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john.marzulli(at)gmail.co
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 Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 7:47 am Post subject: Is this wing mod " do-able " |
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The owner of Kitfox once famously made a custom Kitfox biplane. A search in the archives should find it.
There are many things to consider such as the wing loading, center of lift, structural attachment points and control surface changes that will need to be considered for the project.
do not archive
On Thu, May 15, 2008 at 8:06 AM, kmccune <kmccune(at)somtel.net (kmccune(at)somtel.net)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> Zenith701801-List message posted by: "kmccune" <kmccune(at)somtel.net (kmccune(at)somtel.net)>
Hey nice table!
As for the biplane, of course you can make anything you want and you could even make it work well. But remember that it will no longer be a CH701. I would start from scratch before I'd modify the airframe that much. I have to admit a STOL biplane would be really cool.......
Just my $.01... not worth the full price [Wink]
Kevin
do not archive
--------
Mark Twain: Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=183294#183294
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--
John Marzulli
http://701Builder.blogspot.com/
http://www.GenevieveMarzulli.org/
http://www.JohnMarzulli.net/
"Flying a plane is no different than riding a bicycle... it's just a lot harder to put baseball cards in the spokes.
-Airplane The Movie [quote][b]
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kmccune
Joined: 22 Sep 2007
Posts: 577
Location: Wisconsin, USA
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jetboy
Joined: 22 Jul 2006
Posts: 233
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| Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 9:48 pm Post subject: Re: Is this wing mod |
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You mean a stub- wing like these: (trasavia pl12
http://www.pbase.com/geranio/image/57503157
They were a familiar sight in the late 70s in Australia & NZ
Ralph
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Ralph - CH701 / 2200a |
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ashontz
Joined: 27 Dec 2006
Posts: 723
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| Posted: Wed May 21, 2008 6:03 am Post subject: Re: Is this wing mod |
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I believe the idea behind biplanes in the first place was that at the time (early 1900s) not a lot of research was done on airfoils and generally airfoils were thin and limitied in lift until research showed that thicker airfoils created a lot more lift without much drag and also allowed for internal structure for strength (cantilever design). The idea behin biplanes was to increase lift via 2 sets of thin airfoil anemic lift wings. You don't need the addditional lift with that airfoil, if anything, you'd possibly make the plane considerably dangerous. Also, you'll notice with biplanes the wings are actually staggered somewhat which I believe keeps the wings from creating a large pressure related drag area from building up between the wings. If they're not staggered, that second wing may not provide any lift at all and just act as more drag. The fuselage design doesn't really allow for adding a staggered bottom wing anyway.
[quote="john.marzulli(at)gmail.co"]The owner of Kitfox once famously made a custom Kitfox biplane. A search in the archives should find it.
There are many things to consider such as the wing loading, center of lift, structural attachment points and control surface changes that will need to be considered for the project.
do not archive
On Thu, May 15, 2008 at 8:06 AM, kmccune <kmccune> wrote:
| Quote: | --> Zenith701801-List message posted by: "kmccune" <kmccune>
Hey nice table!
As for the biplane, of course you can make anything you want and you could even make it work well. But remember that it will no longer be a CH701. I would start from scratch before I'd modify the airframe that much. I have to admit a STOL biplane would be really cool.......
Just my $.01... not worth the full price [Wink]
Kevin
do not archive
--------
Mark Twain: Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=183294#183294
|
--
John Marzulli
http://701Builder.blogspot.com/
http://www.GenevieveMarzulli.org/
http://www.JohnMarzulli.net/
"Flying a plane is no different than riding a bicycle... it's just a lot harder to put baseball cards in the spokes.
-Airplane The Movie
| | - The Matronics Zenith701801-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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john.marzulli(at)gmail.co
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| Posted: Wed May 21, 2008 7:29 am Post subject: Is this wing mod " do-able " |
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That is absolutely true.
The problem gets even worse with triplanes. Recent studies have show that one wing was basically useless on the famous Fokker Triplane.
DO NOT ARCHIVE
On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 7:03 AM, ashontz <ashontz(at)nbme.org (ashontz(at)nbme.org)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> Zenith701801-List message posted by: "ashontz" <ashontz(at)nbme.org (ashontz(at)nbme.org)>
I believe the idea behind biplanes in the first place was that at the time (early 1900s) not a lot of research was done on airfoils and generally airfoils were thin and limitied in lift until research showed that thicker airfoils created a lot more lift without much drag and also allowed for internal structure for strength (cantilever design). The idea behin biplanes was to increase lift via 2 sets of thin airfoil anemic lift wings. You don't need the addditional lift with that airfoil, if anything, you'd possibly make the plane considerably dangerous. Also, you'll notice with biplanes the wings are actually staggered somewhat which I believe keeps the wings from creating a large pressure related drag area from building up between the wings. If they're not staggered, that second wing may not provide any lift at all and just act as more drag. The fuselage design doesn't really allow for adding a staggered bottom wing anyway.
[quote="john.marzulli(at)gmail.co"]The owner of Kitfox once famously made a custom Kitfox biplane. A search in the archives should find it.
There are many things to consider such as the wing loading, center of lift, structural attachment points and control surface changes that will need to be considered for the project.
do not archive
On Thu, May 15, 2008 at 8:06 AM, kmccune wrote:
> --> Zenith701801-List message posted by: "kmccune"
>
> Hey nice table!
>
> As for the biplane, of course you can make anything you want and you could even make it work well. But remember that it will no longer be a CH701. I would start from scratch before I'd modify the airframe that much. I have to admit a STOL biplane would be really cool.......
>
> Just my $.01... not worth the full price [Wink]
>
> Kevin
>
> do not archive
>
> --------
> Mark Twain: Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover.
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=183294#183294 (http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=183294#183294)
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
John Marzulli
http://701Builder.blogspot.com/ (http://701Builder.blogspot.com/)
http://www.GenevieveMarzulli.org/ (http://www.GenevieveMarzulli.org/)
http://www.JohnMarzulli.net/ (http://www.JohnMarzulli.net/)
"Flying a plane is no different than riding a bicycle... it's just a lot harder to put baseball cards in the spokes.
-Airplane The Movie
> [b]
--------
Andy Shontz
do not archive
CH601XL - Corvair
www.mykitlog.com/ashontz
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=184179#184179
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--
John Marzulli
http://701Builder.blogspot.com/
http://www.GenevieveMarzulli.org/
http://www.JohnMarzulli.net/
"Flying a plane is no different than riding a bicycle... it's just a lot harder to put baseball cards in the spokes.
-Airplane The Movie [quote][b]
| | - The Matronics Zenith701801-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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