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jose.a.lugo(at)us.army.mi
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 Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 10:02 am Post subject: New to the Community again ...... |
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Cool;
Thanks to all that reply with all the good advice.
I'm posting another message since I don't know how to work the list server to view the entire thread of messages, or should I answer all individually?
To start, a gentleman, Mr. Heart called yesterday after reading the posting and we spent some time talking. Great mentorship. He offered to coordinate for a meet for the
pre-buy inspection since he is an ASP. We are booth about 6 - 7 hours away, the ACFT is close to Knoxville TN.
To the rest that provided their contact information, I hope to get around to call because free advise is always welcome. Thank you and hope to hear from you guys soon..
Some asked more questions so, here are some of the answers to see if I can do a better job at asking;
I'm a 6'-1", 230 #, military instructor pilot with 4000 hrs. TT. about 150 are fixed wing and the only tail wheel experience I have is taxing a UH-60 Blackhawk, doing Roll-on
landings with that helicopter, those mainly land on the tail wheel between 30 to 60 KTS not too many main wheel landings and rolling T/O that keep me on the mains all the way
up to 40 - 50 KTS. I also do some other stuff for the army but this is not a resume so enough about me.
The intent of the aircraft is to fly around on a Saturday or Sunday afternoon depending on the length of the preacher's service and the NASCAR schedule......... hahahaha.
Not counting on the honey-do ..... that the chief of the house will come up with. But in general she plans to come along and she is about 125 #.
From conversations with the owner of the kitfox, he says that he bought it in MAR 07 and an annual was performed then. The ACFT is about 15 - 20 YO and was in the back of a hanger for a long time since the previous owner / builder acquired a 4 seater and stopped flying it. Thus the gaps on the logbooks??? it has a Rotax 503 pull start with a B drive; with aprox 100hrs since overhaul, 300 ttaf, invo in-flight adj prop / nav, strobe and inst lights; 9gal header tank and a 6gal wing tank N numbered and certified as experimental.
From the age, I'm guessing is a model I or II.
I saw some of the maintenance service bulletins and letters posted on the factory web-site, and wondered about the performance of those that apply to this model with the gaps in the books.
Not having owned an airplane before, I know I'll have to get it inspected annually by an A&P and that some minor maintenance I'll be able to perform IAW FAR 43.
I'll need a tail wheel TNG / sing-off.
Is an annual a good way to ensure a good pre-buy?
ROTAX 503 overhaul / teardown inspection schedule?
Do I need insurance for this ACFT?
Does anyone insure experimental for damage ? liability?
Used to be an EAA member but the membership expired. Currently an AOPA member.
Now, with all this, all the help will be appreciated.
Thank you again.
v/r
J Lugo
CW4 Jose A. Lugo
Aviation Safety Officer
HQ, 2nd BN, 210th AVN
FT. Rucker, AL 36362
558-4122 DSN
(334) 255-4122 Office
(334) 475-1402 Mobile
.... Once you’ve tasted flight, you’ll always walk
the Earth with your eyes turned skyward.....
Leonardo Da Vinci
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Guy Buchanan
Joined: 16 Jul 2006
Posts: 1204
Location: Ramona, CA
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 11:56 am Post subject: New to the Community again ...... |
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At 09:28 AM 12/4/2007, you wrote:
| Quote: | | I'm posting another message since I don't know how to work the list server to view the entire thread of messages, or should I answer all individually? |
Your choice. You can reply to each and if you don't change the subject the server will take care of the threading.
| Quote: | | Not having owned an airplane before, I know I'll have to get it inspected annually by an A&P and that some minor maintenance I'll be able to perform IAW FAR 43. |
43 doesn't apply. Being an experimental you'll be able to do ALL the maintenance. The only thing you'll have to farm out is the conditional inspection. (You can do that too, of course, under the "supervision" of an A&P who signs it off.)
| Quote: | | Is an annual a good way to ensure a good pre-buy? |
Not necessarily. For an experimental the owner designs the annual. It can be complete or. . .
| Quote: | | ROTAX 503 overhaul / teardown inspection schedule? |
This should be available on line at http://www.rotax-aircraft-engines.com/a_searchdoc.aspx. (You're looking for the "Operator's Manual".) Service letters and bulletins are available at http://www.rotax-owner.com/sdocs.htm. Both are searchable by engine serial number.
| Quote: | | Do I need insurance for this ACFT? |
Depends. How wealthy are you? There is no legal requirement for insurance, if that's what you mean. If you're poor or massively in debt you probably don't need insurance. If you're wealthy enough you probably don't need insurance. When you're in the middle, (meaning you have a lot to loose, but not enough to cover any loss,) you probably should have insurance.
| Quote: | | Does anyone insure experimental for damage ? liability? |
AIG, Avemco, Falcon, EAA, AOPA. (I use Avemco.) All are available on line.
Guy Buchanan
San Diego, CA
K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar. [quote][b]
| | - The Matronics Kitfox-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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_________________
Guy Buchanan
Deceased K-IV 1200
A glider pilot too. |
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lugo2214
Joined: 04 Dec 2007
Posts: 2
Location: FT. RUCKER ALABAMA
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 1:14 pm Post subject: Re: New to the Community again ...... |
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Thank you Sir
I'll look into all the advise that you've provided.
thanks again
| | - The Matronics Kitfox-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List |
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_________________
jlugo
.... Once you’ve tasted flight, you’ll always walk
the Earth with your eyes turned skyward.....
Leonardo Da Vinci |
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Fox5flyer
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 3:23 pm Post subject: New to the Community again ...... |
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Welcome to the List, Chief.
Just a couple comments, that are only my opinion and worth what you paid. First off, the models I or II with 503 are barely enough engine for that airplane and only if you're a flat lander. Sure, it'll power the airplane, but you're a pretty fair sized guy, then add your wife and full gas and it'll be a slug. Once the novelty wears off you won't like it at all. The 503 is a great engine, but it pretty much makes it a one person airplane. The Kitfoxes properly set up are great short field airplanes capable of getting into and out of very tight landing areas, but you gotta have enough engine to do the job. I wouldn't recommend anything less than a 582 and better yet, if you hold out a while and keep your eyes open, good deals generally pop up with 912 or Jabiru packages cheaper than you can build them. Personally, because of your size, I think you should be looking at the Series 5 and up. Anything else would be very cramped, especially with a passenger.
Another thing, any airplane that has sat back in the barn for several years gathering dust is suspect. Lots of things happen like mouse and bird nests buried way back in the wing ribs, rusty engine cylinder bores and bearings, dried out and rusty moveable parts, suspect fabric, rotted tires, and on and on.
The gaps in log books and the fact that the previous owner is unloading it after only a few months would have my antenna up very high.
All of your questions are good ones, but it usually works best if you break them up into one or two per email. It breaks them up and gives time for the replies to get hashed out. Often it can go on for days and when that peters out, throw a couple more in to the fray.
Good luck,
Deke Morisse
S5 NE Michigan
| Quote: |
To start, a gentleman, Mr. Heart called yesterday after reading the posting and we spent some time talking. Great mentorship. He offered to coordinate for a meet for the
pre-buy inspection since he is an ASP. We are booth about 6 - 7 hours away, the ACFT is close to Knoxville TN.
To the rest that provided their contact information, I hope to get around to call because free advise is always welcome. Thank you and hope to hear from you guys soon..
Some asked more questions so, here are some of the answers to see if I can do a better job at asking;
I'm a 6'-1", 230 #, military instructor pilot with 4000 hrs. TT. about 150 are fixed wing and the only tail wheel experience I have is taxing a UH-60 Blackhawk, doing Roll-on
landings with that helicopter, those mainly land on the tail wheel between 30 to 60 KTS not too many main wheel landings and rolling T/O that keep me on the mains all the way
up to 40 - 50 KTS. I also do some other stuff for the army but this is not a resume so enough about me.
The intent of the aircraft is to fly around on a Saturday or Sunday afternoon depending on the length of the preacher's service and the NASCAR schedule......... hahahaha.
Not counting on the honey-do ...... that the chief of the house will come up with. But in general she plans to come along and she is about 125 #.
From conversations with the owner of the kitfox, he says that he bought it in MAR 07 and an annual was performed then. The ACFT is about 15 - 20 YO and was in the back of a hanger for a long time since the previous owner / builder acquired a 4 seater and stopped flying it. Thus the gaps on the logbooks??? it has a Rotax 503 pull start with a B drive; with aprox 100hrs since overhaul, 300 ttaf, invo in-flight adj prop / nav, strobe and inst lights; 9gal header tank and a 6gal wing tank N numbered and certified as experimental.
From the age, I'm guessing is a model I or II.
I saw some of the maintenance service bulletins and letters posted on the factory web-site, and wondered about the performance of those that apply to this model with the gaps in the books.
Not having owned an airplane before, I know I'll have to get it inspected annually by an A&P and that some minor maintenance I'll be able to perform IAW FAR 43.
I'll need a tail wheel TNG / sing-off.
Is an annual a good way to ensure a good pre-buy?
ROTAX 503 overhaul / teardown inspection schedule?
Do I need insurance for this ACFT?
Does anyone insure experimental for damage ? liability?
Used to be an EAA member but the membership expired. Currently an AOPA member.
Now, with all this, all the help will be appreciated.
Thank you again.
v/r
J Lugo
CW4 Jose A. Lugo
Aviation Safety Officer
HQ, 2nd BN, 210th AVN
FT. Rucker, AL 36362
558-4122 DSN
(334) 255-4122 Office
(334) 475-1402 Mobile
[img]cid:000b01c836cc$77053f40$5d840a0a(at)DMorisse[/img]
.... Once you’ve tasted flight, you’ll always walk
the Earth with your eyes turned skyward.....
Leonardo Da Vinci |
| | - The Matronics Kitfox-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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GONER752(at)AOL.COM
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 4:02 pm Post subject: New to the Community again ...... |
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Jose,
First, welcome to the family. You'll find that the Kitfox perfectly fits your mission, they're just plane fun! As for your prospect, look for the data plate. This should give at least some of the info-year,make(kitfox),model(I,II,etc.)-manufacturer( this will likely be the name of the original builder)-empty weight and gross weight-serial number. I think the ser.no.'s run in succession from no.1 to present right thru the different models.(Guys,please, if I'm wrong here chime in). My mod.II was finished 1990 and is ser.no. 375,if that helps.As for the engine, I have no experience with the 503,however, even if the engine had been "pickled" properly before it's long sleep in the back of the hanger, a full tear down is probably well advised. Critters and moisture have a thing for idle aircraft. For the same reasons, close attention should be given to the entire airframe. The a&p going with you should know what and where to look. As you probably know, you've already found the best resource for anything Kitfox. It's a great bunch of folks and there isn't anything you can ask that someone on the list doesn't know the answer to. Good luck and enjoy.
Greg G.
Macedon, N.Y.
23NK
n375KL
Mod 2
582
do not archive
/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001" href="http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001" target="_blank">hottest products and top money wasters of 2007.
[quote][b]
| | - The Matronics Kitfox-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List |
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MichaelGibbs(at)cox.net
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 6:16 pm Post subject: New to the Community again ...... |
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Greg sez:
| Quote: | I think the ser.no.'s run in succession from no.1 to present right
thru the different models.(Guys,please, if I'm wrong here chime in).
|
No such luck, Greg. Sometime after my original Model IV-1200 (serial
number 1803) was purchased in 1992 the numbering scheme changed to
reflect the manufacture date and run. I don't remember for sure, but
this may have coincided with SkyStar taking over. Newer serial
numbers are of the form, ABC-000, where the letters encode the
manufacture period and the number is sequential within that time.
Mike G.
N728KF
Phoenix, AZ
| | - The Matronics Kitfox-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List |
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Lynn Matteson
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 2778
Location: Grass Lake, Michigan
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 8:04 pm Post subject: New to the Community again ...... |
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Backing what Michel said, my serial numbered ADU-150 Model IV was
built in Jan (A), of 1994 (D) and I'm blanking on what the "U" stands
for {unit(?)} number 150. This was relayed to me by none other than
Frank Miller himself...back when he was the good guy.
Lynn Matteson
Grass Lake, Michigan
Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
flying w/440+ hrs
do not archive
On Dec 4, 2007, at 9:15 PM, Michael Gibbs wrote:
| Quote: |
<MichaelGibbs(at)cox.net>
Greg sez:
> I think the ser.no.'s run in succession from no.1 to present right
> thru the different models.(Guys,please, if I'm wrong here chime in).
No such luck, Greg. Sometime after my original Model IV-1200
(serial number 1803) was purchased in 1992 the numbering scheme
changed to reflect the manufacture date and run. I don't remember
for sure, but this may have coincided with SkyStar taking over.
Newer serial numbers are of the form, ABC-000, where the letters
encode the manufacture period and the number is sequential within
that time.
Mike G.
N728KF
Phoenix, AZ
|
| | - The Matronics Kitfox-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List |
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_________________
Lynn
Kitfox IV-Jabiru 2200
N369LM |
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l.morris(at)tx.rr.com
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 8:40 pm Post subject: New to the Community again ...... |
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OK, that being said,my classic 4 was delivered Oct 94 and has a serial # of C94090064 and just looking at it I'd say it means Classic,built in 1994, then nineth month, and 64th built either total or that month or that year,don't really know. Anyone know for sure the code? Leon Morris/Classic 4/60%/want a Jaburu/Flower Mound,TX
---- Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt(at)jps.net> wrote:
| Quote: |
Backing what Michel said, my serial numbered ADU-150 Model IV was
built in Jan (A), of 1994 (D) and I'm blanking on what the "U" stands
for {unit(?)} number 150. This was relayed to me by none other than
Frank Miller himself...back when he was the good guy.
Lynn Matteson
Grass Lake, Michigan
Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200
flying w/440+ hrs
do not archive
On Dec 4, 2007, at 9:15 PM, Michael Gibbs wrote:
>
> <MichaelGibbs(at)cox.net>
>
> Greg sez:
>
>> I think the ser.no.'s run in succession from no.1 to present right
>> thru the different models.(Guys,please, if I'm wrong here chime in).
>
> No such luck, Greg. Sometime after my original Model IV-1200
> (serial number 1803) was purchased in 1992 the numbering scheme
> changed to reflect the manufacture date and run. I don't remember
> for sure, but this may have coincided with SkyStar taking over.
> Newer serial numbers are of the form, ABC-000, where the letters
> encode the manufacture period and the number is sequential within
> that time.
>
> Mike G.
> N728KF
> Phoenix, AZ
>
>
>
>
|
| | - The Matronics Kitfox-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List |
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