landing!
I sent the wife and kids ...widow/orphan message...to him... as thick as I could , no holds barred!!
I feel as if I am witnessing someone's death in slow motion... Herb
On 05/03/2016 03:25 PM, Larry Cottrell wrote:
| Quote: |
On Tue, May 3, 2016 at 12:44 PM, Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com (Herbgh(at)nctc.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> Kolb-List message posted by: Herb <[url=mailto:Herbgh(at)nctc.com]Herbgh(at)nctc.com (Herbgh(at)nctc.com)[/url]>
Up shot...the new owner put it on its back..and did considerable damage which the club members (a lot of expertise in that club!!) have repaired..to the extent that the repair is hardly noticeable...
To be honest, after all that I have heard,, it would have been great if it was not fixable!!!
We have developed a plan to help save this guy.... lets hope.... (wife and kids are last resort!!) Herb
| Quote: | | ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ |
|
I'm not sure what you are so worried about. If the guy had it on its back already, he should be getting the message, don't you think? Nothing like a little personal up close experience to tell a guy what he does and does not know. Sounds like a great bunch of guy's that would help him put it back together. I am sure that he will now be open to suggestions.
Larry
--
The older I get, the less tolerant I am of those who are intolerant of others.
If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending.
--
Signature text; Fort Marcy Park? Sure...Mr. Foster...Third red light and turn left.
|
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Herbgh(at)nctc.com
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 1:39 pm Post subject: snow what??? |
|
|
Bill
His experience was in flying powered parachutes!! and he put it over
on its back.....If he had gotten in the air...witnesses said that he
would be dead or severely injured..
Lucky as it was...
Looking at the flying video again... I think the pilot was just fine
with his flying...more hot doggy than me...but lots more experience
too...also...a ballistic chute has been installed.. Might have added
some confidence flying a newly built firefly... Normally, test
flying a new plane,,,I hold my breath for the few minutes I am in the
air....close my eyes and land...something on that order!
Our planes are strong...and this guy walked away...so did the warp
drive prop.... Herb
On 05/03/2016 03:59 PM, Bill Berle wrote:
[quote]
Good advice of course, thank you. When my Firestar is completed I will seek out someone in this area with a two place Kolb and see if I can get some familiarization and indoctrination.
I had one brief flight in a Twinstar or Mark 3 many years ago, but it was just a ride with no actual stick time. The speeds, takeoff and landing distances, and general "buoyancy" of that airplane (with two heavy people aboard) seemed about like the Taylorcraft I had at the time. But we did not do any sudden power reductions, and he did not demonstrate anything having to do with the high thrust line, so I do not have any useful experience to compare.
As far as the video referenced earlier in this thread.... so it appears that it was indeed the "wingover" maneuver that has caused the discomfort and concern Herb and others are feeling? Was there any other instance of the "overconfidence" or recklessness that I have missed?
Once again, what I am hearing is that the guy in the video has 20+ years in Kolbs (almost as much as John and other highly experienced Kolbers), and his wingover maneuver was seen by some as being very reckless. What ELSE happened (besides that wingover) that has people so upset? A comment was made about the over-confidence of the buyer (not the guy flying in the video). What did the buyer do that has people thinking he is being reckless or irresponsible?
Bill Berle
www.ezflaphandle.com - safety & performance upgrade for light aircraft
www.grantstar.net - winning proposals for non-profit and for-profit entities
--------------------------------------------
On Tue, 5/3/16, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> wrote:
Subject: RE: snow what???
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Tuesday, May 3, 2016, 1:17 PM
"John Hauck" <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com>
You are missing somethings.
All Kolb models are very maneuverable aircraft. They
are a lot of fun to fly. They are not rated for
aerobatics, but will do most aerobatic maneuvers with ease.
The two most agile models of Kolbs are the Slingshot and the
Firefly, because of their short wing span, primarily.
The long wing models are slower to role, but, as Homer Kolb
explained to me many years ago when I was complaining about
how slow they rolled, "Be gentle and the aircraft will do
what you want it to do."
Many Kolb pilots never experience any maneuver more than
straight and level and slow turns. By pushing the
limits of the Kolb I learned how to better fly it,
especially when I got myself into serious wind and weather
problems. One will never know what his Kolb will do
unless he pushes out of his comfort zone a little.
I find it very disappointing and sad that many Kolb owners
think they can fly without instruction and/or
indoctrination. We have lost a lot of Kolb people
because of ego and stupidity. It is not
necessary. I guess it is very similar to jumping in
the water over your head and not knowing how to swim, but
have heard how, read the manual, jump in and drown.
Not recommending anyone do as I do. Simply expressing
how I have experienced my Kolbs over the years.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
--
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
John Hauck
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)
|
| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 1:51 pm Post subject: snow what??? |
|
|
I only have control over one person, me, and not all the time.
Certainly do not have control over anyone else.
If I sell an airplane to an individual, I have no responsibility or control of what he or she may do with it. Hope your customer does not harm or kill himself. However, if he does, you have no control over that. He will not be the first, nor will he be the last. Some folks are built that way.
The man has been warned. What else can you do? I don't know.
One thing for sure, the airplane seems to fly well and did not fall out of the sky, nor did the engine quit.
BTW: I like the subject line.  (
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Herb
Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2016 4:24 PM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: snow what???
I am in contact with another guy on the field who witnessed the accident and who did the test flight,sent me the video, (do not ask for it is restricted.) ...and he is not hopeful...!! And I am looking at emails that have been exchanged by several others who saw it...most are discouraged... absolutely no instincts that are necessary for take off , let alone landing!
I sent the wife and kids ...widow/orphan message...to him... as thick as I could , no holds barred!!
I feel as if I am witnessing someone's death in slow motion... Herb
On 05/03/2016 03:25 PM, Larry Cottrell wrote:
| Quote: |
On Tue, May 3, 2016 at 12:44 PM, Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com (Herbgh(at)nctc.com)> wrote:
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com (Herbgh(at)nctc.com)>
Up shot...the new owner put it on its back..and did considerable damage which the club members (a lot of expertise in that club!!) have repaired..to the extent that the repair is hardly noticeable...
To be honest, after all that I have heard,, it would have been great if it was not fixable!!!
We have developed a plan to help save this guy.... lets hope.... (wife and kids are last resort!!) Herb
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm not sure what you are so worried about. If the guy had it on its back already, he should be getting the message, don't you think? Nothing like a little personal up close experience to tell a guy what he does and does not know. Sounds like a great bunch of guy's that would help him put it back together. I am sure that he will now be open to suggestions.
Larry
--
The older I get, the less tolerant I am of those who are intolerant of others.
If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending.
|
| Quote: | | -- Signature text; Fort Marcy Park? Sure...Mr. Foster...Third red light and turn left. |
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
|
_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 2:21 pm Post subject: snow what??? |
|
|
There is no accident or "over on its back" shown in that video... what "accident" is everyone talking about?
What did the buyer do?
I am seriously missing some big part of this story that nobody is mentioning. Now I hear that a video of something else is restricted or top secret.... what happened in this video?
Bill Berle
www.ezflaphandle.com - safety & performance upgrade for light aircraft
www.grantstar.net - winning proposals for non-profit and for-profit entities
--------------------------------------------
On Tue, 5/3/16, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> wrote:
Subject: RE: snow what???
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Tuesday, May 3, 2016, 2:50 PM
#yiv4496894905
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#yiv4496894905 I only have control over one
person, me, and not all the time. Certainly do not have control over
anyone else. If I sell an airplane to an
individual, I have no responsibility or control of what he
or she may do with it. Hope your customer does not harm or
kill himself. However, if he does, you have no control
over that. He will not be the first, nor will he be the
last. Some folks are built that way. The man has been warned. What
else can you do? I don't know. One thing for sure, the airplane
seems to fly well and did not fall out of the sky, nor did
the engine quit. BTW: I like the subject line.
( john hmkIIITitus, Alabama From:
owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf
Of Herb
Sent: Tuesday, May 03,
2016 4:24 PM
To:
kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re:
snow what??? I am in contact with another
guy on the field who witnessed the accident and who did the
test flight,sent me the video, (do not ask for it is
restricted.) ...and he is not hopeful...!! And I am
looking at emails that have been exchanged by several others
who saw it...most are discouraged... absolutely no instincts
that are necessary for take off , let alone landing!
I sent the wife and kids
...widow/orphan message...to him... as thick as I could , no
holds barred!!
I feel
as if I am witnessing someone's death in slow motion...
Herb On 05/03/2016 03:25 PM, Larry
Cottrell wrote: On Tue, May 3, 2016 at 12:44
PM, Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
wrote:--> Kolb-List
message posted by: Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Up
shot...the new owner put it on its back..and did
considerable damage which the club members (a lot of
expertise in that club!!) have repaired..to the extent that
the repair is hardly noticeable...
To be
honest, after all that I have heard,, it would have been
great if it was not fixable!!!
We have developed a plan to help save this
guy.... lets hope.... (wife and kids are last resort!!)
Herb------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ I'm not sure what you are
so worried about. If the guy had it on its back already, he
should be getting the message, don't you think? Nothing
like a little personal up close experience to tell a guy
what he does and does not know. Sounds like a great bunch of
guy's that would help him put it back together. I am
sure that he will now be open to
suggestions.Larry
--
The older I
get, the less tolerant I am of those who are intolerant of
others. If you forward this email,
or any part of it, please remove my email address before
sending.
-- Signature text; Fort
Marcy Park? Sure...Mr. Foster...Third red light and turn
left.
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Herbgh(at)nctc.com
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 2:36 pm Post subject: snow what??? |
|
|
I have been so upset that subject line is the last thing on my mind...!
You think like my Southern Baptist Minister...flew 20 years in Tanzania...supporting the ministry over there...
I called him and he said pretty much the same....
May have missed your calling , John!
did you notice that the Warp prop stopped the engine dead when the plane went over....with no damage? Father....a miracle?? Herb
On 05/03/2016 04:50 PM, John Hauck wrote:
| Quote: | <![endif]--> <![endif]-->
I only have control over one person, me, and not all the time.
Certainly do not have control over anyone else.
If I sell an airplane to an individual, I have no responsibility or control of what he or she may do with it. Hope your customer does not harm or kill himself. However, if he does, you have no control over that. He will not be the first, nor will he be the last. Some folks are built that way.
The man has been warned. What else can you do? I don't know.
One thing for sure, the airplane seems to fly well and did not fall out of the sky, nor did the engine quit.
BTW: I like the subject line. (
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of Herb
Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2016 4:24 PM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com (kolb-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: snow what???
I am in contact with another guy on the field who witnessed the accident and who did the test flight,sent me the video, (do not ask for it is restricted.) ...and he is not hopeful...!! And I am looking at emails that have been exchanged by several others who saw it...most are discouraged... absolutely no instincts that are necessary for take off , let alone landing!
I sent the wife and kids ...widow/orphan message...to him... as thick as I could , no holds barred!!
I feel as if I am witnessing someone's death in slow motion... Herb
On 05/03/2016 03:25 PM, Larry Cottrell wrote:
| Quote: |
On Tue, May 3, 2016 at 12:44 PM, Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com (Herbgh(at)nctc.com)> wrote:
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com (Herbgh(at)nctc.com)>
Up shot...the new owner put it on its back..and did considerable damage which the club members (a lot of expertise in that club!!) have repaired..to the extent that the repair is hardly noticeable...
To be honest, after all that I have heard,, it would have been great if it was not fixable!!!
We have developed a plan to help save this guy.... lets hope.... (wife and kids are last resort!!) Herb
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm not sure what you are so worried about. If the guy had it on its back already, he should be getting the message, don't you think? Nothing like a little personal up close experience to tell a guy what he does and does not know. Sounds like a great bunch of guy's that would help him put it back together. I am sure that he will now be open to suggestions.
Larry
--
The older I get, the less tolerant I am of those who are intolerant of others.
If you forward this email, or any part of it, please remove my email address before sending.
|
| Quote: | | -- Signature text; Fort Marcy Park? Sure...Mr. Foster...Third red light and turn left. |
--
Signature text; Fort Marcy Park? Sure...Mr. Foster...Third red light and turn left.
|
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John Hauck
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)
|
| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 2:52 pm Post subject: snow what??? |
|
|
Herb:
I understand Sky King put the FF on its back, but have not seen the video.
Not necessary to see the video though. I put my brand new FS on its back when the 447 failed and I landed in a cotton field. I know what it looks like from the driver's seat.
My Dad was a Baptist preacher. I never wanted to be one.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Herb
Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2016 5:35 PM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: snow what???
I have been so upset that subject line is the last thing on my mind...!
You think like my Southern Baptist Minister...flew 20 years in Tanzania...supporting the ministry over there...
I called him and he said pretty much the same....
May have missed your calling , John!
did you notice that the Warp prop stopped the engine dead when the plane went over....with no damage? Father....a miracle?? Herb | Quote: | | k? Sure...Mr. Foster...Third red light and turn left. |
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_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama |
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|
victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 3:00 pm Post subject: snow what??? |
|
|
Any English speaking people here?
This may be the fourth or fifth time I've asked... what exactly happened that got everyone so !)$(% upset at the new owner of Herb's Firefly?
Bill Berle
www.ezflaphandle.com - safety & performance upgrade for light aircraft
www.grantstar.net - winning proposals for non-profit and for-profit entities
--------------------------------------------
On Tue, 5/3/16, Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> wrote:
Subject: Re: snow what???
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Tuesday, May 3, 2016, 3:34 PM
I have been so upset that subject line is the last thing
on my
mind...!
You think like my Southern Baptist Minister...flew 20
years in
Tanzania...supporting the ministry over there...
I called him and he said pretty much the same....
May have missed your calling , John!
did you notice that the Warp prop stopped the engine
dead when the
plane went over....with no damage? Father....a
miracle?? Herb
On 05/03/2016 04:50 PM,
John Hauck
wrote:
#yiv5329024951
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I
only have control over one person, me, and not
all the time.
Certainly
do not have control over anyone else.
If
I sell an airplane to an individual, I have no
responsibility or control of what he or she may
do with it.
Hope your customer does not harm or kill
himself. However,
if he does, you have no control over that. He
will not be
the first, nor will he be the last. Some folks
are built
that way.
The
man has been warned. What else can you do? I
don't know.
One
thing for sure, the airplane seems to fly well
and did not
fall out of the sky, nor did the engine
quit.
BTW:
I like the subject line. (
john
h
mkIII
Titus,
Alabama
From:
owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com]
On
Behalf Of Herb
Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2016 4:24
PM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: snow
what???
I am in
contact with another guy on the field who
witnessed the
accident and who did the test flight,sent me the
video, (do
not ask for it is restricted.) ...and he is
not
hopeful...!! And I am looking at emails that
have been
exchanged by several others who saw it...most are
discouraged... absolutely no instincts that are
necessary for
take off , let alone landing!
I sent the wife and kids ...widow/orphan
message...to him...
as thick as I could , no holds barred!!
I feel as if I am witnessing someone's
death in slow
motion... Herb
On 05/03/2016
03:25 PM, Larry Cottrell
wrote:
On Tue,
May 3, 2016 at 12:44 PM,
Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
wrote:
-->
Kolb-List message posted by:
Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Up shot...the new owner put it on its
back..and did
considerable damage which the club members
(a lot of
expertise in that club!!) have
repaired..to the extent
that the repair is hardly noticeable...
To be honest, after all that I have
heard,, it would
have been great if it was not fixable!!!
We have developed a plan to help save
this guy....
lets hope.... (wife and kids are last
resort!!) Herb
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm
not sure what you are so
worried about. If the guy had it on its
back
already, he should be getting the
message, don't you
think? Nothing like a little personal up
close
experience to tell a guy what he does
and does not
know. Sounds like a great bunch of
guy's that would
help him put it back together. I am sure
that he
will now be open to suggestions.
Larry
--
The older I
get, the less
tolerant I am of those who
are
intolerant of
others.
If you forward this
email, or any part of it,
please remove
my email address before
sending.
--
Signature text; Fort Marcy Park? Sure...Mr.
Foster...Third red light and turn left.
--
Signature text; Fort Marcy Park? Sure...Mr. Foster...Third
red light and turn left.
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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|
lcottrell
Joined: 29 May 2006
Posts: 1494
Location: Jordan Valley, Or
|
| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 3:03 pm Post subject: snow what??? |
|
|
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Bill Berle <victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.net (victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.net)>There is no accident or "over on its back" shown in that video... what "accident" is everyone talking about?What did the buyer do?I am seriously missing some big part of this story that nobody is mentioning. Now I hear that a video of something else is restricted or top secret.... what happened in this video?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
perhaps you are not getting all the messages. Sometimes that happens, no one has so far explained why. I subscribe to the individual messages and the Digest as well. That way I can see if I am missing something. It just sometimes happens.
This is apparently what you are missing-
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: snow what??? I am in contact with another guy on the field who witnessed the accident and who did the test flight,sent me the video, (do not ask for it is restricted.) ...and he is not hopeful...!! And I am looking at emails that have been exchanged by several others who saw it...most are discouraged... absolutely no instincts that are necessary for take off , let alone landing!
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Larry
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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do not archive |
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Herbgh(at)nctc.com
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 3:46 pm Post subject: snow what??? |
|
|
Bill
Just in case...this vid shows the maiden flight of the Firefly...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmmXDbhcTwY&feature=youtu.be
and viewing it again...I see nothing in the maneuvers that
alarm....he did a hands off...and I noticed a slight nose down...which
is good...he did some slow flight prior to landing and some hot dogging
of sorts for the audience ...which is not in my repertoire but fine
in our little birds... Makes me want to try them though... Ain't
dead yet!! Herb
On 05/03/2016 05:59 PM, Bill Berle wrote:
| Quote: |
Any English speaking people here?
This may be the fourth or fifth time I've asked... what exactly happened that got everyone so !)$(% upset at the new owner of Herb's Firefly?
Bill Berle
www.ezflaphandle.com - safety & performance upgrade for light aircraft
www.grantstar.net - winning proposals for non-profit and for-profit entities
--------------------------------------------
On Tue, 5/3/16, Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com> wrote:
Subject: Re: snow what???
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Tuesday, May 3, 2016, 3:34 PM
I have been so upset that subject line is the last thing
on my
mind...!
You think like my Southern Baptist Minister...flew 20
years in
Tanzania...supporting the ministry over there...
I called him and he said pretty much the same....
May have missed your calling , John!
did you notice that the Warp prop stopped the engine
dead when the
plane went over....with no damage? Father....a
miracle?? Herb
On 05/03/2016 04:50 PM,
John Hauck
wrote:
#yiv5329024951
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I
only have control over one person, me, and not
all the time.
Certainly
do not have control over anyone else.
If
I sell an airplane to an individual, I have no
responsibility or control of what he or she may
do with it.
Hope your customer does not harm or kill
himself. However,
if he does, you have no control over that. He
will not be
the first, nor will he be the last. Some folks
are built
that way.
The
man has been warned. What else can you do? I
don't know.
One
thing for sure, the airplane seems to fly well
and did not
fall out of the sky, nor did the engine
quit.
BTW:
I like the subject line. (
john
h
mkIII
Titus,
Alabama
From:
owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com]
On
Behalf Of Herb
Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2016 4:24
PM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: snow
what???
I am in
contact with another guy on the field who
witnessed the
accident and who did the test flight,sent me the
video, (do
not ask for it is restricted.) ...and he is
not
hopeful...!! And I am looking at emails that
have been
exchanged by several others who saw it...most are
discouraged... absolutely no instincts that are
necessary for
take off , let alone landing!
I sent the wife and kids ...widow/orphan
message...to him...
as thick as I could , no holds barred!!
I feel as if I am witnessing someone's
death in slow
motion... Herb
On 05/03/2016
03:25 PM, Larry Cottrell
wrote:
On Tue,
May 3, 2016 at 12:44 PM,
Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
wrote:
-->
Kolb-List message posted by:
Herb <Herbgh(at)nctc.com>
Up shot...the new owner put it on its
back..and did
considerable damage which the club members
(a lot of
expertise in that club!!) have
repaired..to the extent
that the repair is hardly noticeable...
To be honest, after all that I have
heard,, it would
have been great if it was not fixable!!!
We have developed a plan to help save
this guy....
lets hope.... (wife and kids are last
resort!!) Herb
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm
not sure what you are so
worried about. If the guy had it on its
back
already, he should be getting the
message, don't you
think? Nothing like a little personal up
close
experience to tell a guy what he does
and does not
know. Sounds like a great bunch of
guy's that would
help him put it back together. I am sure
that he
will now be open to suggestions.
Larry
--
The older I
get, the less
tolerant I am of those who
are
intolerant of
others.
If you forward this
email, or any part of it,
please remove
my email address before
sending.
--
Signature text; Fort Marcy Park? Sure...Mr.
Foster...Third red light and turn left.
--
Signature text; Fort Marcy Park? Sure...Mr. Foster...Third
red light and turn left.
|
--
Signature text; Fort Marcy Park? Sure...Mr. Foster...Third red light and turn left.
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http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
|
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| Back to top |
|
|
pc.king(at)comcast.net
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue May 03, 2016 4:54 pm Post subject: snow what??? |
|
|
That the pilot flies sailplanes could explain what you see as extreme
maneuvers in the video. A 45 degree bank is normal in a sailplane when you
are trying to fly in the core of a thermal. A pullup to wings vertical is a
fast way to reverse direction when you have flown out of the core. This
pilot found himself in a plane with a crisp roll rate and enjoyed it.
---
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