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Different heater questions??

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rjdaugh

Joined: 30 Aug 2006
Posts: 195

Posted: Sun Jun 03, 2007 11:48 am Post subject: Different heater questions??

How is the best way to plumb the heater?  I have the cabin heater core in

parallel with my main engine radiator with a valve that can completely shut

off the flow to the cabin.  I am not happy with the heat output.  It does

well down to about 45 F outside temp, but then it gets cold!



This set up does allow some flow to the main radiator even when the flow

path is open to the cabin. I have been wondering about putting a flow

constrictor in the path through the main radiator or putting a thermostat on

that loop.  I don't like complicating things like that,,, but...



Or should it be plumbed to have the full flow through the cabin with no way

to shut it off? 



Randy Daughenbaugh,  N10NH

Black Hills of South Dakota, - Near Mount Rushmore

Home Strip, Grass   Room in Hangar for visitors

Series 5/7 (7 Firewall Forward) 912S, Warp Drive Taper Tip

Gross Weight 1320 lbs, Flying since November 2004

_________________
Randy
Kitfox 5/7 912S
Black Hills, South Dakota

darinh

Joined: 20 Apr 2006
Posts: 327
Location: Utah

Posted: Sun Jun 03, 2007 2:41 pm Post subject: Re: Different heater questions??

Randy,



I have been contemplating the same thing with my heater setup.  In my Model 3, the builder installed a valve in the supply line as you have done to keep the cabin from getting hot in the summer.  In the winter, it would do fine to about 45 degrees as you have stated.  The problem was that in the winter, the engine coolant simply would not get hot enough to heat the cabin below this temp.  To remedy the problem, he installed a cabin actuated baffle over the main radiator that he could adjust open or closed or somewhere in between to maintain a higher temp from the main radiator.  This seemed to work well as I flew it in some pretty cold temps (10 to 20 degrees) and it kept the cabin fairly comfortable.  I guess a thermastat would accomplish the same thing and probably easier to install but less controllable. 



A question for you:  Where have you installed your shut-off valve to the heater core?  I got looking at the setup and the only place one will go is on the engine side of the firewall.  That makes it a bit tough to turn on the heat inflight if the temps drop.  Is there some type of cable actuated valve that could be installed with a pull type handle in the cabin to open the valve and allow the hot coolant to go through the heater core?

_________________
Darin Hawkes
Series 7
914 Turbo
Kaysville, Utah

rjdaugh

Joined: 30 Aug 2006
Posts: 195

Posted: Sun Jun 03, 2007 5:26 pm Post subject: Different heater questions??

Darin,

My shut off valve is cable activated and is located on the cabin side of the

firewall just ahead of the heater core.  I got the valve and the cable at a

NAPA store.  



I just think that a lot of the flow still goes through the radiator rather

than through my heater.

Randy Daughenbaugh,  N10NH

Black Hills of South Dakota, - Near Mount Rushmore

Home Strip, Grass   Room in Hangar for visitors

Series 5/7 (7 Firewall Forward) 912S, Warp Drive Taper Tip

Gross Weight 1320 lbs, Flying since November 2004

--

_________________
Randy
Kitfox 5/7 912S
Black Hills, South Dakota

Guy Buchanan

Joined: 16 Jul 2006
Posts: 1204
Location: Ramona, CA

Posted: Sun Jun 03, 2007 8:03 pm Post subject: Different heater questions??

At 03:41 PM 6/3/2007, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  I guess a thermastat would accomplish the same thing and probably 

easier to install but less controllable.


	


Your problem is going to be that your heater core is installed in the 

radiator circuit. Cars have their heater cores plumbed to the engine, 

so they always see high temperatures, regardless of the thermostat 

setting and therefore radiator temperature. Ideally you'd figure out 

a way to circulate fluid out of the engine independently of the 

radiator. I don't know if it's possible on a 912. If you have a blue 

head 582 you can pick from the re-circulation hose. If a grey head 

582 you can only tap into the radiator circuit and have to limit the 

radiator air flow.

Guy Buchanan

San Diego, CA

K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.

_________________
Guy Buchanan
Deceased K-IV 1200
A glider pilot too.

rjdaugh

Joined: 30 Aug 2006
Posts: 195

Posted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 5:31 am Post subject: Different heater questions??

Thanks Guy,

I think I have to study a car setup.  This may not be as easy as I thought.



Randy



Do not archive.



.           



--

_________________
Randy
Kitfox 5/7 912S
Black Hills, South Dakota

darinh

Joined: 20 Apr 2006
Posts: 327
Location: Utah

Posted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 9:06 am Post subject: Re: Different heater questions??

 	  rjdaugh wrote: 	
		  



Darin,

My shut off valve is cable activated and is located on the cabin side of the

firewall just ahead of the heater core.  I got the valve and the cable at a

NAPA store.  

-- 	




Does anyone happen to have a part number on this valve and cable Randy is talking about?  I have searched and Randy has checked his records but so far nothing has been found.  Any valve that is cable actuated and is compatible with glycols will do...any ideas?

_________________
Darin Hawkes
Series 7
914 Turbo
Kaysville, Utah

bajtme(at)verizon.net
Guest

Posted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:00 pm Post subject: Different heater questions??

Had an old 1970 Doge Truck and the heater valve operated just fine.

  Napa part # Bk 6601141 $20.00 5/8 hose size, in-line cable operated.  

  Kragen auto parts # 74627 $13.00 Kragen goes by many names depending on which state you live in.



darinh <gerns25(at)netscape.net> wrote:

  [quote]--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "darinh" 

rjdaugh wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 Darin,

 My shut off valve is cable activated and is located on the cabin side of the

 firewall just ahead of the heater core. I got the valve and the cable at a

 NAPA store. 

 

 

 --


	




Does anyone happen to have a part number on this valve and cable Randy is talking about? I have searched and Randy has checked his records but so far nothing has been found. Any valve [quote][b]

darinh

Joined: 20 Apr 2006
Posts: 327
Location: Utah

Posted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 3:17 pm Post subject: Re: Different heater questions??

I found the valve and it as stated above...NAPA #6601141.  The cable is simply a push/pull cable also from NAPA.  This should do the trick well.

_________________
Darin Hawkes
Series 7
914 Turbo
Kaysville, Utah

7suds(at)Chartermi.net
Guest

Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 6:38 pm Post subject: Different heater questions??

All,

I am working through the same problem, my heater core has a smaller inlet 

than my cooler so I also feel fluid will travel through the cooler before 

the heater core, path of least resistance, has anyone tried puting the valve 

on the inlet of the cooler and using it to restrict flow to the cooler and 

force flow through the heater core?

Lloyd C

Upper Mi

Mod 5 912ul



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rjdaugh

Joined: 30 Aug 2006
Posts: 195

Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2007 8:04 am Post subject: Different heater questions??

Lloyd,

I rejected that approach because I worry about the failure of the valve in

the closed position.



It seems like someone must have a good solution here.



Randy Daughenbaugh,  N10NH

Black Hills of South Dakota, - Near Mount Rushmore

Home Strip, Grass   Room in Hangar for visitors

Series 5/7 (7 Firewall Forward) 912S, Warp Drive Taper Tip

Gross Weight 1320 lbs, Flying since November 2004  

--

_________________
Randy
Kitfox 5/7 912S
Black Hills, South Dakota

barry(at)pgtc.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2007 3:24 pm Post subject: Different heater questions??

If you run the heater core in parallel with the radiator, some of the 

coolant is going to flow through the core.  The coolant has such a large 

thermal mass compared to air that it is unlikely that there is significant 

temperature change in the coolant as it goes through the core.  I use a four 

inch fan and because of the large amounts of leaks into the cabin, the 

heater does not have much effect.



I would recomment a more powerful and effective fan or be like me and don't 

fly much when the temperature gets below 50 F.



Barry West, Model IV with  912 S

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