 |
Matronics Email Lists
Web Forum Interface to the Matronics Email Lists
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
shaunwellis(at)gmail.com
Guest
|
 Posted: Tue Nov 05, 2024 2:46 pm Post subject: Brown Out Bus Functionality |
 |
|
I’m new to the list (and aircraft wiring) so forgive me if this is redundant or should be self-explanatory, but, can someone explain or point me towards info regarding how the brown out bus actually prevents brown out of the equipment during engine starts? I’ve been trying to understand Z101 and I can’t figure out what prevents the voltage drop of the BO bus during starts. Thanks!
| | - The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Ceengland
Joined: 11 Oct 2020
Posts: 391
Location: MS
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 05, 2024 5:14 pm Post subject: Brown Out Bus Functionality |
|
|
On Tue, Nov 5, 2024 at 6:39 PM Shaun Ellis <shaunwellis(at)gmail.com (shaunwellis(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Shaun Ellis <shaunwellis(at)gmail.com (shaunwellis(at)gmail.com)>
I’m new to the list (and aircraft wiring) so forgive me if this is redundant or should be self-explanatory, but, can someone explain or point me towards info regarding how the brown out bus actually prevents brown out of the equipment during engine starts? I’ve been trying to understand Z101 and I can’t figure out what prevents the voltage drop of the BO bus during starts. Thanks!
|
Hi Shaun; welcome aboard!
The secret sauce in the brownout bus circuit is the stuff in green (if you're looking at it on a computer or a color print) labeled 'brownout booster'. It's simply a solid state inverter style 'boost converter-regulator', that takes a DC voltage from the heavily loaded battery, chops it up into sorta-AC, runs it through what amounts to a transformer to raise the voltage, and converts it back to DC. The devices typically control output voltage (regulate it) by varying the 'duty cycle' of the sorta-AC.
The gadget gets switched in/out of the system by the associated relay & switch terminals.
It's been a while since I've needed to pay attention to that Z figure, so I can't remember the part/model number of the converter, but it should be in the docs somewhere. Also, there are many devices available from the usual online ordering sources that will do the same job.
Hope that helps,
Charlie
 Virus-free.www.avast.com[url=#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2][/url]
| | - The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List |
|
_________________
Charlie |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
david(at)carter.net
Guest
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 05, 2024 5:36 pm Post subject: Brown Out Bus Functionality |
|
|
I used the 8-amp version of this device (https://www.tcwtech.com/product/intelligent-power-stabilizer/) to provide this capability to most of my brownout-critical devices, plus the Garmin GAD 27's keep-alive function to provide brownout protection to one additional device (my MFD) that would have otherwise been over the TCW's 8A rating.
---
David Carter
david(at)carter.net (david(at)carter.net)
On Tue, Nov 5, 2024 at 8:15 PM Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com (ceengland7(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: |
On Tue, Nov 5, 2024 at 6:39 PM Shaun Ellis <shaunwellis(at)gmail.com (shaunwellis(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Shaun Ellis <shaunwellis(at)gmail.com (shaunwellis(at)gmail.com)>
I’m new to the list (and aircraft wiring) so forgive me if this is redundant or should be self-explanatory, but, can someone explain or point me towards info regarding how the brown out bus actually prevents brown out of the equipment during engine starts? I’ve been trying to understand Z101 and I can’t figure out what prevents the voltage drop of the BO bus during starts. Thanks!
|
Hi Shaun; welcome aboard!
The secret sauce in the brownout bus circuit is the stuff in green (if you're looking at it on a computer or a color print) labeled 'brownout booster'. It's simply a solid state inverter style 'boost converter-regulator', that takes a DC voltage from the heavily loaded battery, chops it up into sorta-AC, runs it through what amounts to a transformer to raise the voltage, and converts it back to DC. The devices typically control output voltage (regulate it) by varying the 'duty cycle' of the sorta-AC.
The gadget gets switched in/out of the system by the associated relay & switch terminals.
It's been a while since I've needed to pay attention to that Z figure, so I can't remember the part/model number of the converter, but it should be in the docs somewhere. Also, there are many devices available from the usual online ordering sources that will do the same job.
Hope that helps,
Charlie
Virus-free.www.avast.com[url=#m_9069903307299092257_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2][/url]
|
| | - The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
shaunwellis(at)gmail.com
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 06, 2024 5:34 am Post subject: Brown Out Bus Functionality |
|
|
Thank you both! That all makes sense. Other than the GAD 27 running an MFD I didn’t get the additional device.
Have a great day!
Shaun
| Quote: | On Nov 5, 2024, at 7:33 PM, David Carter <david(at)carter.net> wrote:
I used the 8-amp version of this device (https://www.tcwtech.com/product/intelligent-power-stabilizer/) to provide this capability to most of my brownout-critical devices, plus the Garmin GAD 27's keep-alive function to provide brownout protection to one additional device (my MFD) that would have otherwise been over the TCW's 8A rating.
---
David Carter
david(at)carter.net (david(at)carter.net)
On Tue, Nov 5, 2024 at 8:15 PM Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com (ceengland7(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: |
On Tue, Nov 5, 2024 at 6:39 PM Shaun Ellis <shaunwellis(at)gmail.com (shaunwellis(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Shaun Ellis <shaunwellis(at)gmail.com (shaunwellis(at)gmail.com)>
I’m new to the list (and aircraft wiring) so forgive me if this is redundant or should be self-explanatory, but, can someone explain or point me towards info regarding how the brown out bus actually prevents brown out of the equipment during engine starts? I’ve been trying to understand Z101 and I can’t figure out what prevents the voltage drop of the BO bus during starts. Thanks!
|
Hi Shaun; welcome aboard!
The secret sauce in the brownout bus circuit is the stuff in green (if you're looking at it on a computer or a color print) labeled 'brownout booster'. It's simply a solid state inverter style 'boost converter-regulator', that takes a DC voltage from the heavily loaded battery, chops it up into sorta-AC, runs it through what amounts to a transformer to raise the voltage, and converts it back to DC. The devices typically control output voltage (regulate it) by varying the 'duty cycle' of the sorta-AC.
The gadget gets switched in/out of the system by the associated relay & switch terminals.
It's been a while since I've needed to pay attention to that Z figure, so I can't remember the part/model number of the converter, but it should be in the docs somewhere. Also, there are many devices available from the usual online ordering sources that will do the same job.
Hope that helps,
Charlie
Virus-free.www.avast.com[url=x-msg://22/#m_9069903307299092257_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2][/url]
|
|
| | - The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
peter(at)sportingaero.com
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 06, 2024 11:35 am Post subject: Brown Out Bus Functionality |
|
|
Depending what is in your panel the 4 amp version may be adequate. One screen, the AHRS, Engine interface (eg GEA 24 or similar) and possibly the GPS (don’t want to have to enter the flight plan again) is all that is really required. The GAD 27 has some of the same functionality so make take the place of the TCW brick, although some think the GAD 27 just adds complexity for not much gain.
Peter
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com <owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com> On Behalf Of Shaun Ellis
Sent: 06 November 2024 13:34
To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Brown Out Bus Functionality
Thank you both! That all makes sense. Other than the GAD 27 running an MFD I didn’t get the additional device.
Have a great day!
Shaun
| Quote: |
On Nov 5, 2024, at 7:33 PM, David Carter <david(at)carter.net (david(at)carter.net)> wrote:
I used the 8-amp version of this device (https://www.tcwtech.com/product/intelligent-power-stabilizer/) to provide this capability to most of my brownout-critical devices, plus the Garmin GAD 27's keep-alive function to provide brownout protection to one additional device (my MFD) that would have otherwise been over the TCW's 8A rating.
---
David Carter
david(at)carter.net (david(at)carter.net)
On Tue, Nov 5, 2024 at 8:15 PM Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com (ceengland7(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: |
On Tue, Nov 5, 2024 at 6:39 PM Shaun Ellis <shaunwellis(at)gmail.com (shaunwellis(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Shaun Ellis <shaunwellis(at)gmail.com (shaunwellis(at)gmail.com)>
I’m new to the list (and aircraft wiring) so forgive me if this is redundant or should be self-explanatory, but, can someone explain or point me towards info regarding how the brown out bus actually prevents brown out of the equipment during engine starts? I’ve been trying to understand Z101 and I can’t figure out what prevents the voltage drop of the BO bus during starts. Thanks! |
Hi Shaun; welcome aboard!
The secret sauce in the brownout bus circuit is the stuff in green (if you're looking at it on a computer or a color print) labeled 'brownout booster'. It's simply a solid state inverter style 'boost converter-regulator', that takes a DC voltage from the heavily loaded battery, chops it up into sorta-AC, runs it through what amounts to a transformer to raise the voltage, and converts it back to DC. The devices typically control output voltage (regulate it) by varying the 'duty cycle' of the sorta-AC.
The gadget gets switched in/out of the system by the associated relay & switch terminals.
It's been a while since I've needed to pay attention to that Z figure, so I can't remember the part/model number of the converter, but it should be in the docs somewhere. Also, there are many devices available from the usual online ordering sources that will do the same job.
Hope that helps,
Charlie
Virus-free.www.avast.com
|
|
| | - The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ceengland
Joined: 11 Oct 2020
Posts: 391
Location: MS
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 06, 2024 12:36 pm Post subject: Brown Out Bus Functionality |
|
|
I thought TCW only made backup battery type devices until I looked up that model. Now that I've recovered my breath and got the old heart pumping again....
Is that thing space-certified?
$5 boost-buck converter and a $1 fat zener for OV accomplishes the same thing.
FWIW, for several years I've been running a cheap adjustable boost-buck converter, adjusted to around 12V (below the normal a/c bus level while running), hardwired from the endurance bus to the aux power input on my EFIS. Works fine, lasts a long time; two wires to hook up. Well, three; gotta have a ground. No extra relays, switch terminals, etc at all.
With the output setpoint below normal bus voltage, it's not carrying any load whatsoever during normal operation. It only carries a load during starting.
FWIW,
Charlie
Virus-free.www.avast.com[url=#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2][/url]
On Wed, Nov 6, 2024 at 1:38 PM Peter Pengilly <peter(at)sportingaero.com (peter(at)sportingaero.com)> wrote:
| Quote: |
Depending what is in your panel the 4 amp version may be adequate. One screen, the AHRS, Engine interface (eg GEA 24 or similar) and possibly the GPS (don’t want to have to enter the flight plan again) is all that is really required. The GAD 27 has some of the same functionality so make take the place of the TCW brick, although some think the GAD 27 just adds complexity for not much gain.
Peter
From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com) <owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com)> On Behalf Of Shaun Ellis
Sent: 06 November 2024 13:34
To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com (aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: AeroElectric-List: Brown Out Bus Functionality
Thank you both! That all makes sense. Other than the GAD 27 running an MFD I didn’t get the additional device.
Have a great day!
Shaun
| Quote: |
On Nov 5, 2024, at 7:33 PM, David Carter <david(at)carter.net (david(at)carter.net)> wrote:
I used the 8-amp version of this device (https://www.tcwtech.com/product/intelligent-power-stabilizer/) to provide this capability to most of my brownout-critical devices, plus the Garmin GAD 27's keep-alive function to provide brownout protection to one additional device (my MFD) that would have otherwise been over the TCW's 8A rating.
---
David Carter
david(at)carter.net (david(at)carter.net)
On Tue, Nov 5, 2024 at 8:15 PM Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com (ceengland7(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: |
On Tue, Nov 5, 2024 at 6:39 PM Shaun Ellis <shaunwellis(at)gmail.com (shaunwellis(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: |
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Shaun Ellis <shaunwellis(at)gmail.com (shaunwellis(at)gmail.com)>
I’m new to the list (and aircraft wiring) so forgive me if this is redundant or should be self-explanatory, but, can someone explain or point me towards info regarding how the brown out bus actually prevents brown out of the equipment during engine starts? I’ve been trying to understand Z101 and I can’t figure out what prevents the voltage drop of the BO bus during starts. Thanks! |
Hi Shaun; welcome aboard!
The secret sauce in the brownout bus circuit is the stuff in green (if you're looking at it on a computer or a color print) labeled 'brownout booster'. It's simply a solid state inverter style 'boost converter-regulator', that takes a DC voltage from the heavily loaded battery, chops it up into sorta-AC, runs it through what amounts to a transformer to raise the voltage, and converts it back to DC. The devices typically control output voltage (regulate it) by varying the 'duty cycle' of the sorta-AC.
The gadget gets switched in/out of the system by the associated relay & switch terminals.
It's been a while since I've needed to pay attention to that Z figure, so I can't remember the part/model number of the converter, but it should be in the docs somewhere. Also, there are many devices available from the usual online ordering sources that will do the same job.
Hope that helps,
Charlie
Virus-free.www.avast.com
|
|
|
| | - The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List |
|
_________________
Charlie |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
|
Get Email Distribution Too!
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
