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Garmin 396 display crazing

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rparigor(at)SUFFOLK.LIB.N
Guest

Posted: Thu May 31, 2007 6:58 am Post subject: Garmin 396 display crazing

I just saw a Garmin 396 last night a friend borrowed for a trip. It was in

perfect condition when he borrowed it. The clear plastic you view the

display through now looks like my plastic lens glasses that have a

coating, and the coating is all crazed, many fine cracks that at first

glance look like scratches.



He fessed cleaning the display with Pledge. I suspect may have caused the

problem?



1) How is clear plastic best (real world) cleaned on Garmin GPS?



2) What ruins plastic and is best avoided? I have a 296



3) Anyone have any ideas if you can return finish to display? Or polish it

out?



4) Any idea how much cost to replace plastic?



Thx.

Ron Parigoris

frank.hinde(at)hp.com
Guest

Posted: Thu May 31, 2007 8:02 am Post subject: Garmin 396 display crazing

That's easy...You give it back to your friend and ask that it comes back

in the same condition you loaned it to him in... 



--

harley(at)AgelessWings.co
Guest

Posted: Thu May 31, 2007 8:15 am Post subject: Garmin 396 display crazing

First, I don't have a Garmin GPS, so I can't speak for it's display 

lens, but I have used pledge to clean clear plastic items for years, and 

I can say that I have never seen it do that. In fact it is used to 

remove fine scratches and cloudiness from plastic.



Pledge is also highly recommended to clean the scratches and such on 

DVDs and CDs that don't read or play well, and I have also successfully 

used it on DVDs I have borrowed from the library that don't play when I 

get them.



Pledge is also recommended to remove the scratches and dirt from our 

airplane canopies and plastic windows...



So, I doubt very much that pledge caused the problem. 



Crazing, and the type of damage you are describing, usually comes from 

the use of a plastic solvent (which Pledge is not) such as MEK or 

acetone or such. Are you sure that someone didn't try to clean it with 

something like that, and then try to correct it with pledge?



To correct it, you can try some very fine sandpaper, and then pledge 

when the scratches have sanded out fine enough for it to work. Of 

course, if the crazing is too deep, then replacement of the lens may be 

the only option.



Harley



------------------------------------------------------------------------



rparigor(at)SUFFOLK.LIB.NY.US wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   



 I just saw a Garmin 396 last night a friend borrowed for a trip. It was in

 perfect condition when he borrowed it. The clear plastic you view the

 display through now looks like my plastic lens glasses that have a

 coating, and the coating is all crazed, many fine cracks that at first

 glance look like scratches.



 He fessed cleaning the display with Pledge. I suspect may have caused the

 problem?



 1) How is clear plastic best (real world) cleaned on Garmin GPS?



 2) What ruins plastic and is best avoided? I have a 296



 3) Anyone have any ideas if you can return finish to display? Or polish it

 out?



 4) Any idea how much cost to replace plastic?



 Thx.

 Ron Parigoris

nuckollsr(at)cox.net
Guest

Posted: Thu May 31, 2007 9:52 am Post subject: Garmin 396 display crazing

At 02:55 PM 5/31/2007 +0000, you wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  



I just saw a Garmin 396 last night a friend borrowed for a trip. It was in

perfect condition when he borrowed it. The clear plastic you view the

display through now looks like my plastic lens glasses that have a

coating, and the coating is all crazed, many fine cracks that at first

glance look like scratches.



He fessed cleaning the display with Pledge. I suspect may have caused the

problem?



1) How is clear plastic best (real world) cleaned on Garmin GPS?



2) What ruins plastic and is best avoided? I have a 296



3) Anyone have any ideas if you can return finish to display? Or polish it

out?



4) Any idea how much cost to replace plastic?



Thx.

Ron Parigoris


	


   "Plastics" come in a host of compounds optimized for some

   desired quality. Obviously, the transparent cover over a screen

   needs to be transparent and reasonably robust . . . but these

   qualities may not be compatible with designing in a resistance

   to the effects of some solvents. I'm a bit mystified about the

   Pledge . . . we used it a lot on plexiglas windshields and

   a variety of leading edge paints on lots of airplanes. Further,

   Pledge is compatible with a wide variety of finishes on wood.

   Pledge is demonstrably non-antagonistic in a host of applications.



   You might try this experiment. Carefully mask off all but the

   exposed surface of the damaged plastic. Then spray on a thin

   coat of polyurethane from a spray can. The coat will need to

   be thick enough for the material to self-level as a liquid.



   I've repaired a number of screens that were either scratched

   or crazed by various stresses using this technique. If this

   is not successful, you'll need to have it repaired which may

   mean returning it to a Garmin repair shop.



   I used to send intractable cases to a local instrument shop

   that stocked various thicknesses and formulations of face

   cover glass. He could probably put a real glass face on

   your GPS . . . but that guy retired about 15 years ago.

        Bob . . .



        ----------------------------------------

        ( "Physics is like sex: sure, it may   )

        ( give some practical results, but     )

        ( that's not why we do it."            )

        (                                      )

        (                 Richard P. Feynman   )

        ----------------------------------------

harley(at)AgelessWings.co
Guest

Posted: Thu May 31, 2007 10:12 am Post subject: Garmin 396 display crazing

I just thought of something else...

Most display plastic lenses are shipped when new with a protective layer 

of thin, soft plastic over the lens. This is meant to be peeled off 

before use.  Not unlike the plastic sheet that comes on one side of 

acrylic or Lexan. 

I have seen MANY displays on other equipment that have been used for 

years with this sheet still in place.  And when the owner complains 

about poor visibility of the display, I have often only had to remove 

the protective layer that they didn't know was there!

Is it possible that you are just seeing this protective sheet that was 

never removed, and all will be well if it is peeled off?

Harley Dixon

------------------------------------------------------------------------

Robert L. Nuckolls, III wrote:

 	  Quote: 	

 <nuckollsr(at)cox.net>

 At 02:55 PM 5/31/2007 +0000, you wrote:

> 

>

> I just saw a Garmin 396 last night a friend borrowed for a trip. It 

> was in

> perfect condition when he borrowed it. The clear plastic you view the

> display through now looks like my plastic lens glasses that have a

> coating, and the coating is all crazed, many fine cracks that at first

> glance look like scratches.

>

> He fessed cleaning the display with Pledge. I suspect may have caused 

> the

> problem?

>

> 1) How is clear plastic best (real world) cleaned on Garmin GPS?

>

> 2) What ruins plastic and is best avoided? I have a 296

>

> 3) Anyone have any ideas if you can return finish to display? Or 

> polish it

> out?

>

> 4) Any idea how much cost to replace plastic?

>

> Thx.

> Ron Parigoris

   "Plastics" come in a host of compounds optimized for some

   desired quality. Obviously, the transparent cover over a screen

   needs to be transparent and reasonably robust . . . but these

   qualities may not be compatible with designing in a resistance

   to the effects of some solvents. I'm a bit mystified about the

   Pledge . . . we used it a lot on plexiglas windshields and

   a variety of leading edge paints on lots of airplanes. Further,

   Pledge is compatible with a wide variety of finishes on wood.

   Pledge is demonstrably non-antagonistic in a host of applications.

   You might try this experiment. Carefully mask off all but the

   exposed surface of the damaged plastic. Then spray on a thin

   coat of polyurethane from a spray can. The coat will need to

   be thick enough for the material to self-level as a liquid.

   I've repaired a number of screens that were either scratched

   or crazed by various stresses using this technique. If this

   is not successful, you'll need to have it repaired which may

   mean returning it to a Garmin repair shop.

   I used to send intractable cases to a local instrument shop

   that stocked various thicknesses and formulations of face

   cover glass. He could probably put a real glass face on

   your GPS . . . but that guy retired about 15 years ago.

        Bob . . .

        ----------------------------------------

        ( "Physics is like sex: sure, it may   )

        ( give some practical results, but     )

        ( that's not why we do it."            )

        (                                      )

        (                 Richard P. Feynman   )

        ----------------------------------------

mprather(at)spro.net
Guest

Posted: Thu May 31, 2007 10:48 am Post subject: Garmin 396 display crazing

I wonder if the Garmin's have an antiglare coating which the Pledge might

have 'fouled.'

Regards,



Matt-



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 <nuckollsr(at)cox.net>



 At 02:55 PM 5/31/2007 +0000, you wrote:



>

>

>I just saw a Garmin 396 last night a friend borrowed for a trip. It was

> in

>perfect condition when he borrowed it. The clear plastic you view the

>display through now looks like my plastic lens glasses that have a

>coating, and the coating is all crazed, many fine cracks that at first

>glance look like scratches.

>

>He fessed cleaning the display with Pledge. I suspect may have caused the

>problem?

>

>1) How is clear plastic best (real world) cleaned on Garmin GPS?

>

>2) What ruins plastic and is best avoided? I have a 296

>

>3) Anyone have any ideas if you can return finish to display? Or polish

> it

>out?

>

>4) Any idea how much cost to replace plastic?

>

>Thx.

>Ron Parigoris



    "Plastics" come in a host of compounds optimized for some

    desired quality. Obviously, the transparent cover over a screen

    needs to be transparent and reasonably robust . . . but these

    qualities may not be compatible with designing in a resistance

    to the effects of some solvents. I'm a bit mystified about the

    Pledge . . . we used it a lot on plexiglas windshields and

    a variety of leading edge paints on lots of airplanes. Further,

    Pledge is compatible with a wide variety of finishes on wood.

    Pledge is demonstrably non-antagonistic in a host of applications.



    You might try this experiment. Carefully mask off all but the

    exposed surface of the damaged plastic. Then spray on a thin

    coat of polyurethane from a spray can. The coat will need to

    be thick enough for the material to self-level as a liquid.



    I've repaired a number of screens that were either scratched

    or crazed by various stresses using this technique. If this

    is not successful, you'll need to have it repaired which may

    mean returning it to a Garmin repair shop.



    I used to send intractable cases to a local instrument shop

    that stocked various thicknesses and formulations of face

    cover glass. He could probably put a real glass face on

    your GPS . . . but that guy retired about 15 years ago.

         Bob . . .



         ----------------------------------------

         ( "Physics is like sex: sure, it may   )

         ( give some practical results, but     )

         ( that's not why we do it."            )

         (                                      )

         (                 Richard P. Feynman   )

         ----------------------------------------

retasker(at)optonline.net
Guest

Posted: Thu May 31, 2007 11:24 am Post subject: Garmin 396 display crazing

They do (at least the 496 does) and they caution against fingerprints, 

etc. on the screen.



Dick Tasker



Matt Prather wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  



I wonder if the Garmin's have an antiglare coating which the Pledge might

have 'fouled.'

Regards,



Matt-



  



>

><nuckollsr(at)cox.net>

>

>At 02:55 PM 5/31/2007 +0000, you wrote:

>

>    

>

>>

>>

>>I just saw a Garmin 396 last night a friend borrowed for a trip. It was

>>in

>>perfect condition when he borrowed it. The clear plastic you view the

>>display through now looks like my plastic lens glasses that have a

>>coating, and the coating is all crazed, many fine cracks that at first

>>glance look like scratches.

>>

>>He fessed cleaning the display with Pledge. I suspect may have caused the

>>problem?

>>

>>1) How is clear plastic best (real world) cleaned on Garmin GPS?

>>

>>2) What ruins plastic and is best avoided? I have a 296

>>

>>3) Anyone have any ideas if you can return finish to display? Or polish

>>it

>>out?

>>

>>4) Any idea how much cost to replace plastic?

>>

>>Thx.

>>Ron Parigoris

>>      

>>

>   "Plastics" come in a host of compounds optimized for some

>   desired quality. Obviously, the transparent cover over a screen

>   needs to be transparent and reasonably robust . . . but these

>   qualities may not be compatible with designing in a resistance

>   to the effects of some solvents. I'm a bit mystified about the

>   Pledge . . . we used it a lot on plexiglas windshields and

>   a variety of leading edge paints on lots of airplanes. Further,

>   Pledge is compatible with a wide variety of finishes on wood.

>   Pledge is demonstrably non-antagonistic in a host of applications.

>

>   You might try this experiment. Carefully mask off all but the

>   exposed surface of the damaged plastic. Then spray on a thin

>   coat of polyurethane from a spray can. The coat will need to

>   be thick enough for the material to self-level as a liquid.

>

>   I've repaired a number of screens that were either scratched

>   or crazed by various stresses using this technique. If this

>   is not successful, you'll need to have it repaired which may

>   mean returning it to a Garmin repair shop.

>

>   I used to send intractable cases to a local instrument shop

>   that stocked various thicknesses and formulations of face

>   cover glass. He could probably put a real glass face on

>   your GPS . . . but that guy retired about 15 years ago.

>        Bob . . .

>

>        ----------------------------------------

>        ( "Physics is like sex: sure, it may   )

>        ( give some practical results, but     )

>        ( that's not why we do it."            )

>        (                                      )

>        (                 Richard P. Feynman   )

>        ----------------------------------------

>    

>

echristley(at)nc.rr.com
Guest

Posted: Thu May 31, 2007 11:32 am Post subject: Garmin 396 display crazing

Matt Prather wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   



 I wonder if the Garmin's have an antiglare coating which the Pledge might

 have 'fouled.'

   


	


Isn't propane used as a propellant in most aerosols?

nuckollsr(at)cox.net
Guest

Posted: Thu May 31, 2007 11:37 am Post subject: Garmin 396 display crazing

At 02:55 PM 5/31/2007 +0000, you wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  



I just saw a Garmin 396 last night a friend borrowed for a trip. It was in

perfect condition when he borrowed it. The clear plastic you view the

display through now looks like my plastic lens glasses that have a

coating, and the coating is all crazed, many fine cracks that at first

glance look like scratches.



He fessed cleaning the display with Pledge. I suspect may have caused the

problem?



1) How is clear plastic best (real world) cleaned on Garmin GPS?



2) What ruins plastic and is best avoided? I have a 296



3) Anyone have any ideas if you can return finish to display? Or polish it

out?



4) Any idea how much cost to replace plastic?



Thx.

Ron Parigoris


	


   "Plastics" come in a host of compounds optimized for some

   desired quality. Obviously, the transparent cover over a screen

   needs to be transparent and reasonably robust . . . but these

   qualities may not be compatible with designing in a resistance

   to the effects of some solvents.



   You might try this experiment. Carefully mask off all but the

   exposed surface of the damaged plastic. Then spray on a thin

   coat of polyurethane from a spray can. The coat will need to

   be thick enough for the material to self-level as a liquid.



   I've repaired a number of screens that were either scratched

   or crazed by various stresses using this technique. If this

   is not successful, you'll need to have it repaired which may

   mean returning it to a Garmin repair shop.



   I used to send intractable cases to a local instrument shop

   that stocked various thicknesses and formulations of face

   cover glass. He could probably put a real glass face on

   your GPS . . . but that guy retired about 15 years ago.

        Bob . . .



        ----------------------------------------

        ( "Physics is like sex: sure, it may   )

        ( give some practical results, but     )

        ( that's not why we do it."            )

        (                                      )

        (                 Richard P. Feynman   )

        ----------------------------------------

harley(at)AgelessWings.co
Guest

Posted: Thu May 31, 2007 12:06 pm Post subject: Garmin 396 display crazing

Butane replaced freon...at least it's the propellant of choice before I 

retired (pharmaceuticals) and also for the other companies that our 

equipment suppliers provided aerosol packaging equipment for.



Doesn't affect the plastic spray nozzles or the dip tubes that are 

immersed in it.



Harley

------------------------------------------------------------------------



Ernest Christley wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 <echristley(at)nc.rr.com>



 Matt Prather wrote:

> 

> <mprather(at)spro.net>

>

> I wonder if the Garmin's have an antiglare coating which the Pledge 

> might

> have 'fouled.'

>   



 Isn't propane used as a propellant in most aerosols?

robh(at)hyperion-ef.com
Guest

Posted: Thu May 31, 2007 1:33 pm Post subject: Garmin 396 display crazing

If the deed was done with Pledge it is not likely that you will be able to

remove the stuff completely, because one of the ingredients in Pledge is 3

to 5% SILICONE FLUID, DOW CORNING 200,  per the MSDS.  Silicones are

notoriously difficult to remove because they are virtually unaffected by all

solvents.  The other main ingredient is ISOPARAFFINIC HYDROCARBONS (NAPHTHA

PETROLEUM), at 10 to 20% concentration, and this stuff is at least soluble

in non-polar solvents.  The bad news is that what is likely to dissolve this

ingredient is also likely to damage the plastic if it is polycarbonate (aka

Lexan) or acrylic (aka Plexiglas, Lucite, Perspex).  Soapy water is probably

the safest choice is you are not sure if the material is plastic or glass.

If the LCD panel is glass then just about any solvent is safe.



Regardless of the substrate material, anti-reflective coatings are inorganic

and thus impervious to most solvents, but are relatively delicate and will

be damaged by aggressive rubbing.

Best regards,



Rob Housman

Irvine, California

Europa XS Tri-Gear

S/N A070

Airframe complete

--

rparigor(at)SUFFOLK.LIB.N
Guest

Posted: Thu May 31, 2007 2:28 pm Post subject: Garmin 396 display crazing

Thx. to all who replied.



I believe the crazing on my plastic glasses is in fact a anti reflective

coating that has been damaged.



My glasses have seen Ispropyl alcohol 100% splashed on by accident, and my

kids using windex on them to help me see better, and soapy water that was

a bit hot.



I am not positive if one of the mentioned did the coating in, but I

suspect yes.



The crazing I saw on the 396 looked the same as on my glasses. Pledge may

work OK on uncoated plastic (I don't think aeroplane glass has anti glare

coating on it??) but may need to rethink about using on treated plastic.



If someone has an old pair of glasses with plastic lenses that are not

crazed, mind trying some pledge, then isopropyl alcohol, then windex, then

very hot soapy water on them to see if any one causes crazing? 



To answer question, the protective layer was not installed.



Ron Parigoris

Dale Ensing

Joined: 11 Jan 2006
Posts: 571
Location: Aero Plantation Weddington NC

Posted: Thu May 31, 2007 4:49 pm Post subject: Garmin 396 display crazing

To minimize the Dow Corning 200 silicone fluid I would suggest placing a 

soft absorbent cloth such as 100 % cotton on the treated display area of the 

396 for a day or so. Then polish the surface with a fresh piece of the 

cloth.This will probably not remove all traces of the silicone fluid but the 

fluid has a very low surface tension and will now be spread very thin. To 

thin to cause any visual distortion. The silicone fluid is inert and would 

have had no reaction to the display be it  a plastic or glass.

Dale Ensing

RV-6A

Aero Plantation NC

Retired Dow Corning Corporation



-

_________________
Dale Ensing
RV-6A
Aero Plantation
Weddington NC

hdwysong(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Thu May 31, 2007 11:42 pm Post subject: Garmin 396 display crazing

Ron,



How about picking up one of those plastic eyeglass lens 

"scratch remover" kits from your local drug store for your 

396?  Never used one personally but the TV commercials sure 

make it look good!  



Your antiglare coating is likely toast, but if you can get 

your screen cover back to clear perhaps you can use an 

adhesive-backed antiglare cover for PDA screens?  I have one 

on the Dell PDA that I fly with that knocks down the glare 

fairly well.



Good luck,



D

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