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dredmoody(at)cox.net
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 Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 7:43 am Post subject: Building as a way for a non-pilot to get into aviation? |
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Ditto. I am admittedly, a tinkerer and I could and should cut to the chase and progress more quickly on my 601XL build. With that caveat out of the way, I will tell you that I am currently at 670 hours on a 601XL and I'm just beginning to do some wiring. I haven't even begun to fit the wings to the fuselage yet (the %$!##!*!! hangar project is not complete yet...... oh yeah, should we add in the cost of the hangar that I would not need if I was renting?) nor have I begun the FWF work.
I built the rudder at a factory workshop in December 2005 and recevied the entire kit in mid March 2006. My final building cost will probably be $55K - $60K.
I previously built a fat ultralight 2 place trainer which I still fly and that ate up 450 hours and $22K. This plane is very likely the last one I will build for myself because I resent the massive domination of my spare time despite my desire and determination to finish this plane. I'm doing it because the plane's abilities fit the flying I want to be able to do without having find a rental plane and reserve it well ahead of time for every flight. If I want to stay overnight... no problemo.... it's my plane. Last minute opportunity to go aloft? Likewise.
Make no mistake, renting IS cheaper and does not eat up your time like some black hole that just popped up in your schedule book. The only sane reasons to build your own plane (oxymoron) are your own pride and self satisfaction combined with the convenience of being in control of the use of the plane. What I have spent and am currently spending on my two planes AND the hangar would pay the rent for 665 hours at $200/hour. That would just about triple my current flying time (325) and I'd be sitting on the interest rather than paying for the plane and hangar up front..... not an insignificant little distinction there.
Oh and BTW, that calculation does not include the value of the hours I've put in so far and the hours left to finish N4568G (res.). On top of that, who can estimate the toll on one's family if they are not the "let's go out to the shop and help dad build an airplane" type of folks?
This ain't no Polyanna story and it's not a rant to discourage the prospective builder either. It's just an honest look at the big picture for those who are interested.
Dred
---- n85ae <n85ae(at)yahoo.com> wrote:
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Sounds to me like you've convinced yourself already. But just in case,
here's my perspective. Admittedly it might come across as negative,
but it's the same advice I would give anybody.
Ok, I've built two, and flown a lot as a rental pilot. Being a rental pilot cost
me a LOT less than being a kit owner. Don't kid yourself about saving
money. There is not any Zenith Kit, or plans built that's going to cost less
than $30K when you're done. That is a LOT of rental flying. In fact I
paid a substantial amount less than that for ALL of my flight training
which includes my private, instrument, complex endorsement, tailwheel
endorsement, mountain training, and commercial.
Homebuilt planes are great, but there is not a day goes by that I don't
have some feelings about the amount of time, and money I commit to
them. In order to complete a plane, you will have to adopt the attitude
that no matter what else you want to do you, absolutely you have to
force time into your life to go out to the shop. After day 300 and you're
doing some tedious task for 10,000th time you might find yourself
wishing you were just done with it. Fully 50% of projects are never
completed.
I say get a couple years in the saddle first.
Regards,
Jeff
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n1345p(at)suddenlink.net
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 10:59 am Post subject: Building as a way for a non-pilot to get into aviation? |
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I agree with Jeff. Too many homebuilts are started and never finished. Find someone to help you find a local plane or rent and learn to fly first. Learning to fly and building a plane is a too big of a job to do without a lot of help. If you don't have a pilot certificate, you can fly-off the test hours, when you learn to fly in your own homebuilt, you or someone will likely spend a lot of time getting the bugs out of the airplane - making it fly straight, engine run correct and so forth. Get some flying experience before you try to do this on your own.
When I became interested in flying, about 20 years ago, I was looking for the least expensive way to get into the air. I went around the circle: Build a plane, buy a unfinished homebuilt, get a used SpamCan, Build, Buy, Certified, build, buy, certified... lets see, Zenith, Vans, kitfox, Cessna, piper......
I looked at a lot of homebuilts and noted that lots of homebuilts never get completed, or never get flown much. Fact is, saw a email today on the kitfox list for a homebuilt completed in 1994 and only 40 hours of total time; must not have liked it.
In '97, I finally bought a '57 C172 for $19,500, finished private pilot, instrument rating, Comm, CFI-I, ME, A&P... I'm convinced that I can fly and own that old C172 cheaper than any homebuilt, LSA, Challenger, and when I was ready to move up to a faster plane, I sold it for $25,000. Burned 87 unleaded, found an A&P to supervise maintenance, We could actually go somewhere, fly in the clouds, the whole shootin-match.
I'm currently flying the test hours off a fellow's ASAP Chanook+2 (UL style LSA). Its cold and windy, not very fast, burns 100LL or 92UL. Doesn't have adjustable trim, VFR-day-only, doesn't carry two fat people very well, and probably cost as much as a 50's model c172.
So if you are just starting out, rent at least up to solo, then buy an old spam can (C172, PA28...), and sell the spam can when your are ready to buy an engine for your homebuilt.
Mitch - considering a CH701 as an LSA...
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purplemoon99(at)bellsouth
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2007 1:46 pm Post subject: Building as a way for a non-pilot to get into aviation? |
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Jusr saw a Advid Flyer on Barnstomers, Yellow,Folding wingc (one pin)
trailer incl. beatiful job 19,500 Joe N101HD 601XL/RAM
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