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nickc(at)mtaonline.net
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 Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 12:17 am Post subject: KievProp... |
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Kolbers,
I have a new KievProp sitting in a box, and hope to be utilizing it soon. Never heard anything bad about them, when I was doing my research, a while back.
For what it’s worth…
Nick Cassara
Palmer, AK
607AK
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neilsenrm(at)gmail.com
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| Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 7:49 am Post subject: KievProp... |
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Years ago the owner of Great Plains Aircraft (VW engine sales/builder) put PowerFin, IVO, and Warp Drive props on one of his engines. I think it was one of the reduction drive engines. PowerFin gave him the most static thrust and the lightest weight. I have been flying with a PowerFin for better than 15 years and have had good luck with it. Warp Drive has a reputation of being very strong being solid carbon fiber but is heavy which can cause problems with the weaker Rotax gear boxes. I had a 2" X 5/8" bolt go through my PowerFin in flight on a trip. There was damage but the prop got me the remaining 400 miles home.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIICÂ
On Sat, Dec 30, 2017 at 3:16 AM, Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net (nickc(at)mtaonline.net)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> Kolb-List message posted by: Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net (nickc(at)mtaonline.net)>
Kolbers,
I have a new KievProp sitting in a box, and hope to be utilizing it soon. Never heard anything bad about them, when I was doing my research, a while back.
For what it’s worth…
Nick Cassara
Palmer, AK
607AK
====================================
-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
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eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
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errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com
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     -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
====================================
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John Hauck
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)
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| Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 9:14 am Post subject: KievProp... |
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Hi Rick N/Kolbers:
Can you cite me some examples of Warp Drive props causing gear box problems/failures on B or C gear boxes? I personally have not heard of any. Guess I could call Daryl at Warp Drive and get his input.
I put a couple hundred hours on a C gear box, Warp Drive 3 blade, and 582 on my MKIII. Did OK. No problems.
Put about 50 hours on a 3 blade GSC wooden prop with inlaid urethane leading edges. For some reason, which I could never determine, the GSC failed, collecting all three blades on the tail boom. That one cost a lot of work replacing the tail boom which was knocked about 5 degrees out of column. Also slung the starter out of the bell housing. The mounting bolts were still in the engine case. In addition, slung the carbs out of their sockets.Â
I have attached a couple photos of a GSC and a Warp Drive blade grip. Not a whole lot keeping the GSC from slinging a blade. Look closely and you can see the individual carbon fibers which loop around a steel ring. We dissected these two grips to see how they were made. The Warp Drive was on a friend's RANs S-12 which got away from him when he cranked it while standing outside the aircraft. Had been working on carbs and forgot the throttle was wide open. There were no wings on the aircraft powered by a 912. The RANs went about a quarter mile when it hit a berm and launched skyward through a patch of planted pine trees, truck diameter about a foot.  The Warp Drive blade cut halfway through the trunk before it broke. I have never seen how any of the other brands of popular props are constructed.
I have flown Kolb Factory aircraft with IVO props on two and four stroke engines. They performed ok in the traffic pattern, but don't know how they would do on a long cross country. I do know that they are not very durable.
Kolb aircraft, being pushers, are eventually going to have something fall off the engine or airframe. When it does, it is likely going through the prop.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Rick Neilsen
Sent: Saturday, December 30, 2017 9:49 AM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: KievProp...
Years ago the owner of Great Plains Aircraft (VW engine sales/builder) put PowerFin, IVO, and Warp Drive props on one of his engines. I think it was one of the reduction drive engines. PowerFin gave him the most static thrust and the lightest weight. I have been flying with a PowerFin for better than 15 years and have had good luck with it. Warp Drive has a reputation of being very strong being solid carbon fiber but is heavy which can cause problems with the weaker Rotax gear boxes. I had a 2" X 5/8" bolt go through my PowerFin in flight on a trip. There was damage but the prop got me the remaining 400 miles home.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
On Sat, Dec 30, 2017 at 3:16 AM, Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net (nickc(at)mtaonline.net)> wrote:
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net (nickc(at)mtaonline.net)>
Kolbers,
I have a new KievProp sitting in a box, and hope to be utilizing it soon. Never heard anything bad about them, when I was doing my research, a while back.
For what it’s worth…
Nick Cassara
Palmer, AK
607AK
====================================
-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
====================================
FORUMS -
eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
===========
WIKI -
errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com
===========
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
====================================
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama |
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ceengland7(at)gmail.com
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| Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 9:27 am Post subject: KievProp... |
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On the issue of prop mass vs gearbox: I'm pretty sure I've seen specs in
Rotax documents that specify max prop mass moment of inertia for each of
their boxes. Shouldn't be too difficult to find the number for a particular
gearbox, and compare to the prop's MMI. In case anyone's wondering, yes,
it's real thing, and serious stuff. I have no idea about any particular
combination, but if you're contemplating a new combination, it's certainly
worth checking, especially if the new prop is significantly heavier than
typically used props for that particular gearbox model.
Charlie
(You're probably pretty safe if using the same combination that John's been
using....)
On Sat, Dec 30, 2017 at 11:14 AM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> wrote:
[quote] Hi Rick N/Kolbers:
Can you cite me some examples of Warp Drive props causing gear box
problems/failures on B or C gear boxes? I personally have not heard of
any. Guess I could call Daryl at Warp Drive and get his input.
I put a couple hundred hours on a C gear box, Warp Drive 3 blade, and 582
on my MKIII. Did OK. No problems.
Put about 50 hours on a 3 blade GSC wooden prop with inlaid urethane
leading edges. For some reason, which I could never determine, the GSC
failed, collecting all three blades on the tail boom. That one cost a lot
of work replacing the tail boom which was knocked about 5 degrees out of
column. Also slung the starter out of the bell housing. The mounting
bolts were still in the engine case. In addition, slung the carbs out of
their sockets.
I have attached a couple photos of a GSC and a Warp Drive blade grip. Not
a whole lot keeping the GSC from slinging a blade. Look closely and you
can see the individual carbon fibers which loop around a steel ring. We
dissected these two grips to see how they were made. The Warp Drive was on
a friend's RANs S-12 which got away from him when he cranked it while
standing outside the aircraft. Had been working on carbs and forgot the
throttle was wide open. There were no wings on the aircraft powered by a
912. The RANs went about a quarter mile when it hit a berm and launched
skyward through a patch of planted pine trees, truck diameter about a
foot. The Warp Drive blade cut halfway through the trunk before it broke
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
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gdhelton(at)gmail.com
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 9:44 am Post subject: KievProp... |
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Found this regarding the subject on Rotax recommendations on MMII ran Ivoprops for many years without any prop issues. We did have problems with wave washers failing in the early B gearboxes.
Low MOMENT-OF-INERTIA in a propeller means faster spool-DOWN time, letting a CLUTCHed prop stop sooner! Rotax has set a limit for how much inertial mass is allowable on the B, C & E Gearboxes. On the A/B-box they want propellers with no more than 3,000 kg/cm2. A 72" – 3-blade Ivoprop Ultralight propeller is about 4,500 kg/cm2. The same Warp Drive is over 10,000 kg/cm2. POWERFIN Propellers are 2,500 kg/cm2 for a big three-blade model and 1,800 kg/cm2 for a two- blade model. POWERFIN is the only U.S. manufacturer to have addressed this issue and met the challenge of designing a very durable, low inertia propeller for the Rotax gearboxes!
George H.
1986 Firestar, FS100
14GDH
Mesick, Michigan
gdhelton(at)gmail.com (gdhelton(at)gmail.com)
Sent from my iPhone
On Dec 30, 2017, at 12:27 PM, Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com (ceengland7(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | On the issue of prop mass vs gearbox: I'm pretty sure I've seen specs in Rotax documents that specify max prop mass moment of inertia for each of their boxes. Shouldn't be too difficult to find the number for a particular gearbox, and compare to the prop's MMI. In case anyone's wondering, yes, it's real thing, and serious stuff. I have no idea about any particular combination, but if you're contemplating a new combination, it's certainly worth checking, especially if the new prop is significantly heavier than typically used props for that particular gearbox model.
Charlie
(You're probably pretty safe if using the same combination that John's been using....)
On Sat, Dec 30, 2017 at 11:14 AM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)> wrote:
| Quote: |
Hi Rick N/Kolbers:
Can you cite me some examples of Warp Drive props causing gear box problems/failures on B or C gear boxes? I personally have not heard of any. Guess I could call Daryl at Warp Drive and get his input.
I put a couple hundred hours on a C gear box, Warp Drive 3 blade, and 582 on my MKIII. Did OK. No problems.
Put about 50 hours on a 3 blade GSC wooden prop with inlaid urethane leading edges. For some reason, which I could never determine, the GSC failed, collecting all three blades on the tail boom. That one cost a lot of work replacing the tail boom which was knocked about 5 degrees out of column. Also slung the starter out of the bell housing. The mounting bolts were still in the engine case. In addition, slung the carbs out of their sockets.
I have attached a couple photos of a GSC and a Warp Drive blade grip. Not a whole lot keeping the GSC from slinging a blade. Look closely and you can see the individual carbon fibers which loop around a steel ring. We dissected these two grips to see how they were made. The Warp Drive was on a friend's RANs S-12 which got away from him when he cranked it while standing outside the aircraft. Had been working on carbs and forgot the throttle was wide open. There were no wings on the aircraft powered by a 912. The RANs went about a quarter mile when it hit a berm and launched skyward through a patch of planted pine trees, truck diameter about a foot. The Warp Drive blade cut halfway through the trunk before it broke. I have never seen how any of the other brands of popular props are constructed.
I have flown Kolb Factory aircraft with IVO props on two and four stroke engines. They performed ok in the traffic pattern, but don't know how they would do on a long cross country. I do know that they are not very durable.
Kolb aircraft, being pushers, are eventually going to have something fall off the engine or airframe. When it does, it is likely going through the prop.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of Rick Neilsen
Sent: Saturday, December 30, 2017 9:49 AM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com (kolb-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: KievProp..
Years ago the owner of Great Plains Aircraft (VW engine sales/builder) put PowerFin, IVO, and Warp Drive props on one of his engines. I think it was one of the reduction drive engines. PowerFin gave him the most static thrust and the lightest weight. I have been flying with a PowerFin for better than 15 years and have had good luck with it. Warp Drive has a reputation of being very strong being solid carbon fiber but is heavy which can cause problems with the weaker Rotax gear boxes. I had a 2" X 5/8" bolt go through my PowerFin in flight on a trip. There was damage but the prop got me the remaining 400 miles home.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
On Sat, Dec 30, 2017 at 3:16 AM, Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net (nickc(at)mtaonline.net)> wrote:
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net (nickc(at)mtaonline.net)>
Kolbers,
I have a new KievProp sitting in a box, and hope to be utilizing it soon. Never heard anything bad about them, when I was doing my research, a while back.
For what it’s worth…
Nick Cassara
Palmer, AK
607AK
====================================
-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
===========
FORUMS -
eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
===========
WIKI -
errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com
===========
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
====================================
|
 Virus-free. www.avast.com [url=#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2][/url]
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gdhelton(at)gmail.com
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 9:59 am Post subject: KievProp... |
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Here’s a link to Rotax gearbox info.
http://www.e-props.fr/16/MOI/rotax_MOI.pdf
George H.
1986 Firestar, FS100
14GDH
Mesick, Michigan
Do not archive Sent from my iPhone
On Dec 30, 2017, at 12:27 PM, Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com (ceengland7(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | On the issue of prop mass vs gearbox: I'm pretty sure I've seen specs in Rotax documents that specify max prop mass moment of inertia for each of their boxes. Shouldn't be too difficult to find the number for a particular gearbox, and compare to the prop's MMI. In case anyone's wondering, yes, it's real thing, and serious stuff. I have no idea about any particular combination, but if you're contemplating a new combination, it's certainly worth checking, especially if the new prop is significantly heavier than typically used props for that particular gearbox model.
Charlie
(You're probably pretty safe if using the same combination that John's been using....)
On Sat, Dec 30, 2017 at 11:14 AM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)> wrote:
| Quote: |
Hi Rick N/Kolbers:
Can you cite me some examples of Warp Drive props causing gear box problems/failures on B or C gear boxes? I personally have not heard of any. Guess I could call Daryl at Warp Drive and get his input.
I put a couple hundred hours on a C gear box, Warp Drive 3 blade, and 582 on my MKIII. Did OK. No problems.
Put about 50 hours on a 3 blade GSC wooden prop with inlaid urethane leading edges. For some reason, which I could never determine, the GSC failed, collecting all three blades on the tail boom. That one cost a lot of work replacing the tail boom which was knocked about 5 degrees out of column. Also slung the starter out of the bell housing. The mounting bolts were still in the engine case. In addition, slung the carbs out of their sockets.
I have attached a couple photos of a GSC and a Warp Drive blade grip. Not a whole lot keeping the GSC from slinging a blade. Look closely and you can see the individual carbon fibers which loop around a steel ring. We dissected these two grips to see how they were made. The Warp Drive was on a friend's RANs S-12 which got away from him when he cranked it while standing outside the aircraft. Had been working on carbs and forgot the throttle was wide open. There were no wings on the aircraft powered by a 912. The RANs went about a quarter mile when it hit a berm and launched skyward through a patch of planted pine trees, truck diameter about a foot. The Warp Drive blade cut halfway through the trunk before it broke. I have never seen how any of the other brands of popular props are constructed.
I have flown Kolb Factory aircraft with IVO props on two and four stroke engines. They performed ok in the traffic pattern, but don't know how they would do on a long cross country. I do know that they are not very durable.
Kolb aircraft, being pushers, are eventually going to have something fall off the engine or airframe. When it does, it is likely going through the prop.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of Rick Neilsen
Sent: Saturday, December 30, 2017 9:49 AM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com (kolb-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: KievProp...
Years ago the owner of Great Plains Aircraft (VW engine sales/builder) put PowerFin, IVO, and Warp Drive props on one of his engines. I think it was one of the reduction drive engines. PowerFin gave him the most static thrust and the lightest weight. I have been flying with a PowerFin for better than 15 years and have had good luck with it. Warp Drive has a reputation of being very strong being solid carbon fiber but is heavy which can cause problems with the weaker Rotax gear boxes. I had a 2" X 5/8" bolt go through my PowerFin in flight on a trip. There was damage but the prop got me the remaining 400 miles home.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
On Sat, Dec 30, 2017 at 3:16 AM, Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net (nickc(at)mtaonline.net)> wrote:
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net (nickc(at)mtaonline.net)>
Kolbers,
I have a new KievProp sitting in a box, and hope to be utilizing it soon. Never heard anything bad about them, when I was doing my research, a while back.
For what it’s worth…
Nick Cassara
Palmer, AK
607AK
====================================
-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
===========
FORUMS -
eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
===========
WIKI -
errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com
===========
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
====================================
|
Virus-free. www.avast.com [url=#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2][/url]
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neilsenrm(at)gmail.com
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 10:24 am Post subject: KievProp... |
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John
No examples. Just discussions from the Kolb group about the mass of a prop
that some of the rotax gear boxes can handle. No doubt Warp Drive makes a
great prop. Props are a bit like religion, easy to offend someone that owns
one.
Rick
On Sat, Dec 30, 2017 at 12:14 PM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com> wrote:
[quote] Hi Rick N/Kolbers:
Can you cite me some examples of Warp Drive props causing gear box
problems/failures on B or C gear boxes? I personally have not heard of
any. Guess I could call Daryl at Warp Drive and get his input.
I put a couple hundred hours on a C gear box, Warp Drive 3 blade, and 582
on my MKIII. Did OK. No problems.
Put about 50 hours on a 3 blade GSC wooden prop with inlaid urethane
leading edges. For some reason, which I could never determine, the GSC
failed, collecting all three blades on the tail boom. That one cost a lot
of work replacing the tail boom which was knocked about 5 degrees out of
column. Also slung the starter out of the bell housing. The mounting
bolts were still in the engine case. In addition, slung the carbs out of
their sockets.
I have attached a couple photos of a GSC and a Warp Drive blade grip. Not
a whole lot keeping the GSC from slinging a blade. Look closely and you
can see the individual carbon fibers which loop around a steel ring. We
dissected these two grips to see how they were made. The Warp Drive was on
a friend's RANs S-12 which got away from him when he cranked it while
standing outside the aircraft. Had been working on carbs and forgot the
throttle was wide open. There were no wings on the aircraft powered by a
912. The RANs went about a quarter mile when it hit a berm and launched
skyward through a patch of planted pine trees, truck diameter about a
foot. The Warp Drive blade cut halfway through the trunk before it broke
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
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gdhelton(at)gmail.com
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 10:26 am Post subject: KievProp... |
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Just as a point of interest I checked on the Hirth G50/GK50 gearboxes. Rated for 20 to 110 hp engines.They’re rated at 6500kgs/cm3
Sent from my iPhone
On Dec 30, 2017, at 12:27 PM, Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com (ceengland7(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | On the issue of prop mass vs gearbox: I'm pretty sure I've seen specs in Rotax documents that specify max prop mass moment of inertia for each of their boxes. Shouldn't be too difficult to find the number for a particular gearbox, and compare to the prop's MMI. In case anyone's wondering, yes, it's real thing, and serious stuff. I have no idea about any particular combination, but if you're contemplating a new combination, it's certainly worth checking, especially if the new prop is significantly heavier than typically used props for that particular gearbox model.
Charlie
(You're probably pretty safe if using the same combination that John's been using....)
On Sat, Dec 30, 2017 at 11:14 AM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)> wrote:
| Quote: |
Hi Rick N/Kolbers:
Can you cite me some examples of Warp Drive props causing gear box problems/failures on B or C gear boxes? I personally have not heard of any. Guess I could call Daryl at Warp Drive and get his input.
I put a couple hundred hours on a C gear box, Warp Drive 3 blade, and 582 on my MKIII. Did OK. No problems.
Put about 50 hours on a 3 blade GSC wooden prop with inlaid urethane leading edges. For some reason, which I could never determine, the GSC failed, collecting all three blades on the tail boom. That one cost a lot of work replacing the tail boom which was knocked about 5 degrees out of column. Also slung the starter out of the bell housing. The mounting bolts were still in the engine case. In addition, slung the carbs out of their sockets.
I have attached a couple photos of a GSC and a Warp Drive blade grip. Not a whole lot keeping the GSC from slinging a blade. Look closely and you can see the individual carbon fibers which loop around a steel ring. We dissected these two grips to see how they were made. The Warp Drive was on a friend's RANs S-12 which got away from him when he cranked it while standing outside the aircraft. Had been working on carbs and forgot the throttle was wide open. There were no wings on the aircraft powered by a 912. The RANs went about a quarter mile when it hit a berm and launched skyward through a patch of planted pine trees, truck diameter about a foot. The Warp Drive blade cut halfway through the trunk before it broke. I have never seen how any of the other brands of popular props are constructed.
I have flown Kolb Factory aircraft with IVO props on two and four stroke engines. They performed ok in the traffic pattern, but don't know how they would do on a long cross country. I do know that they are not very durable.
Kolb aircraft, being pushers, are eventually going to have something fall off the engine or airframe. When it does, it is likely going through the prop.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of Rick Neilsen
Sent: Saturday, December 30, 2017 9:49 AM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com (kolb-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: KievProp...
Years ago the owner of Great Plains Aircraft (VW engine sales/builder) put PowerFin, IVO, and Warp Drive props on one of his engines. I think it was one of the reduction drive engines. PowerFin gave him the most static thrust and the lightest weight. I have been flying with a PowerFin for better than 15 years and have had good luck with it. Warp Drive has a reputation of being very strong being solid carbon fiber but is heavy which can cause problems with the weaker Rotax gear boxes. I had a 2" X 5/8" bolt go through my PowerFin in flight on a trip. There was damage but the prop got me the remaining 400 miles home.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
On Sat, Dec 30, 2017 at 3:16 AM, Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net (nickc(at)mtaonline.net)> wrote:
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net (nickc(at)mtaonline.net)>
Kolbers,
I have a new KievProp sitting in a box, and hope to be utilizing it soon. Never heard anything bad about them, when I was doing my research, a while back.
For what it’s worth…
Nick Cassara
Palmer, AK
607AK
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gdhelton(at)gmail.com
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| Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 10:32 am Post subject: KievProp... |
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Yeah, you’re right there, Rick. But, I think it is a good subject if it forces me to look up a few facts. George PS: enjoy the warmth down there. It’s 12 above up here.
George H.
1986 Firestar, FS100
14GDH
Mesick, Michigan
Sent from my iPhone
On Dec 30, 2017, at 1:23 PM, Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com (neilsenrm(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | John
No examples. Just discussions from the Kolb group about the mass of a prop that some of the rotax gear boxes can handle. No doubt Warp Drive makes a great prop. Props are a bit like religion, easy to offend someone that owns one.
Rick
On Sat, Dec 30, 2017 at 12:14 PM, John Hauck <jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com (jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com)> wrote:
| Quote: |
Hi Rick N/Kolbers:
Can you cite me some examples of Warp Drive props causing gear box problems/failures on B or C gear boxes? I personally have not heard of any. Guess I could call Daryl at Warp Drive and get his input.
I put a couple hundred hours on a C gear box, Warp Drive 3 blade, and 582 on my MKIII. Did OK. No problems.
Put about 50 hours on a 3 blade GSC wooden prop with inlaid urethane leading edges. For some reason, which I could never determine, the GSC failed, collecting all three blades on the tail boom. That one cost a lot of work replacing the tail boom which was knocked about 5 degrees out of column. Also slung the starter out of the bell housing. The mounting bolts were still in the engine case. In addition, slung the carbs out of their sockets.
I have attached a couple photos of a GSC and a Warp Drive blade grip. Not a whole lot keeping the GSC from slinging a blade. Look closely and you can see the individual carbon fibers which loop around a steel ring. We dissected these two grips to see how they were made. The Warp Drive was on a friend's RANs S-12 which got away from him when he cranked it while standing outside the aircraft. Had been working on carbs and forgot the throttle was wide open. There were no wings on the aircraft powered by a 912. The RANs went about a quarter mile when it hit a berm and launched skyward through a patch of planted pine trees, truck diameter about a foot. The Warp Drive blade cut halfway through the trunk before it broke. I have never seen how any of the other brands of popular props are constructed.
I have flown Kolb Factory aircraft with IVO props on two and four stroke engines. They performed ok in the traffic pattern, but don't know how they would do on a long cross country. I do know that they are not very durable.
Kolb aircraft, being pushers, are eventually going to have something fall off the engine or airframe. When it does, it is likely going through the prop.
john h
mkIII
Titus, Alabama
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of Rick Neilsen
Sent: Saturday, December 30, 2017 9:49 AM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com (kolb-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: KievProp...
Years ago the owner of Great Plains Aircraft (VW engine sales/builder) put PowerFin, IVO, and Warp Drive props on one of his engines. I think it was one of the reduction drive engines. PowerFin gave him the most static thrust and the lightest weight. I have been flying with a PowerFin for better than 15 years and have had good luck with it. Warp Drive has a reputation of being very strong being solid carbon fiber but is heavy which can cause problems with the weaker Rotax gear boxes. I had a 2" X 5/8" bolt go through my PowerFin in flight on a trip. There was damage but the prop got me the remaining 400 miles home.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIC
On Sat, Dec 30, 2017 at 3:16 AM, Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net (nickc(at)mtaonline.net)> wrote:
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Nick Cassara <nickc(at)mtaonline.net (nickc(at)mtaonline.net)>
Kolbers,
I have a new KievProp sitting in a box, and hope to be utilizing it soon. Never heard anything bad about them, when I was doing my research, a while back.
For what it’s worth…
Nick Cassara
Palmer, AK
607AK
====================================
-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
====================================
FORUMS -
eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
===========
WIKI -
errer" target="_blank">http://wiki.matronics.com
===========
b Site -
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
====================================
|
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