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Ultrastar Opinions

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jb92563

Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 314
Location: Southern California

Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 6:33 am Post subject: Ultrastar Opinions

My friend finally wants to sell me his Ultrastar for $3,500 USD.



Wing needs a couple small patches due to hanger rash.



I will get 2 Cuyuna engines and 2- 2 Blade props with it.



Engines are of unkown age, but I think one is fairly new.



Otherwise it looks to be in decent shape and has not been bent anywhere 

that I can tell.



No trailer included.



Is that a decent price compared to others out there?



I'm 225lbs, would there be any issues with my weight in an Ultrastar?



Seeking opinions and comments.

_________________
Ray

Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)
Moni MotorGlider
Schreder HP-11 Glider
Grob 109 Motorglider

Do Not Archive

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 6:49 am Post subject: Ultrastar Opinions

| I'm 225lbs, would there be any issues with my weight in an 

Ultrastar?

 | Ray



Ray (who?):



How old is the US?



Was tube seal used in the fuselage tubes when the aircraft was built?



4130 steel does not resist rust.  Can't see inside all those large and 

small 4130 tubes.



john h

mkIII

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

jb92563

Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 314
Location: Southern California

Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 7:07 am Post subject: Re: Ultrastar Opinions

Ray from Riverside California. I joined the list about 3 months back.



Private Pilot Glider, flown Gliders, Lazair Ultralight, and have a Moni project.



I want to buy the Ultrastar to buzz around the patch and see Socal from the air.



Good point about the interior of the tubes. 



Fortunately Socal is a very dry place where nothing seems to rust....I'll take a look to see what I can see in those tubes.



Not sure about the age....I'll ask my friend when he gets  back.



He is driving to the Toronto, Canada area to pick up an HP-14 Self Launch glider.

_________________
Ray

Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)
Moni MotorGlider
Schreder HP-11 Glider
Grob 109 Motorglider

Do Not Archive

ElleryWeld(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 9:54 am Post subject: Ultrastar Opinions

if you want to fly you had better grab that plane wlile you have the chance  for that  small price and accessories  or you will be watching someone else flying around in it 

 

       

              Ellery

  do not archive

**************************************

 See what's free at http://www.aol.com.  [quote][b]

jb92563

Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 314
Location: Southern California

Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 10:13 am Post subject: Re: Ultrastar Opinions

Yes, I guess at that price you cant really go to far wrong if it looks decent.



He said that installing the engine is the only real task at hand since the 2  wing patches are only a quick patch job.



I don't pretty up my planes with paint until I have worked the bugs out, so after I have flown it a couple times I can restore it with a nice paint job.



Is there a way of testing the fabric to see if it needs replacement?



I looks and feels strong and has been stored out of the sunlight.

_________________
Ray

Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)
Moni MotorGlider
Schreder HP-11 Glider
Grob 109 Motorglider

Do Not Archive

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 11:03 am Post subject: Ultrastar Opinions

| I don't pretty up my planes with paint until I have worked the bugs 

out, so after I have flown it a couple times I can restore it with a 

nice paint job.

|

| Is there a way of testing the fabric to see if it needs replacement?

|

| I looks and feels strong and has been stored out of the sunlight.

|

| --------

| Ray

Ray:



Sounds like you need to get some manuals on polyfiber covering 

process.



Your questions reference fabric indicate you could use some good sound 

info.



john h

mkIII

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

jb92563

Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 314
Location: Southern California

Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 11:46 am Post subject: Re: Ultrastar Opinions

Yes, I have never dealt with a fabric covered aircraft before, any tips will be welcome.



Were all Kolb Ultrastars covered with polyfiber?



How long does it last if keeping the plane tied out in the sun.

_________________
Ray

Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)
Moni MotorGlider
Schreder HP-11 Glider
Grob 109 Motorglider

Do Not Archive

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 12:14 pm Post subject: Ultrastar Opinions

| Yes, I have never dealt with a fabric covered aircraft before, any 

tips will be welcome.

|

| Were all Kolb Ultrastars covered with polyfiber?

|

| How long does it last if keeping the plane tied out in the sun.

|

| --------

| Ray

Ray:



You need to do some research.  Flying is a dangerous business, 

especially fabric covered airplanes.  They do not fly well without 

covering.



Here is a good place to start your fabric education:



Aircraft Technical Support, Inc. Call Jim and Dondi Miller toll free 

at 1-877-877-3334



BTW:  That is a toll free number.



Polyfiber has a good manual that will give you enough info to cover 

your airplane and have a good idea of what you are doing.



john h

mkIII

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

kolbmark3

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 40
Location: Mt Clemens, MI

Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 1:24 pm Post subject: Ultrastar Opinions

John H.



I have a great deal of respect for your flying abilities but sometimes you

are a little short with others.(



Ray is doing research - that's one of the advantages of the Kolb List.



Someone should be able to just tell him how to check the fabric to see if he

can safely fly with his current fabric until he needs to recover. He is not

asking for complete covering info.



Jim

---

_________________
Jim
Mark III
Mt. Clemens, MI

beauford173(at)verizon.ne
Guest

Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 1:32 pm Post subject: Ultrastar Opinions

Ray:

I do not claim to be any sort of UStar expert... but I doubt that is 

scratched on a rock

anyplace that all Kolb US's were covered with polyfiber... The builder could 

use whatever

fabric he preferred.  It is likely, however, that it was polyfiber...or

if not Stits, at least some other brand of raw polyester heat-shrink fabric.



If you are in doubt about the condition of your fabric, would strongly 

advise you get it tested...

Particularly on the top surfaces where the UV could have done the most harm. 

Polyester

and UV do not go well together...It takes a relatively short time for poorly 

protected

polyester fabric (such as polyfiber) to go completely to hell in sunlight... 

and become

unairworthy. It will turn into material with about the same tensile strength 

as old people's

toenails...  Bad fabric can be painful... I once knew a gentleman in 

Louisville, a mechanic,

who flew a rotted out Vagabond a little too long... He talked for several 

years about

getting around to recovering it...One day, toward dusk, while he was on 

downwind out

in the pattern, all the fabric came off the top of the right wing and his 

fabric problem

was permanently solved.



Just about any A&E mechanic ought to be able to test it for you... there are 

2 basic types

of testers... some punch holes and need a small patch afterwards... after 6 

or 8 holes, this

gets a tad tedious...and makes the owner's teeth hurt... The preferred 

tester is made by Maule,

and is rather more humane - it does not poke holes.



Protection for polyester fabric comes in the form of chemical blocking 

additives to

the color coat of the paint (moderately effective), or by putting on 

intermediate pre-

color coats of paint containing powdered aluminum to make it opaque...thus 

blocking the UV.

These "silver" coats (usually 2 or 3 of them) work better, but add a lot of 

weight in a hurry.

Most builders of Ultrastars were weight conscious dudes, so it might be 

prudent to

assume that it has minimal protection unless you see evidence of silver.  If 

the fabric

passes any light at all through it, it likely has no significant silver 

protection.



Your question about keeping it tied down outside -- Personally, I would only

do that if UV-proof covers were kept over the top surfaces of the fabric to

keep the sun off.... and after getting it tested.



There are many fabric experts on this list... if I steered you wrong,

I am certain one of them will pop up and promptly assassinate me in public.



I'd get it tested...  And I'd also follow 'ol John H's good advice, get the 

Polyfiber book

and talk to the pros... Jim and Dondi will not steer you wrong.



Worth what ye paid fer it...



Beauford

The Aluminum Butcher of Brandon, FL

Firefly 076



---

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 2:12 pm Post subject: Ultrastar Opinions

| Ray is doing research - that's one of the advantages of the Kolb 

List.



| Jim

Jim (who?):



Thanks for your opinion.



My opinion is the man needs to learn something about fabric and 

aircraft.  Based on his comments, he knows very little.



When I built my first airplane, the 1984 Ultrastar, I had zero 

knowledge of aircraft fabric and finishing techniques.  The best 

source of info at that time was Ray Stitts manual on fabric covering 

and finishing.  We got one with our covering kits that were included 

in the aircraft kit.  That is where I learned how to cover, finish, 

and repair fabric.  Seems to me, Ray?? could get a great deal of info 

out of the newer manual produced by Polyfiber.  That is why I 

recommended he call Jim and Dondi Miller, toll free, and get a copy of 

it.  If that was not "sugar coated" enough for you, I am very sorry. 

However, I am not accustomed to that kind of interaction.  When it 

comes to airplanes and flying, I would rather someone come across as a 

straight shooter than be any where near wishy washy.  



Take care,



john h

mkIII



PS:  I just returned from dragging my airstrip to flatten a ton of cow 

manure, so it will dry and I can fly this evening.  Not a bad job, and 

someone has to do it.  Besides, it gives me an excuse to crank up one 

of those old tractors that are older than me and most of you all.  The 

down side of dragging manure is.............the old gals and young'ns 

will turn around and do it all over again.

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

kolbmark3

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 40
Location: Mt Clemens, MI

Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 3:21 pm Post subject: Ultrastar Opinions

Jim m

---

_________________
Jim
Mark III
Mt. Clemens, MI

jb92563

Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 314
Location: Southern California

Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 3:28 pm Post subject: Re: Ultrastar Opinions

Thanks for the concern guys, but I dont care if its sugar coated or not, I have been life hardened and experience tempered.



I treat everything as opinions needing verification when my butt hangs in the balance.



I'd rather someone cast their raw impressions so I can look at it from all perspectives and glean what I can from it.



Some opinions are more usefull than others when accompanied by supporting info......like contacts for info on polyfiber methods.(Thanks)



Its all good.



This is an awesome resource...and I thank you all for supporting it.

_________________
Ray

Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)
Moni MotorGlider
Schreder HP-11 Glider
Grob 109 Motorglider

Do Not Archive

planecrazzzy
Guest

Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 4:52 pm Post subject: Re: Ultrastar Opinions

We also try to use "Do not archive" .....



 Unless there's something worth looking up in the future....



 "My" do not archive is in my signiture....That way I never forget it....



        Gotta Fly...

Mike & "Jaz" in MN

.

.

.





 	  kolbmark3 wrote: 	
		  Jim m

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