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PC680 battery

 
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Gary.Leinberger(at)miller
Guest
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 2:05 pm    Post subject: PC680 battery Reply with quote
I just ordered another PC680 for my 912 S Europa. This one lasted almost 5 years. I have had little problem with these batteries, even when using a standard automotive battery charger that brings the battery up to about 13.5 or volts. Lately it has only been able to bring the battery up to 12.8 v and I have been having problems starting, especially when cold. But today was 65 degrees F. so I pulled it out, saw the date on it, and bit the bullet.



Does anyone know of a charger that will charge these batteries properly - normally when cold I turn on my engine block heater and put the charger on the battery to warm it up and I have no problem. However, I did try an Odessey battery charger and it burned up - I was lucky I didn't lose the plane. Odessey was less than helpful and basically blew me off after admitting that charger model had problems. They apparently dropped that model and brought out a new model but I felt a tad nervous about using their charger. Any suggestions?




Gary Leinberger
N388SG
Europa A237
Lancaster, Pa., USA

380 hours.


From: owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com <owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com> on behalf of Europa-List Digest Server <europa-list(at)matronics.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 6, 2019 2:34 AM
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HTML Version:

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----------------------------------------------------------
  Europa-List Digest Archive
  ---
  Total Messages Posted Fri 04/05/19: 3
----------------------------------------------------------


Today's Message Index:
----------------------

1. 01:18 AM - Re: Which battery claims should I believe? (clivesutton)
2. 09:24 AM - Europa Aircraft - location change  (John Wighton)
3. 12:13 PM - Re: Which battery claims should I believe? (JonathanMilbank)



________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________


Time: 01:18:21 AM PST US
Subject: Re: Which battery claims should I believe?
From: "clivesutton" <clive.maf(at)googlemail.com>


Hi Jonathan,

To contribute to to your original question (which is indeed fascinating) i think
the answer may have to do with the internal chemistries/construction of each,
the way each Mfr interprets e.g. CCA and CA testing and their market focus.
I believe that:

Varley have the best Pulse Hot Cranking Amp performance because they are of sealed
bog std lead acid construction. But this comes at the price of life (from
apprenticeship days i recall that the pure lead plates can buckle under continuous
high-amperage discharge and eventually this and sulphation shorts an individual
cell, dropping the battery voltage).

The Odessey and the Tanya are both Absorbed Glass Mat tech - a tech which seems
to offer a better life at the expense of lower Cold-Cranking Performance and
capacity - a kind of compromise. In my view this is perhaps best type suited
to our application given the sometimes lengthy time gaps between use. The 912S's
higher capacity starter motor is rated at 0.9kW at 12v which translates to
a demand of 300A for 1 sec and then 75A for the remainder to the maximum 10-second
start cycle. So providing the battery cabling is short and 4SWG/16mm2
those were the reasons for my choice of the Odessey battery.

Whilst Odessey list Aircraft use as an application, Tanya seem to list the EC680
as predominantly a Motorcycle battery. Even more curious is that Tanya will
sell both batteries - with the EC680 being 20 cheaper. Vibration durability
perhaps?

https://www.tayna.co.uk/industrial-batteries/odyssey/pc680/?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI7uHf9L244QIVz5TtCh17tgzhEAQYAiABEgKa3fD_BwE

https://www.tayna.co.uk/motorcycle-batteries/enduroline/ec680/

There is also a lot of re-badging going on in the battery world and i wonder if
the PC680/EC680 is an example of that

Hope it can add to the debate . . .


Read this topic online here:

http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=488535#488535


________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________


Time: 09:24:56 AM PST US
Subject: Europa Aircraft - location change
From: "John Wighton" <john(at)wighton.net>


Please see the announcement by Europa.

http://www.europa-aircraft.co.uk/news/item/europa-aircraft-is-moving

--------
John Wighton
Europa XS trigear G-IPOD


Read this topic online here:

http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=488549#488549


________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________


Time: 12:13:16 PM PST US
Subject: Re: Which battery claims should I believe?
From: "JonathanMilbank" <jdmilbank(at)yahoo.co.uk>


Clive, your reply is really helpful and your "re-badging" suggestion is more or
less borne out by a man I spoke to at Tanya, although who's to say whether the
"own brand" EC680 is of just as high a quality as the PC680. The 20 reduction
in price might suggest cheaper components and processes.

So I "bit the bullet" and ordered the Odyssey, after having been beaten into submission
by the overwhelming flood of testimonials in its favour. Thanks to all
for the repeated "lashes with the Odyssey whip". I feel so much better!


Read this topic online here:

http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=488552#488552




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DuaneFamly(at)aol.com
Guest
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 3:38 pm    Post subject: PC680 battery Reply with quote
Hey Gary,
I also run the OdesseyPC 680 to start my Jabiru 3300A. And while I am in the warm city of Las Vegas, it does get very cool here during the winter’s. During that time are use a 3A battery charger made by Schumacher called the Battery Extender. I picked it up at Walmart for about $25. It has several attachment leads that you can plug into it. I have permanently attached the leads that have the ring terminals to mount right onto the battery and then I drilled a small hole through the firewall in the very corner on the passenger side and fed the cable through there. When I’m leaving the plane for a long time I set the battery charger on the floor on the passenger side plug it in and I run an extension cord in through the flap slot up through one of the access panels just in front of the “D” window. This way the charger remains inside the plane and free from tampering. If you forward me your email address I can send you pictures of the unit that I use.

Mike Duane
N377EA EuropaXS
Conventional Gear
Las Vegas, NV

Sent from my iPhone

[quote] On Apr 6, 2019, at 3:04 PM, Gary Leinberger <Gary.Leinberger(at)millersville.edu> wrote:

I just ordered another PC680 for my 912 S Europa. This one lasted almost 5 years. I have had little problem with these batteries, even when using a standard automotive battery charger that brings the battery up to about 13.5 or volts. Lately it has only been able to bring the battery up to 12.8 v and I have been having problems starting, especially when cold. But today was 65 degrees F. so I pulled it out, saw the date on it, and bit the bullet.

Does anyone know of a charger that will charge these batteries properly - normally when cold I turn on my engine block heater and put the charger on the battery to warm it up and I have no problem. However, I did try an Odessey battery charger and it burned up - I was lucky I didn't lose the plane. Odessey was less than helpful and basically blew me off after admitting that charger model had problems. They apparently dropped that model and brought out a new model but I felt a tad nervous about using their charger. Any suggestions?


Gary Leinberger
N388SG
Europa A237
Lancaster, Pa., USA
380 hours.


From: owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com <owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com> on behalf of Europa-List Digest Server <europa-list(at)matronics.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 6, 2019 2:34 AM
To: Europa-List Digest List
Subject: Europa-List Digest: 3 Msgs - 04/05/19

CAUTION: This email originated from outside of Millersville. Do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is safe.


*

=========================
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
=========================

Today's complete Europa-List Digest can also be found in either of the
two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted
in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
of the Europa-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
such as Notepad or with a web browser.

HTML Version:

http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter=2019-04-05&Archive=Europa

Text Version:

http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter=2019-04-05&Archive=Europa


=======================
EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
=======================


----------------------------------------------------------
Europa-List Digest Archive
---
Total Messages Posted Fri 04/05/19: 3
----------------------------------------------------------


Today's Message Index:
----------------------

1. 01:18 AM - Re: Which battery claims should I believe? (clivesutton)
2. 09:24 AM - Europa Aircraft - location change (John Wighton)
3. 12:13 PM - Re: Which battery claims should I believe? (JonathanMilbank)



________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________


Time: 01:18:21 AM PST US
Subject: Re: Which battery claims should I believe?
From: "clivesutton" <clive.maf(at)googlemail.com>


Hi Jonathan,

To contribute to to your original question (which is indeed fascinating) i think
the answer may have to do with the internal chemistries/construction of each,
the way each Mfr interprets e.g. CCA and CA testing and their market focus

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freddythek10(at)gmail.com
Guest
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 4:18 pm    Post subject: PC680 battery Reply with quote
Gary...my PC680 is very happy being charged by an EnerSys charger ...sorry I can’t give you a model #... and it’s so light that I’ve mounted it onboard.

Sent from my iPhone

[quote] On Apr 6, 2019, at 3:04 PM, Gary Leinberger <Gary.Leinberger(at)millersville.edu> wrote:

I just ordered another PC680 for my 912 S Europa. This one lasted almost 5 years. I have had little problem with these batteries, even when using a standard automotive battery charger that brings the battery up to about 13.5 or volts. Lately it has only been able to bring the battery up to 12.8 v and I have been having problems starting, especially when cold. But today was 65 degrees F. so I pulled it out, saw the date on it, and bit the bullet.

Does anyone know of a charger that will charge these batteries properly - normally when cold I turn on my engine block heater and put the charger on the battery to warm it up and I have no problem. However, I did try an Odessey battery charger and it burned up - I was lucky I didn't lose the plane. Odessey was less than helpful and basically blew me off after admitting that charger model had problems. They apparently dropped that model and brought out a new model but I felt a tad nervous about using their charger. Any suggestions?


Gary Leinberger
N388SG
Europa A237
Lancaster, Pa., USA
380 hours.


From: owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com <owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com> on behalf of Europa-List Digest Server <europa-list(at)matronics.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 6, 2019 2:34 AM
To: Europa-List Digest List
Subject: Europa-List Digest: 3 Msgs - 04/05/19

CAUTION: This email originated from outside of Millersville. Do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is safe.


*

=========================
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
=========================

Today's complete Europa-List Digest can also be found in either of the
two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted
in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
of the Europa-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
such as Notepad or with a web browser.

HTML Version:

http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter=2019-04-05&Archive=Europa

Text Version:

http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter=2019-04-05&Archive=Europa


=======================
EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
=======================


----------------------------------------------------------
Europa-List Digest Archive
---
Total Messages Posted Fri 04/05/19: 3
----------------------------------------------------------


Today's Message Index:
----------------------

1. 01:18 AM - Re: Which battery claims should I believe? (clivesutton)
2. 09:24 AM - Europa Aircraft - location change (John Wighton)
3. 12:13 PM - Re: Which battery claims should I believe? (JonathanMilbank)



________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________


Time: 01:18:21 AM PST US
Subject: Re: Which battery claims should I believe?
From: "clivesutton" <clive.maf(at)googlemail.com>


Hi Jonathan,

To contribute to to your original question (which is indeed fascinating) i think
the answer may have to do with the internal chemistries/construction of each,
the way each Mfr interprets e.g. CCA and CA testing and their market focus

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freddythek10(at)gmail.com
Guest
PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2019 10:06 am    Post subject: PC680 battery Reply with quote
Gary…my EnerSys charger is a 6 amp Odyssey charger…love the “auto-maintain” function…no problems as yet...with my MPEFI (electrically dependent) engine, I carry two PC680s and can toggle between them so they’re both monitored and fully charged…I installed a male plug on underside of fuselage (a thru-hull marine fitting w/ rubber closure) to provide 110v power…mounted it behind the “D” panel in which I cut a window in order to read the LED status lights.
Can you describe the situation when your Odyssey charger “burned up”?

Fred
Quote:
On Apr 6, 2019, at 5:17 PM, Fred Klein <freddythek10(at)gmail.com (freddythek10(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
Gary...my PC680 is very happy being charged by an EnerSys charger ...sorry I can’t give you a model #... and it’s so light that I’ve mounted it onboard.



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freddythek10(at)gmail.com
Guest
PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2019 11:29 am    Post subject: PC680 battery Reply with quote

Gary…a bit more info: my 6 amp charger is “Model TMAX-6A-1B”…do you recall the model designation for the Odyssey charger which “burned up”?

Fred

*****

Gary…my EnerSys charger is a 6 amp Odyssey charger…love the “auto-maintain” function…no problems as yet...with my MPEFI (electrically dependent) engine, I carry two PC680s and can toggle between them so they’re both monitored and fully charged…I installed a male plug on underside of fuselage (a thru-hull marine fitting w/ rubber closure) to provide 110v power…mounted it behind the “D” panel in which I cut a window in order to read the LED status lights.
Can you describe the situation when your Odyssey charger “burned up”?

Fred
Quote:
On Apr 6, 2019, at 5:17 PM, Fred Klein <freddythek10(at)gmail.com (freddythek10(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
Gary...my PC680 is very happy being charged by an EnerSys charger ...sorry I can’t give you a model #... and it’s so light that I’ve mounted it onboard.



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dmac7



Joined: 05 Apr 2019
Posts: 48
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 8:44 am    Post subject: Re: PC680 battery Reply with quote
Reading the spec's of the PC680 then the PC625 I was left questioning why the popularity of the PC680? It has lower power than the PC625 by 10 to 20% in all spec's. It's also 1 kilo heavier. Maybe the shape is the reason? I asked the Odyssey rep why the better spec's on the PC 625 his reply "The PC625 is a more efficient design"

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ptag.dev(at)talktalk.net
Guest
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 9:52 am    Post subject: PC680 battery Reply with quote
All.....
I consider the PC680 has a particular capability of being able to give up
its power very quickly in the start process when compared with competition.
I originally had a Jabiru 3300 which needed a very high cranking capability
with the six pots coming onto the compression stroke in quick succession.
Much larger batteries proved incapable to give out the start power quickly
enough, so I finished up with two p680 type( sometimes known as "RED TOP"
).in parallel. When I changed engines to a 914 Rotax I kept the two
batteries employed even though I have a heavy duty rotax starter. Keeping
the two helps with redundancy issues too.
I suffered exhaustive times starting the 6 cylinder engine and tried even
heavy construction batteries with no success. All started in 1999 and I am
now on my second pair nearly twenty years later! Having used both the
originals on emergency car and lawn mower duties since recovery from the
aircraft.
Regards
Bob Harrison G-PTAG.

--

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rehn(at)rockisland.com
Guest
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 12:44 pm    Post subject: PC680 battery Reply with quote
I’ve been using the PC680 with great success, it will hold a charge for a very long time, they seem to last forever too. I change them out at about five years and then use them in my ATV for another five years. I have one “used” on my work bench for 12 volt testing etc and charge it about once a year. I would definitely recommend them.
Jerry Rehn
Mono XS, 914
Sent from my iPad

On Apr 8, 2019, at 10:13 AM, <duanefamly(at)aol.com (duanefamly(at)aol.com)> <duanefamly(at)aol.com (duanefamly(at)aol.com)> wrote:
Quote:
To compare the PC625 to the PC680 I believe comes down to size. Here are the specs off the website.
PC625 PCHA 540 220 CCA 400 HCA 330 MCA 6.70 L 3.90 W 6.95 H 13.2LBS
PC680 PCHA 520 170 CCA 350 HCA 280 MCA 7.27 L 3.11 W 7.55 H 15.4 LBS
I guess if you haven’t built the battery box yet, you can make it fit. Or you can redo the box.
Anybody have any other reason for choosing the PC680 over the 625?
Mike Duane
Las Vegas, NV
PC680

Sent from Windows Mail

From: dmac7 (dmac7(at)outlook.com)
Sent: ‎Monday‎, ‎April‎ ‎8‎, ‎2019 ‎9‎:‎44‎ ‎AM
To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com)

--> Europa-List message posted by: "dmac7" <dmac7(at)outlook.com (dmac7(at)outlook.com)>

Reading the spec's of the PC680 then the PC625 I was left questioning why the popularity of the PC680? It has lower power than the PC625 by 10 to 20% in all spec's. It's also 1 kilo heavier. Maybe the shape is the reason? I asked the Odyssey rep why the better spec's on the PC 625 his reply "The PC625 is a more efficient design"


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