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John Hauck
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)
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 Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 12:35 pm Post subject: Aileron Forces/Handing Out Advice |
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| I think the aileron size has been optimized by the designer, I would
play with the mechanical parts and try carefully adjusting those a bit
at a time until you are happier with the forces.
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| Just 2 cents from a test pilot.
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| --------
| Ray
Ray:
Are you a "Kolb" test pilot?
If I have paid attention to your posts, you are in the "try and get
this Ultrastar flying" stage. I do not know what your Kolb background
is, other than that.
Good idea to qualify ourselves when we start handing out advice to
others on how they should modify their Kolbs, especially flight
controls.
I, for one, try never to hand out advice, although I do have a little
experience flying and building these little rascals. I find it best
to share with others what I have done with my own Kolb, what the
results were, then let them decide if my info is useful.
Many new folks come to the Kolb List and immediately start handing out
info on an airplane they have never flown or built. There are a lot
of unsuspecting new members on this List that will grab any info they
get their hands on and take off with it, not knowing how valid that
info is.
We all need to be keenly aware of this.
john h
mkIII
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_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama |
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jb92563
Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 314
Location: Southern California
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 7:06 am Post subject: Re: Aileron Forces/Handing Out Advice |
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Point is well taken, but my advice was conservative and purposely steered them away from modifying aerodynamics by making the aileron narrower and of course changing its behavior.
Making aerodynamic changes on a proven design will get you killed faster than anything else you can do.
Therefore making small control system changes instead will still allow the aircraft to fly as designed and any changes if done a little bit at a time is much safer than other options.
I suppose I could have suggested a gym membership to strengthen the guys arms to be even more conservative.
If someone has made an aerodynamic change successfully and wants to claim it as a success then I would expect they should have thoroughly tested the change through the entire flight envelope to Vne, stalls, spins and the recovery.....both power on and power off and of course purposely tried to excite the ailerons to flutter through the complete speed and deflection range......thats a lot of work to try and get yourself killed.
Like everything else its all opinions and ultimately up to the person who hangs his butt out in the wind.
People in aviation that use unverified advice fall under Darwins Rule, and dont pass on their lack of skill or intelligence.....in theory anyway.
Im not a Kolb test pilot yet...will be soon, but I have been for another Ultralight Twin and an Experimental.
I hope nobody is running out and making modifications based on discussions here.....all stuff aircraft has to be very thoroughly thought through and approached in small increments one change at a time.
Making any big changes or more than one at a time is asking for trouble.
Like they say there are no Old and Bold pilots.....only the conservative ones survive to pass on their knowledge.
Better listen to us old guys, since we used up our luck when we were young, and yet here we still are! Must be doing something right!
I hope the tone of this passes along the right message....its not meant to be anything other than stressing a conservative approach, and I totally agree with what your saying John.
Ray
My ussual 2 cents worth based on experience, knowledge and memories of friends that have discovered unairworthy modifications the hard way.
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_________________
Ray
Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)
Moni MotorGlider
Schreder HP-11 Glider
Grob 109 Motorglider
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