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Ed Anderson
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 475
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 Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 7:25 am Post subject: bubbles and pressure was : Fuel Pressure Fixed |
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I think you are correct, Cappy. There are several states of gas that can exist in a liquid, some which cause worst effects than others, but in any case, they all appear to affect pressure measurements in a line to various degrees. Although, the attached refers to air in a hydraulic system the effects are the same in a pressurized fuel line. Note that bubbles can cause changes in head pressure as well as erroneous measurements and response delays.
Ed
[img]cid:001001c742f0$870403c0$2402a8c0(at)edward2[/img]
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Ed Anderson
Rv-6A N494BW Rotary Powered
Matthews, NC
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sportav8r(at)gmail.com
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| Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 10:24 am Post subject: bubbles and pressure was : Fuel Pressure Fixed |
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Okay, I learned something today.
Given what I know now, I'm glad mine have worked well all these years without any bleeding that I can recall doing.
-Stormy
On 1/28/07, Ed Anderson <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com (eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com)> wrote:[quote] I think you are correct, Cappy. There are several states of gas that can exist in a liquid, some which cause worst effects than others, but in any case, they all appear to affect pressure measurements in a line to various degrees. Although, the attached refers to air in a hydraulic system the effects are the same in a pressurized fuel line. Note that bubbles can cause changes in head pressure as well as erroneous measurements and response delays.
Ed
[img]cid:001001c742f0$870403c0$2402a8c0(at)edward2[/img]
[quote] ---
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Steve Glasgow
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 674
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| Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 10:57 am Post subject: bubbles and pressure was : Fuel Pressure Fixed |
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Thanks ED. I knew I liked you. I think it all has to do with where the sender is located Stormy. Mine is very high on the firewall.
Cappy
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Steve Glasgow-Cappy
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sportav8r(at)gmail.com
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| Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 6:22 pm Post subject: bubbles and pressure was : Fuel Pressure Fixed |
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As are mine; as high as possible. 625 glitch-free hours but who's counting 
On 1/28/07, Steve Glasgow < willfly(at)carolina.rr.com (willfly(at)carolina.rr.com)> wrote:[quote] Thanks ED. I knew I liked you. I think it all has to do with where the sender is located Stormy. Mine is very high on the firewall.
Cappy
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sportav8r(at)gmail.com
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| Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 6:28 pm Post subject: bubbles and pressure was : Fuel Pressure Fixed |
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Response delays I'll buy, Ed. In fact, I'll take water-hammer dampeners for $50, please
There may be as many "states of gas that can exist in a liquid" as there are ways to leave your lover, but they are all at the same pressure if they're confined in the same hose - or I live in a parallel universe (a possibility I will disregard for the sake of continuing to fly with you fine friends
-Stormy
On 1/28/07, Ed Anderson <eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com (eanderson(at)carolina.rr.com)> wrote:[quote] I think you are correct, Cappy. There are several states of gas that can exist in a liquid, some which cause worst effects than others, but in any case, they all appear to affect pressure measurements in a line to various degrees. Although, the attached refers to air in a hydraulic system the effects are the same in a pressurized fuel line. Note that bubbles can cause changes in head pressure as well as erroneous measurements and response delays.
Ed
[img]cid:001001c742f0$870403c0$2402a8c0(at)edward2[/img]
[quote] ---
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Ed Anderson
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 475
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| Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 7:48 pm Post subject: bubbles and pressure was : Fuel Pressure Fixed |
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I agree, Stormy, if you have a steady state condition. However, when the system environment is not static but dynamic then you can indeed have fluctuation states that cause the state in one part of the system to be different than another part.
Consider two rail road cars separated by a untearable bag of air,each car with a force measuring instrument (after all pressure is simply force over an area, right?). Then back an engine into the first car at some rate of speed. The first car will "feel" the impact essential instantaneously over its entire length and the force measuring device on the first car will register the force of the impact. However, at the same instant the force measuring sensor on the second car will register zero force. It will continue to register zero force until the pressure inside the air bag has increased sufficiently ( due to the compression forces) that the compressed air is able to transmit some force to the second car. Yes, eventually, the second car will measure the same force as the first car - but not instantaneous, there will be a delay. Now repeated back up the engine and ram the cars again and again and you have a rather chaotic and dynamic system with the air compressing, collapsing, rebounding, etc.
Therefore, you can have two different sections of the liquid (separated by bubble(s)) that see difference forces and therefore pressures varying in a dynamic manner. In a real fuel line the situation is considerably more dynamic than my example.
In a fuel line with multiple bubbles the situation can be complex. You have a pump that may be creating bubbles through caviation, you will have some amount of air bubble being re-absorbed back into the fluid, you have bubbles being created by pressure drops through fittings, temperature increases, etc. You may even have a leak that permits air into the system. So depending on the level your are viewing it at -what may appear to be a steady state system is its anything but a steady state system.
Air in fluid lines is generally not a good thing - just how bad the effect can - depends on a number of variables.
But, if you have had no problems - then I certainly wouldn't worry about all those little bubbles {:>)
my 0.02 and I'm off to bed
Ed
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Ed Anderson
Rv-6A N494BW Rotary Powered
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eanderson@carolina.rr.com |
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