 |
Matronics Email Lists
Web Forum Interface to the Matronics Email Lists
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
panamared5(at)brier.net
Guest
|
 Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 1:01 pm Post subject: Why is it such a bad thing - was family of pilot awarded $ |
 |
|
| Quote: |
//However no one has given me reason to sway my original premise.
Nobody's trying -- as near as I can tell -- to sway anyone's opinion....
unless the opinion is "I don't need any facts" to form one.
|
You know, this is really pissing me off.
Based upon the facts we do know, it is hard to justify the $10.5
award. The people who are defending the award do so by saying we do not
know the facts to determine if the award is excessive.
So what are the facts? Why are they being kept "TOP SECRET". Has our legal
system devolved into a third word Fascist system where the government is
always right and if you question, or ask for the facts that the decision
was based upon, then you are not a "Patriot" and labeled a traitior?!!!
Bob
| | - The Matronics RV-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
lhelming(at)sigecom.net
Guest
|
| Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 2:42 pm Post subject: Why is it such a bad thing - was family of pilot awarded $ |
|
|
Why TOP SECRET??,,,,,, it is probably called confidentiality. The
government has nothing to do with it. The lawyers will not violate the
client - attorney relationship rights. The clients involved don't want
others to know their going ons.
I don't know the facts; I would like to however, but the effort and
resources to understand it might be more commitment than I want to give it.
The defendants can appeal if the settlement/award is felt to be excessive.
They and the insurance companies have keen interest in this. I don't think
it is final and over just yet. If it weren't for awards like this, I might
suggest the cost to camp at EAA's AirVenture in Oshkosh would be $4 a night
instead of $8. We, the right doers, are all paying. do not archive
Indiana Larry
---
| | - The Matronics RV-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
lhelming(at)sigecom.net
Guest
|
| Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 4:39 pm Post subject: Why is it such a bad thing - was family of pilot awarded $ |
|
|
Interesting, the NTSB report identifies the airport as S88 instead of AWO.
Anyone know why that would be? do not archive
---
| | - The Matronics RV-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Bob Collins
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 470
Location: St. Paul, Minnesota
|
| Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 5:05 pm Post subject: Re: Why is it such a bad thing - was family of pilot award |
|
|
| lhelming(at)sigecom.net wrote: | If it weren't for awards like this, I might
suggest the cost to camp at EAA's AirVenture in Oshkosh would be $4 a night
instead of $8. We, the right doers, are all paying. do not archive
Indiana Larry
--- |
I think it was $18 last year. But I think it was about $15 in 1999. Not unreasonable although I think the only way to control costs at AirVenture is to put the whole operation in the hands of that church that runs the brat stand over near the bus terminal. Soda and water for $1. Hot dogs and brats for $2!!! They know how to do it right!! (if only it were still a secret. Couldn't get close to the place last year.)
do not archive
| | - The Matronics RV-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List |
|
_________________
Bob Collins
St. Paul, Minn.
Letters from Flyover Country
http://rvnewsletter.blogspot.com/ |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Mark Sletten
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 43
Location: St. Jacob, IL (Near St. Louis, MO)
|
| Posted: Sat Jan 20, 2007 5:41 am Post subject: Why is it such a bad thing - was family of pilot awarded $ |
|
|
Bob (?) said:
| Quote: | | “You know, this is really pissing me off. Based upon the facts we do know, it is hard to justify the $10.5 [million] award.” No one is trying to justify a $10.5 million award Bob, we are all (well, at least some of us anyway) just trying to understand it… Bob added: “The people who are defending the award do so by saying we do not know the facts to determine if the award is excessive.” |
I assume you are counting me as one who is “defending” this award (since I don’t agree with your bombastic statements?), but the fact is, I’m as troubled as everyone on this list who has expressed (appropriately or inappropriately) his or her outrage.
This situation reminds me of a couple of people in a crowd having a bad case of flatulence outside in a strong wind – no one in the crowd notices just how powerful the odor is (thank god, who wants to deal with that!) because it’s attenuated by the wind.
Some of you seem to think Bob Collins and I are trying to shovel a load of bulls#!t.
Folks, all I’m suggesting is we need to calm the winds of rhetoric and emotion here long enough to smell the… roses, yeah, that’s it! Watching the way some have reacted with the wailing and gnashing of teeth brings to mind an old Air Force cliché: When we had a particularly excitable individual at the controls – one given to rash action – he or she was said to be “all thrust with no vector.”
We need to calm down, take a deep breath (grin) and THINK! This is like any other emergency situation… we either lose complete control and start flipping switches, pushing buttons and yankin’ and bankin’, or we do as my old primary flight instructor taught me, we wind our collective clocks. You see, he told me no matter what happens in an airplane while the wings are level, the airspeed is under control and the nose isn’t pointed at something hard, it’s going to fly just fine. In those (just unusual, not emergency) situations, it does no good to take action until you KNOW WHAT THE PROBLEM IS! And that’s where winding your clock comes in. All the planes back then had mechanical clocks – you had to wind ‘em up. He taught me winding the clock gives one something to do with that urge to *DO SOMETHING,* and provides time to slow down and THINK before taking further action. I learned thoughtless action in unusual situations can (and often does) just make the situation worse…
I assure you, our little figurative plane flying through the vastness of the United States jurisprudence system is still wings level, although with all the wind blowing around here I’m not so sure about the airspeed or direction…
Please, please, PLEASE… everyone just LISTEN! For those of you who say the EAA shouldn’t have to pay $10.5 million to the family (and lawyers) of an individual who dies in a crash at an EAA fly-in – I AGREE!
***UNLESS THERE IS MORE TO THE STORY!***
There is no question the unusual size of the award under the (not fully understood at this time) circumstances of this situation warrants further investigation. I urge all of you in the strongest possible terms: If you are not helping in investigating the situation to find out ALL THE FACTS, then please tone down the fury – maybe wind your watch, or pound some rivets… work off some stress! Further wailing and gnashing of teeth will only add to the confusion and dismay taking us all farther from understanding.
Larry (I assume, no signature) said:
| Quote: | | “Interesting, the NTSB report identifies the airport as S88 instead of AWO. Anyone know why that would be?” Here is a link to the NTSB report. |
012345
[quote][b]
| | - The Matronics RV-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List |
|
_________________
Mark Sletten
Legacy FG N828LM
http://www.legacyfgbuilder.com |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
lhelming(at)sigecom.net
Guest
|
| Posted: Sat Jan 20, 2007 7:38 am Post subject: Why is it such a bad thing - was family of pilot awarded $ |
|
|
Mark, try searching this data base. I think you will understand what I am saying about AWO and S88. Look at airport identifier in top section of the report.
http://www.aopa.org/asf/ntsb/search_ntsb.cfm
Larry in Indiana
[quote] ---
| | - The Matronics RV-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dan(at)rdan.com
Guest
|
| Posted: Sat Jan 20, 2007 8:28 am Post subject: Why is it such a bad thing - was family of pilot awarded $ |
|
|
Put on you ski's and go to S88 Skykomish
http://www.wsdot.wa.gov/aviation/WebCam/Skykomish.htm
LarryRobertHelming <lhelming(at)sigecom.net> wrote:
[quote] <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /> st1\:* { BEHAVIOR: url(#default#ieooui) } Mark, try searching this data base. I think you will understand what I am saying about AWO and S88. Look at airport identifier in top section of the report.
http://www.aopa.org/asf/ntsb/search_ntsb.cfm
Larry in Indiana
[quote] ---
| | - The Matronics RV-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Bob Collins
Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 470
Location: St. Paul, Minnesota
|
| Posted: Sat Jan 20, 2007 8:47 am Post subject: Why is it such a bad thing - was family of pilot awarded $ |
|
|
// I assure you, our little figurative plane flying through the vastness of the United States jurisprudence system is still wings level, although with all the wind blowing around here I’m not so sure about the airspeed or direction…
To extend the airplane analogy further: Anybody read Aftermath in Flying Magazine this month? It was really good. On a transatlantic flight a plane developed a leak in one of the fuel tanks, but the crew was sure it was their flight computer. They wer eso sure, theys kipped the checklists and balanced the tanks, thereby putting fuel from the good tank into the bad tank and....hastening their potential demise. All the while, they never -- ever -- stepped back to think, "what else could this be." The right engine eventually flamed out and they decided to be safer rather than sorry and land at an alternative strip. Apparently the second engine then flamed out.
They made it down OK, just then starting to think that maybe it wasn't the computer. And, of course, it wasn't.
Mark is right, the only advice that's been dispensed here is for us to act like the smart pilots were are: don't let emotions cloud your process of accumulating information.
It's not like you'll lose your opportunity to "string 'em up" if it turns out that what you think really IS what happened. You'll still be able to do it. But by firing away now, you increase the liklihood that you'll run out of fuel early.
Nobody's got anything to lose by knowing more. So let's know more.
We're all friends here. We all have the same love for aviation, and fly-ins, and freedoms and all of that. Let's not forget that.
Bob (the "other" bob, I think)
do not archive
[quote][b]
| | - The Matronics RV-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List |
|
_________________
Bob Collins
St. Paul, Minn.
Letters from Flyover Country
http://rvnewsletter.blogspot.com/ |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
khorton01(at)rogers.com
Guest
|
| Posted: Sat Jan 20, 2007 9:13 am Post subject: Why is it such a bad thing - was family of pilot awarded $ |
|
|
That is an AOPA database that is spitting out the wrong airport, not
an NTSB database.
Kevin Horton
do not archive
On 20 Jan 2007, at 10:37, LarryRobertHelming wrote:
[quote] Mark, try searching this data base. I think you will understand
what I am saying about AWO and S88. Look at airport identifier in
top section of the report.
http://www.aopa.org/asf/ntsb/search_ntsb.cfm
Larry in Indiana
---
| | - The Matronics RV-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List |
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
|
Get Email Distribution Too!
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
