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transponders

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eldenej(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 6:45 am Post subject: transponders

I have begun the design of my instrument panel, and because we live in the SF Bay area, a transponder seems necessary (at least useful). My initial inquiries suggest a wide variety, especially price-wise. I'd very much like hearing from any of you who have also installed one, and how you approached it: model, make, etc. Used?

   

  Elden Jacobson

  601/3300



   Finding fabulous fares is fun.

[url=http://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097;_ylc=X3oDMTFtNW45amVpBF9TAzk3NDA3NTg5BF9zAzI3MTk0ODEEcG9zAzEEc2VjA21haWx0YWdsaW5lBHNsawNxMS0wNw-- ]Let Yahoo! FareChase search your favorite travel sites[/url] to find flight and hotel bargains. [quote][b]

Jaybannist(at)cs.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 8:17 am Post subject: transponders

Elden,



I found a Narco AT50A for $500 at a Dallas area aircraft salvage yard.  I had it checked out by an avionics shop for $115.



Jay in Dallas

Do not archive

larry(at)macsmachine.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 8:51 am Post subject: transponders

Hi Elden,

The transponder is recommended if you transit any C-space areas and 

you'll find obtaining flight following is definitely worth while.

There are several good ones.  I use a Becker ATC 4401-1-176 which is 

priced right, built very high quality and easy to use.

Recommend also the ICom A200 radio, ACK A-30 altitude encoder, Grand 

Rapids Technologies EIS (engine information system)

as these are not too expensive, very reliable and come with very good 

installation documentation.  I've about 100 hours of use and

am very comfortable with the electronics here.  I prefer electronic 

gages to "glass" but that's something you'll have to decide.

http://www.macsmachine.com/images/controllinkages/full/instpanelnsegment.gif

http://www.macsmachine.com/images/completion/full/panelatcruise.gif

http://www.macsmachine.com/images/electrical/full/primary-wiring.gif

The radio, transponder and EIS locations are seen in the images provided.

The greatest difference is that I fly a Subaru, 4-cylinder, water 

cooled, but there were more EGT and CHT connections in the EIS

than I could use, but it would easily satisfy your need.

These are mainstream products with good backing, not new, lots of them 

in use and that's the basis I used to select.



Good luck,

Larry McFarland 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com

Elden Jacobson wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   I have begun the design of my instrument panel, and because we live in 

 the SF Bay area, a transponder seems necessary (at least useful). My 

 initial inquiries suggest a wide variety, especially price-wise. I'd 

 very much like hearing from any of you who have also installed one, 

 and how you approached it: model, make, etc. Used?

  

 Elden Jacobson

 601/3300



 ------------------------------------------------------------------------

 Finding fabulous fares is fun.

 Let Yahoo! FareChase search your favorite travel sites 

 <http://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097;_ylc=X3oDMTFtNW45amVpBF9TAzk3NDA3NTg5BF9zAzI3MTk0ODEEcG9zAzEEc2VjA21haWx0YWdsaW5lBHNsawNxMS0wNw--> 

 to find flight and hotel bargains.

 *=====



 *

p.mulwitz(at)worldnet.att
Guest

Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 9:33 am Post subject: transponders

Hi Eldon,



I haven't done it yet, but I have started considering which 

transponder to buy.  I think the important qualities are:  Price, 

Size, Weight, Panel space, and Power consumption.  I think the best 

combination of these qualities will come from one of the foreign new 

units rather than an old used one.  I haven't picked a model yet, but 

I think the price will be around $1500.



Good luck,



Paul

XL fuselage

At 07:45 AM 6/16/2007, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  I have begun the design of my instrument panel, and because we live 

in the SF Bay area, a transponder seems necessary (at least useful). 

My initial inquiries suggest a wide variety, especially price-wise. 

I'd very much like hearing from any of you who have also installed 

one, and how you approached it: model, make, etc. Used?



Elden Jacobson

601/3300

craig(at)craigandjean.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 9:37 am Post subject: transponders

Kitplanes just had an article on buying used avionics. Here is what they

said on transponders:

 

"Used transponders are tricky, and they are seldom a good deal. Any

transponder that isn't solid state (one that uses a power cavity tube) is a

risky purchase. Most replacement cavities for Bendix/King KT76 and Narco

AT50 series transponders cost $600.



Even modern units like the Bendix/King KT76A and digital KT76C use a cavity.

They are a reasonable choice-if in good order. KT76As bring $700 on average,

while the digital KT76C is about $900. Better is a used Garmin GTX 327, a

reliable digital and solidstate box. The GTX 320 series has mechanical

tuning, but solid-state guts, and have proven to be reliable. You might find

one in the same price range as a KT76A. The Mode S with traffic output GTX

330 transponder plays Datalink traffic on numerous displays including the

GPSMAP396 and 496 portables. No deals here. Buy new and get the factory

warranty. Forget Narco AT50s, Collins TDR950s and old King KT78s-you're

asking for trouble."



-- Craig

jeffrey_davidson(at)earth
Guest

Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 12:02 pm Post subject: transponders

Whatever transponder you choose, consider the cost of the recommended cable

in making your decision.  The length varies with your installation and the

type cable required may vary with the length.  The installation manual may

be hard to find.  Garmin seems to hide them from homebuiders.  The current

Garmin GTX 327 installation manual requires different coax cable types

varying from the common RG400 to the less common RG304 and RG393.  The old

standby RG58 is now looked down upon by the avionics professionals despite

Jim Wier's opinions in Kitplanes.  I lucked out and needed the RG393

according to the installation manual.  New and put together by an avioncs

shop because I couldn't find an RG393 supplier, that admittedly long 12 foot

cable cost me over $200.  So consider the total cost of the transponder

including the cable.  The antennas are commonly available and inexpensive on

a relative scale.



Jeff Davidson

CH 601 HD/Jabiru 3300

jetboy

Joined: 22 Jul 2006
Posts: 233

Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 2:41 pm Post subject: Re: transponders

Whats been said is good advice. for a 601, the coax will not be a problem, as the run is short enough for RG58 and transponders are required to have a certain cable loss to operate at the correct levels, so low loss is not necessarily better here. Excessively good coax risks damaging the transmitter / detuning the cavity too.



I think you should first choose the panel hole size you want to install. Another consideration will be the brand of radios you are using. If you choose 2" round fit gear, the best is probably Becker and cheapest is Microair. You may get a discount if buying radio and transponder. For rectangular mounts, the Garmin 300 series plus SL40 comm.



My own CH701 has a King 76A and KY97A com, both of which I snatched out of my old cessna and I think they are about 18 yrs old. These are still good units and I've never had cavity tube problemshowever they dont get used much here.



Ralph



Radio technician in New Zealand

_________________
Ralph - CH701 / 2200a

craig(at)craigandjean.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 5:31 pm Post subject: transponders

 	  Quote: 	
		   I have begun the design of my instrument panel, and because we live in the

SF Bay area, a transponder seems necessary (at least useful). 
	




If you fly inside the "Mode C veil" (i.e. within 30 nautical miles of a

Class B airspace primary airport) or into, within, or across the contiguous

U.S. ADIZ and your aircraft has an engine-driven electrical system then a

transponder is *required*. (AIM 4-1-19f, 14 CFR Section 91.215 and 14 CFR

Section 99.13). A 30 NM ring from San Francisco International covers almost

all of the Bay area.



BTW: don't pay a lot for your transponder antenna. Spruce carries one for

$19 (p/n 11-17995) and I think I've seen them even cheaper elsewhere.



-- Craig

Tim Juhl

Joined: 21 Mar 2006
Posts: 488
Location: "Thumb" of Michigan

Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 4:09 pm Post subject: Re: transponders

In addition to the Mode C veil - don't forget the requirement to have one for flight in or over Class C airspace.



Tim

_________________
______________
CFII
Champ L16A flying
Zodiac XL - Jabiru 3300A
Almost done! It'll fly in spring!

craig(at)craigandjean.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 4:39 pm Post subject: transponders

 	  Quote: 	
		   In addition to the Mode C veil - don't forget the requirement to have one

for flight in or over Class C airspace.
	




Or "At or above 10,000 feet MSL over the 48 contiguous states or the

District of Columbia, excluding that airspace below 2,500 feet AGL"



Of course as a sport pilot I'm supposed to be below 10,000 feet. I think

I'll go back to balloons or switch to gliders.



-- Craig

alex_01

Joined: 14 Jan 2007
Posts: 33

Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 1:00 am Post subject: Re: transponders

I have a very nice GARMIN 320 for sale as we have to change to MODE S Transponders. Unit was just installed for approx 45hrs. Works very nice no warm up period if anybody interested please contact me. zoechling(at)gmx.de

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