Matronics Email Lists :: View topic

Matronics Email Lists
Web Forum Interface to the Matronics Email Lists

Get Email Distribution Too! FAQ Search Memberlist Usergroups Register

Profile Log in to check your private messages Log in

stick grips

Matronics Email Lists Forum Index -> Zenith-List

View previous topic :: View next topic

Author Message

rosestar(at)sonic.net
Guest

Posted: Mon Apr 23, 2007 7:56 pm Post subject: stick grips

Has anyone made their own stick grips?  I have been "shopping" and many 

of the commercial brands seem expensive.  Has anyone made some out of 

wood, aluminum, leather, or bicycle handlebar tape?  I have flown 

Zodiacs with the Ray Allen G205 and the Ray Allen G3.  The foams look to 

wear quickly and plastics get very sweaty on hot days.  I am looking for 

an alternative.  Any ideas?



Brad DeMeo

Zodiac XL N601BD

raymondj(at)frontiernet.n
Guest

Posted: Mon Apr 23, 2007 11:35 pm Post subject: stick grips

I decided to use ones from joy sticks for computer games.  I haven't flown

with them put it seems like it will work.  This is the one I chose: Item

number: 180109958458. Just so happens that the company sells grips for

aircraft also. I'm planning on covering them with leather.



Raymond Julian

Kettle River, MN

do not archive



[quote]--

planecrazydld(at)yahoo.co
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 2:03 am Post subject: stick grips

where does that item number come from? I spoke with one of the owners of CH Products, makers of gaming and industrial joysticks ansd they hav 3 models of stick grip for full scale aircraft as well:



http://www.chproducts.com/oem/aircraft.html

raymondj <raymondj(at)frontiernet.net> wrote:[quote] --> Zenith-List message posted by: "raymondj" 



I decided to use ones from joy sticks for computer games.  I haven't flown

with them put it seems like it will work.  This is the one I chose: Item

number: 180109958458. Just so happens that the company sells grips for

aircraft also. I'm planning on covering them with leather.



Raymond Julian

Kettle River, MN

do not archive



[quote]--

p.mulwitz(at)worldnet.att
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 3:27 am Post subject: stick grips

Hi David,



I took a look at the CH web site for stick grips.  The aircraft grips 

look very nice, but they only have 22 gauge wiring.  I presume they 

also only have switches to handle a similar current.  This might be a 

problem for some of the motors on the Zodiac.  I know the flap motor 

requires 15 amps which would call for something like 16 gauge wire.



If we use a grip like this it may be necessary to install relays to 

control the larger current motors.  This makes for a weight penalty 

and a real potential failure increase.



Paul

XL fuselage





At 02:00 AM 4/24/2007, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  I spoke with one of the owners of CH Products, makers of gaming and 

industrial joysticks ansd they hav 3 models of stick grip for full 

scale aircraft as well:



http://www.chproducts.com/oem/aircraft.html

bill_dom(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 5:11 am Post subject: stick grips

I’ve been entertaining the idea of making them out of  fiberglass. First to make a plug with either wood or ceramic and then make a  mold out of it. Use the mold to create two perfectly equal grips. The only  concern is that it will need paint, and it might wear out with time. 

                   

  William Dominguez

  Zodiac 601XL Plans

  Miami, Florida

    



Rosestar <rosestar(at)sonic.net> wrote:[quote]  --> Zenith-List message posted by: Rosestar 



Has anyone made their own stick grips?  I have been "shopping" and many 

of the commercial brands seem expensive.  Has anyone made some out of 

wood, aluminum, leather, or bicycle [quote][b]

dredmoody(at)cox.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 6:30 am Post subject: stick grips

My experience with the Ray Allen products is that they are definitley intended to be used with relays which handle the higher current when needed. Not sure how much weight penalty that imposes.



Dred 



---- Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz(at)worldnet.att.net> wrote: 

 	  Quote: 	
		   Hi David,

 

 I took a look at the CH web site for stick grips.  The aircraft grips 

 look very nice, but they only have 22 gauge wiring.  I presume they 

 also only have switches to handle a similar current.  This might be a 

 problem for some of the motors on the Zodiac.  I know the flap motor 

 requires 15 amps which would call for something like 16 gauge wire.

 

 If we use a grip like this it may be necessary to install relays to 

 control the larger current motors.  This makes for a weight penalty 

 and a real potential failure increase.

 

 Paul

 XL fuselage

demeo(at)sonic.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 6:42 am Post subject: stick grips

Has anyone used Robbie Attaway's grips?  They look great.  He didn't 

get much by way of business so he's got a few in boxes for sale in 

different colors.  Check out his website at Attawayair.com and look at 

the interior pictures of the blue Van's he built.  You'll see the grips 

there.  The grips are made of aluminum and look nice.



Brad



On Tuesday, April 24, 2007, at 06:08 AM, William Dominguez wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   I’ve been entertaining the idea of making them out of fiberglass. 

 First to make a plug with either wood or ceramic and then make a mold 

 out of it. Use the mold to create two perfectly equal grips. The only 

 concern is that it will need paint, and it might wear out with time.

  

 William Dominguez

 Zodiac 601XL Plans

 Miami, Florida

 Rosestar <rosestar(at)sonic.net> wrote:



 



 Has anyone made their own stick grips? I have been "shopping" and many

 of the commercial brands seem expensive. Has anyone made some out of

 wood, aluminum, leather, or bicycle



Bradford J. DeMeo
	


Attorney At Law

Estates and Trusts

565 West College Avenue

Santa Rosa, CA 95401

(707) 545-3232



CONFIDENTIALITY STATEMENT:  The information contained in this email 

message is intended only for the personal and confidential use of the 

designated recipients named above.  This message may be an 

attorney-client communication and, as such, is privileged and 

confidential.  If the reader of this message is not the intended 

recipient or an agent responsible for delivering it to the intended 

recipient, you are hereby notified that you have received this document 

in error, and that any review, dissemination, distribution or copying 

of this message is strictly prohibited.  If you have received this 

communication in error, please notify us immediately by telephone and 

return the original message to us by mail.  Thank you.

IRS Circular 230 Disclosure: As required by U.S. Treasury Regulations 

governing tax practice, you are hereby advised that any written tax 

advice contained herein was not written or intended to be used (and 

cannot be used) by any taxpayer for the purpose of avoiding penalties 

that may be imposed under the U.S. Internal Revenue Code.

rickpitcher

Joined: 27 Feb 2007
Posts: 76

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 6:54 am Post subject: Re: stick grips

 	  rosestar(at)sonic.net wrote: 	
		  Has anyone made their own stick grips?  I have been "shopping" and many 

of the commercial brands seem expensive.  Has anyone made some out of 

wood, aluminum, leather, or bicycle handlebar tape?  I have flown 

Zodiacs with the Ray Allen G205 and the Ray Allen G3.  The foams look to 

wear quickly and plastics get very sweaty on hot days.  I am looking for 

an alternative.  Any ideas?



Brad DeMeo

Zodiac XL N601BD 	




I used the Ray Allen "hat switch" for trim control. Yes, it requires a relay to handle the load requirements of the motor, all of the switches that I looked at require a relay. 

I mounted it inside a plastic gearshift knob available at Pep Boys. I added 2 pushbuttons to the assembly: a red one on the thumb side to transmit and a black one on top to  toggle radio freq's .  I'll attach a picture, you can see the 3 switches on the stick and the position indicators just to the left on the panel. http://www.lightflyers.com/zpanel.jpg



Rick

N601ZR

zpanel.jpg

Description:

Filesize:

175.26 KB

Viewed:

489 Time(s)

planecrazydld(at)yahoo.co
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 8:33 am Post subject: stick grips

accurate comment Paul;

  Since I have not yet gotten there, does the drawing set not use relays to control motors? I would have never even considered running power current through the switch.



Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz(at)worldnet.att.net> wrote:

  [quote]--> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz 



Hi David,



I took a look at the CH web site for stick grips. The aircraft grips 

look very nice, but they only have 22 gauge wiring. I presume they 

also only have switches to handle a similar current. This might be a 

problem for some of the motors on the Zodiac. I know the flap motor 

requires 15 amps which would call for something like 16 gauge wire.



If we use a grip like this it may be necessary to install relays to 

control the larger current motors. This makes for a        Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?

 Check out [url=http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48245/*http://autos.yahoo.com/new_cars.html;_ylc=X3oDMTE1YW1jcXJ2BF9TAzk3MTA3MDc2BHNlYwNtYWlsdGFncwRzbGsDbmV3LWNhcnM-]new cars at Yahoo! Autos.[/url]  [quote][b]

mtherr(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 8:35 am Post subject: stick grips

I did...



I bought foam grips from Reid Tools and some chair leg

end caps from local hardware store.  The PTT button

comes from a local surplus electronic store.  Cheap,

simple and looks good.



http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601/images/DCP01831.JPG



The PTT button is now a bigger red button.



Michel



--- Rosestar <rosestar(at)sonic.net> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 <rosestar(at)sonic.net>

 

 Has anyone made their own stick grips?  I have been

 "shopping" and many 

 of the commercial brands seem expensive.  Has anyone

 made some out of 

 wood, aluminum, leather, or bicycle handlebar tape? 

 I have flown 

 Zodiacs with the Ray Allen G205 and the Ray Allen

 G3.  The foams look to 

 wear quickly and plastics get very sweaty on hot

 days.  I am looking for 

 an alternative.  Any ideas?

 

 Brad DeMeo

 Zodiac XL N601BD

 



 browse

 Subscriptions page,

 FAQ,

 http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List



 Web Forums!



 

 

 

 


	




----------------------------

Michel Therrien CH601-HD, C-GZGQ

  http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601

  http://www.zenithair.com/bldrlist/profiles/mthobby

  http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby



__________________________________________________

raymondj(at)frontiernet.n
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 9:09 am Post subject: stick grips

Sorry,  the item number is from eBay.

  

 Raymond Julian

 Kettle  River, MN

 do not  archive

 [quote]   --

dredmoody(at)cox.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 9:34 am Post subject: stick grips

I have never used  the "hat" switch from Ray Allen but I have used their grip with a  four button array for several years. The buttons are directly cabled to the Ray Allen trim servo annd require no intervening relays since the servos draw so little current. 



Dred



 

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 I used the Ray Allen "hat switch" for trim control. Yes, it requires a relay to handle the load requirements of the motor, all of the switches that I looked at require a relay. 

 I mounted it inside a plastic gearshift knob available at Pep Boys. I added 2 pushbuttons to the assembly: a red one on the thumb side to transmit and a black one on top to  toggle radio freq's .  I'll attach a picture, you can see the 3 switches on the stick and the position indicators just to the left on the panel. http://www.lightflyers.com/zpanel.jpg

 

 Rick

 N601ZR

craig(at)craigandjean.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 9:55 am Post subject: stick grips

 	  Quote: 	
		   I know the flap motor requires 15 amps which would call for something like

16 gauge wire.
	




The flap motor wiring may call for a 15 amp fuse (page 6-B-20 of the plans)

but the motor doesn't draw anything like that (remember that fuses protect

wiring). With no mechanical load I've measured it a 3-4 amps. Given the gear

reduction I don't think the flaps present much of a load to the motor. For

up to 5 amps you can use the Ray Allen panel-mounted rocker switch RS2-5

(not the plain RS2):



www.rayallencompany.com/products/switches.html



The push button switches in the RAC G2xx grips are rated to 5 amps and can

directly drive RAC's trim servos. The only time you need a relay deck is if

you want to control one servo with two sticks:



"The modern design G205 and G207 stick grips use four, flush fitting

pushbutton switches to control one or two axis electric trim. These SPDT,

momentary contact switches are rated at 5 amps. They can be wired directly

to Ray Allen trim servos, eliminating the need to wire relays in your trim

system when one grip is used. However, if two grips are used, you will need

either relays or a switch to transfer the control of trims from one grip to

the other."

www.rayallencompany.com/products/stickgrips.html



The "hat" switch in the G3xx grips are rated to 15 amps. The optional

surrounding switches have these ratings: push button - 2 amps (at) 28 VDC (so

they can switch more at 14 VDC), toggle - 5 amps at 28 VDC:



"The new G303, G305 and G307 stick grips feature four individual SPDT

momentary contact switches to control one or two axis electric trim. The

switches are triggered via a traditional 4-way "hat" type activator. These

switches are high quality, 15 amp Honeywell Microswitches specifically

chosen for their superior tactile characteristics. The slotted one or two

axis faceplates also adds to the very positive switching action."



"The four trim switches can be wired directly to Ray Allen servos,

eliminating the need to wire relays in your trim system when one grip is

used. However, if two grips are used, you will need either relays or a

switch to transfer the control of trims from one grip to the other."

http://www.rayallencompany.com/products/stickgripsG3.html



-- Craig

p.mulwitz(at)worldnet.att
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 12:48 pm Post subject: stick grips

Hi David,



 As far as I can tell the drawings are silent on wiring for the trim system.  They do show a heavy switch and circuit breaker for the flap motor.



 Let me also comment on another issue - the size of the flap motor switch.  I feel if a 15 amp circuit breaker is required then a 15 amp switch is also indicated.  If there is some sort of overload you want the circuit breaker to open the circuit rather than causing damage to an under-rated switch.  I understand the no load current for the flap motor is considerably lower than 15 amps, but if there is some obstruction for the linkage or possibly a heavy load from excess airspeed on the flaps then the motor current will increase.  Somebody who worked on the design decided 15 amps was a reasonable limit and I would rather respect that decision than try to second guess it.



 Paul

 XL fuselage



 

 At 08:26 AM 4/24/2007, you wrote:

 [quote]accurate comment Paul;

 Since I have not yet gotten there, does the drawing set not use relays to control motors? I would have never even considered running power current through the switch.



 Paul Mulwitz <p.mulwitz(at)worldnet.att.net> wrote:

   --> Zenith-List message posted by: Paul Mulwitz 



  Hi David,



  I took a look at the CH web site for stick grips. The aircraft grips 

  look very nice, but they only have 22 gauge wiring. I presume they 

  also only have switches to handle a similar current. This might be a 

  problem for some of the motors on the Zodiac. I know the flap motor 

  requires 15 amps which would call for something like 16 gauge wire.



  If we use a grip like this it may be necessary to install relays to 

  control the larger current motors. This makes for a 

 

  [b]

bryanmmartin

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1018

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 1:14 pm Post subject: stick grips

Also make sure it's a 15A DC rated switch not 15A AC. There's not  

much difference between AC current and DC current in the steady  

state, but there's a big difference when you try to interrupt the  

current. Breaking the DC current flow is harder on the switch than AC.

On Apr 24, 2007, at 5:47 PM, Paul Mulwitz wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   Let me also comment on another issue - the size of the flap motor  

 switch.  I feel if a 15 amp circuit breaker is required then a 15  

 amp switch is also indicated.  If there is some sort of overload  

 you want the circuit breaker to open the circuit rather than  

 causing damage to an under-rated switch.  I understand the no load  

 current for the flap motor is considerably lower than 15 amps, but  

 if there is some obstruction for the linkage or possibly a heavy  

 load from excess airspeed on the flaps then the motor current will  

 increase.  Somebody who worked on the design decided 15 amps was a  

 reasonable limit and I would rather respect that decision than try  

 to second guess it.




	


-- 

Bryan Martin

N61BM, CH 601 XL,

RAM Subaru, Stratus redrive.

_________________
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru.
do not archive.

craig(at)craigandjean.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 2:16 pm Post subject: stick grips

The limit switches  that come bolted to the flap motor (and are shown wired directly to the motor in  6-B-20) are marked with DC limits of "1/2 A 125 VDC, 1/4 A 250 VDC" (note linear  derating at increased voltages). The markings on the switches inside of the RAC  G3xx grip are the same. Both are classic Micro Switch  parts.

  

 I measured the current  drawn by the flap motor with and without a load. Unloaded it draws about 4 amps.  Lifting a 34 pound bucket of sand it draws about 4.5  amps.

  

 --  Craig

   [quote][b]

amyvega2005(at)earthlink.
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2007 2:36 pm Post subject: stick grips

by the way to all that put the Bar B Que, great job, it was nice to get to know the other builders.



Juan Vega



--

Display posts from previous:

	Matronics Email Lists Forum Index -> Zenith-List	All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Page 1 of 1

Jump to:

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum