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New FSDO and special airworthiness cert

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keithmckinley

Joined: 11 Aug 2008
Posts: 434

Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 5:19 pm Post subject: New FSDO and special airworthiness cert

Hello,



I'm a new CJ owner. This aircraft came from an airport under the Sacramento FSDO  which signed off on the current  ops limits and Airworthiness cert. I am now in the Windsor Locks area. Sent the FSDO my program letter and asked them to re-issue the ops limits. Almost a month later and no operating limitations and they want to inspect the A/C and re-issue my airworthiness cert. 



Is re-issuing the Airworthiness Cert a normal procedure? I thought these went with the aircraft? 



Do I need to just play nice?



Keith

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NebraskaYak

Joined: 02 Sep 2008
Posts: 31
Location: Nebraska

Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 6:11 pm Post subject: Re: New FSDO and special airworthiness cert

I had the same issue with my Yak. I played nice and it all went away in a month. What I did learn is there is not one FAA but many, each FSDO does its own little thing.

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keithmckinley

Joined: 11 Aug 2008
Posts: 434

Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 7:33 pm Post subject: Re: New FSDO and special airworthiness cert

fortunately I have some very minor gripes to work off on the airplane and I get to wash it,  BUT, man this is killin' me!



~K

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dsavarese0812(at)bellsout
Guest

Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2008 3:48 am Post subject: New FSDO and special airworthiness cert

Keith,

If the aircraft were registered in the Standard Category like a Cessna, 

Piper or Beechcraft, yes the airworthiness certificate would stay with the 

aircraft.  With our aircraft, FAA Order 8130.2F Chg 3 governs the process. 

Whenever the aircraft is moved from one homebase airport to another, it 

requires the reissuance of the Operating Limitations AND the Special 

Airworthiness Certificate.  The two documents are effectively "married" 

together.  And that includes a relocation to another home base airport, even 

if it is only 5 miles away.



Although you can't stop the inspector or FSDO from ever inspecting the 

airplane anytime, it should not be necessary if the airplane has a current 

annual condition inspection signed off in the aircraft's log books, and it 

already has the Special Airworthiness Certificate (which obviously it has). 

Usually, the only time a FSDO inspector typically gets involved with 

inspecting one of our aircraft is for the very first issuance of the 

airworthiness certificate and operating limitations.



Once the airplane has been issued its first set of OL's and Special 

Airworthiness Certificate, usually the FSDO only asks for copies of your log 

books showing the current condition inspection along with the OL's and 

Airworthiness Certificate and most importantly, the actual hard copy current 

registration which must show your present address, and he/she will issue the 

new OL's and Special Airworthiness Certificate.



You could ask a legitimate question like, "Since the airplane presently has 

an annual condition inspection as documented in the airplane's log books and 

it was already issued OL's and a Special Airworthiness Certificate from it's 

previous location, why is it necessary to reinspect the airplane?  Not that 

it matters, but I'm just curious why?"   Many of these airplanes are 

relocated each year and the people who own them have had the OL's and 

Special Airworthiness Certificate reissued as required by FAA Order 8130.2F 

Chg 3.  But there was no mandatory requirement to reinspect an airplane that 

already has a current annual condition inspection signed off by an A&P, who 

is an FAA authorized inspector.



Many FSDO inspectors do not understand what is required for Experimental 

Exhibition category airplanes.  Sometimes they are all over the map and make 

your experience with them very frustrating.  Try to work with them by being 

knowledgeable (like you are trying to do now) and suggest that you can point 

them to other FSDO inspectors who have done many of these types of aircraft, 

thus shortening the paperwork processing cycle.  But as I said, if they want 

to inspect, let them.  They have the right to do it.



As I previously mentioned, be sure the aircraft's registration is current. 

If not, they can not issue the OL's and Special Airworthiness Certificate. 

Also make sure the new OL's that will be issued do not have the 300 NM 

proficiency area anywhere in them.  That was rescinded on September 11, 2007 

by Memorandum, see attached.

Dennis



---

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keith(at)mckinley.us
Guest

Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2008 5:11 am Post subject: New FSDO and special airworthiness cert

Great post Dennis!



Thanks!



Keith



On Sep 5, 2008, at 7:47 AM, A. Dennis Savarese wrote:



[quote] Keith,

 If the aircraft were registered in the Standard Category like a  

 Cessna, Piper or Beechcraft, yes the airworthiness certificate  

 would stay with the aircraft.  With our aircraft, FAA Order 8130.2F  

 Chg 3 governs the process. Whenever the aircraft is moved from one  

 homebase airport to another, it requires the reissuance of the  

 Operating Limitations AND the Special Airworthiness Certificate.   

 The two documents are effectively "married" together.  And that  

 includes a relocation to another home base airport, even if it is  

 only 5 miles away.



 Although you can't stop the inspector or FSDO from ever inspecting  

 the airplane anytime, it should not be necessary if the airplane  

 has a current annual condition inspection signed off in the  

 aircraft's log books, and it already has the Special Airworthiness  

 Certificate (which obviously it has). Usually, the only time a FSDO  

 inspector typically gets involved with inspecting one of our  

 aircraft is for the very first issuance of the airworthiness  

 certificate and operating limitations.



 Once the airplane has been issued its first set of OL's and Special  

 Airworthiness Certificate, usually the FSDO only asks for copies of  

 your log books showing the current condition inspection along with  

 the OL's and Airworthiness Certificate and most importantly, the  

 actual hard copy current registration which must show your present  

 address, and he/she will issue the new OL's and Special  

 Airworthiness Certificate.



 You could ask a legitimate question like, "Since the airplane  

 presently has an annual condition inspection as documented in the  

 airplane's log books and it was already issued OL's and a Special  

 Airworthiness Certificate from it's previous location, why is it  

 necessary to reinspect the airplane?  Not that it matters, but I'm  

 just curious why?"   Many of these airplanes are relocated each  

 year and the people who own them have had the OL's and Special  

 Airworthiness Certificate reissued as required by FAA Order 8130.2F  

 Chg 3.  But there was no mandatory requirement to reinspect an  

 airplane that already has a current annual condition inspection  

 signed off by an A&P, who is an FAA authorized inspector.



 Many FSDO inspectors do not understand what is required for  

 Experimental Exhibition category airplanes.  Sometimes they are all  

 over the map and make your experience with them very frustrating.   

 Try to work with them by being knowledgeable (like you are trying  

 to do now) and suggest that you can point them to other FSDO  

 inspectors who have done many of these types of aircraft, thus  

 shortening the paperwork processing cycle.  But as I said, if they  

 want to inspect, let them.  They have the right to do it.



 As I previously mentioned, be sure the aircraft's registration is  

 current. If not, they can not issue the OL's and Special  

 Airworthiness Certificate. Also make sure the new OL's that will be  

 issued do not have the 300 NM proficiency area anywhere in them.   

 That was rescinded on September 11, 2007 by Memorandum, see attached.

 Dennis



 ---

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