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Are Copper Nico Sleeves OK?

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Gig Giacona

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1416
Location: El Dorado Arkansas USA

Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 6:17 am Post subject: Are Copper Nico Sleeves OK?

I ordered some extra Nico sleeves from ACS and instead of the zinc plated ones they sent copper sleeves.



Are these an acceptable replacement or do I need to send these back?

_________________
W.R. "Gig" Giacona
601XL Under Construction
See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR

cookwithgas

Joined: 06 Nov 2007
Posts: 159

Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 6:47 am Post subject: Re: Are Copper Nico Sleeves OK?

Hey Gig:



If I remember correctly you want to use the zinc-plated sleeves with stainless steel cable.  With galvanized cable, the copper sleeves are fine.  I remember reading this in the Aircraft Spruce catalog a while back - you might want to call them and make sure.  877-477-7823



I hope this helps.  



Scott Laughlin

www.cooknwithgas.com

601XL/Corvair Finished & Flying

klr12(at)psu.edu
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 7:21 am Post subject: Are Copper Nico Sleeves OK?

Gig,

Plated sleeves (Tin Or Zinc) are required on stainless cables due to 

electrolysis caused by different types of metals.

Plain copper is used on galvanized cable.

                                                                                                               

Kevin Rupert

                                                                                                            

601XL TD/ Corvair

Gig Giacona

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1416
Location: El Dorado Arkansas USA

Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 7:33 am Post subject: Re: Are Copper Nico Sleeves OK?

Thanks guys. Back to ACS they go.

_________________
W.R. "Gig" Giacona
601XL Under Construction
See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR

klr12(at)psu.edu
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 8:23 am Post subject: Are Copper Nico Sleeves OK?

Gig,

 From that, I take it you are using Stainless Steel cable. You might 

find this interesting:

 	  Quote: 	
		   General aviation aircraft generally use control cable made from either 

 stainless steel or galvanized steel.  Each type has its advantages and 

 disadvantages. Generally,



 Galvanized rope is stronger

 Galvanized rope has less wear

 Galvanized rope is easier to inspect for corrosion damage



 Stainless steel is more corrosion resistant

 Stainless steel has considerably less service life due to high wear

 Stainless steel cannot be inspected for corrosion damag



 The poor wear resistance of stainless steel rope has resulted in 

 aircraft control problems. More frequent inspections are required. For 

 more information on this subject reference: Special Airworthiness 

 Information Bulletin: SAIB CE-01-30, July 11, 2001.  Frayed stainless 

 steel control cable is suspect in a Twin Otter crash killing 14 

 passangers in Tahiti in August of 2007.



 There are several reasons why stainless wears more than galvanized 

 steel when used on flight controls:

 Galvanizing is a natural lubricant. For example, galvanized threads 

 have a lower friction (K) factor then plain steel. The individual 

 wires can easily move about with very little friction and wear.

 Stainless steel on the other hand has high friction and has a 

 reputation for seizing and galling when rubbed together. Every time 

 the wire rope is flexed, the stainless wires rub together. High 

 friction creates high wear.



 Wear resistance can be increased by changing how the wire stands are 

 wound. In the picture above the individual wires are horizontal 

 (parallel to the axis of the rope). This is called "right regular lay" 

 and is the standard lay.



  Another method of winding the wire stands is so that they form an 

 angle to the axis of the rope. This is called "lang lay". Lang lay 

 increases fatigue strength and abrasion resistance without any 

 decrease in ultimate strength.



 Another method of changing the wire characteristics of fatigue 

 strength,. abrasion resistance, and flexibility  is to use wires of 

 different diameters. For example, Douglas Specification DMS2192 calls 

 for a Warrington Seal (IWRC) construction. This type of wire rope has 

 larger wires on the outside and and smaller wires on the inside.



 There are other wire rope designs that the engineer can call for to 

 optimize specific performance goals. This is why when we replace wire 

 rope we should make sure that the replacement meets the original 

 manufacturer's specifications. 

                                                                                                       
	


Kevin Rupert

                                                                                                   

601XL TD/ Corvair

victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 8:41 am Post subject: Are Copper Nico Sleeves OK?

Copper color Nico sleeves are completely acceptable... they're the 

original ones that were used on certified airplanes for a million years. 

They eventually offered zinc plated ones for better corrosion 

resistance. If you get silver looking ones all you have to do  is make 

sure they are copper underneath... and not aluminum, which I believe is 

NOT OK.



Put a piece of heat shrink tubing over the cable before you do the 

Nicopress process, and when you're done slide the heatshrink back onto 

thesplice to cover the cut end of the cable and shrink it. This prevents 

the cut end from unraveling into sharp little injury machines later.



Gig Giacona wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   



 I ordered some extra Nico sleeves from ACS and instead of the zinc plated ones they sent copper sleeves.



 Are these an acceptable replacement or do I need to send these back?



 --------

 W.R. &quot;Gig&quot; Giacona

 601XL Under Construction

 See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR





 Read this topic online here:



 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=161051#161051

victorbravo(at)sbcglobal.
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 9:24 am Post subject: Are Copper Nico Sleeves OK?

I have to take back some of what I wrote here... I forgot to mention the 

stainless and galvanized issue. However I do know that the standard 

copper Nico sleeves are used on tens of thousands of certified 

airplanes, and those planes include ones with galvanized and ones with 

stainless cables.

Bottom line (despite what I wrote here and previously) use whichever one 

does not create a corrosion problem with your cables.

Bill Berle wrote:

 	  Quote: 	

 Copper color Nico sleeves are completely acceptable... they're the 

 original ones that were used on certified airplanes for a million 

 years. They eventually offered zinc plated ones for better corrosion 

 resistance. If you get silver looking ones all you have to do  is make 

 sure they are copper underneath... and not aluminum, which I believe 

 is NOT OK.

 Put a piece of heat shrink tubing over the cable before you do the 

 Nicopress process, and when you're done slide the heatshrink back onto 

 thesplice to cover the cut end of the cable and shrink it. This 

 prevents the cut end from unraveling into sharp little injury machines 

 later.

 Gig Giacona wrote:

> 

> <wr.giacona(at)suddenlink.net>

>

> I ordered some extra Nico sleeves from ACS and instead of the zinc 

> plated ones they sent copper sleeves.

>

> Are these an acceptable replacement or do I need to send these back?

>

> --------

> W.R. &quot;Gig&quot; Giacona

> 601XL Under Construction

> See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR

>

>

> Read this topic online here:

>

> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=161051#161051

>

>

Gig Giacona

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1416
Location: El Dorado Arkansas USA

Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 9:52 am Post subject: Re: Are Copper Nico Sleeves OK?

Oops. Never mind. For some reason I was thinking the cables that came from Zenith were SS.  My buddy Jay B set me straight, as he often does.

_________________
W.R. "Gig" Giacona
601XL Under Construction
See my progress at www.peoamerica.net/N601WR

bobefx(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 11:18 am Post subject: Are Copper Nico Sleeves OK?

The zink plated sleeves are copper. They can be use interchangeably. I work in the motion pix biz and we use them on galvinized, stainless steel, and all types of cable. aircraft, crain, etc.

  Just make sure you use the proper crimping tehnique and a go-nogo gauge.

   

  Bob

  N642Z reserved

 [quote][b]

amyvega2005(at)earthlink.
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 12:21 pm Post subject: Are Copper Nico Sleeves OK?

Bill,

you can use Copper all day long,  its on all taildraggers built since God was a toddler.



Juan



--

chris Sinfield

Joined: 28 Nov 2006
Posts: 270
Location: Sydney Australia

Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 12:33 pm Post subject: Re: Are Copper Nico Sleeves OK?

Another Q.

What should they be pull tested to? I read that the cables only have to be 30lb tension but what should I pull test to, to make sure my sleeves are OK to use.?

Chris.

amyvega2005(at)earthlink.
Guest

Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 1:11 pm Post subject: Are Copper Nico Sleeves OK?

chris,

its not a pull test. the niccos go on with a diameter setting, and you measure it with slot tester. if it is crimped,correctly,(center first, then out from center) you can move it in and out of the slot tester.  The 30 lbs, is inch pounds, and its roughly 4 foot lbs with a cable tensionomter.  Borrow one if possible, they run expensive. other option is to tighten until just before they start to impedemovement on full deflection.  That is what I did.  Just tight enough for comfortable movement.  Too loose and you can get little bit of flutter, to much and you are arm wrestling it.

NOTE: after 5 or so hours, RETENSION THE CABLES!  they do loosen up.



Juan



--

bryanmmartin

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1018

Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 1:21 pm Post subject: Are Copper Nico Sleeves OK?

You don't pull test them. After crimping the correct sleeve on the 

correct size cable, a go/no go gauge is used to check the size of the 

crimp. If it falls within the minimum and maximum size range, the crimp 

is good. The go/no go gauge should come with the nicopress tool.



chris Sinfield wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 Another Q.

 What should they be pull tested to? I read that the cables only have to be 30lb tension but what should I pull test to, to make sure my sleeves are OK to use.?

 Chris.

 

 


	


-- 

Bryan Martin

Zenith 601XL N61BM

Ram Subaru, Stratus redrive

Do Not Archive

_________________
--
Bryan Martin
N61BM, CH 601 XL, Stratus Subaru.
do not archive.

John Bolding

Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 281

Posted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 3:44 pm Post subject: Are Copper Nico Sleeves OK?

Lots of folks do this but I stopped many yrs ago when I discovered a sleeve 

that was slipping under the heatshrink. The heatshrink was crinkled slightly 

which gave it away.  Now I put witness paint on the bitter end along with a 

little clear fingernail polish on the extreme end to keep it from 

unraveling.

LO&SLO   John

---

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