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VDC Battery Minders

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bicyclop(at)pacbell.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Sep 30, 2008 1:51 pm Post subject: VDC Battery Minders

Howdy,



Just got off the phone with the tech rep at VDC. Had a chat about the 

difference between the "aviation adjusted" charger and the straight 

12248. He says that the aviation specific batteries, ie; Concorde and 

Gill, use a chemistry with a higher concentration of acid than other 

batteries and require a different charge profile. He said that the 

voltage is slightly lower and the time in the second phase of the charge 

cycle is longer, and the voltage in the float is lower. The de-sulfation 

circuit is exactly the same in all the models.



They also make a model of this charger specific to the Hawker Odyssey 

battery which wants a higher charge voltage and specific charging 

profile because of the pure lead used for the plates. They also have a 

model for the Optima battery with it's own charging profile. He said 

that these are all settable inside the unit via dip switch setting, but 

not user accessible. I bet you'd void the warranty if you played around 

with it.



He stated that leaving any battery hooked up to the wrong profile 

charger for an extended period of time, say more than 3 months, would 

damage it. That being said, he agreed that almost any sort of smart 

charger would work for the occasional recharge of a battery kept 

reasonably charged by it's vehicle or after a discharge capacity test. 

If a battery were to be left hooked up the the straight 12248 charger 

for a longer term float, one could mitigate the potential damage by 

setting to the "Gell cell" setting which floats at a lower voltage and 

wouldn't cook the battery off.



I told him that I didn't want to have to buy 3 or 4 chargers do do all 

this. The key is that I fly often, nearly daily in fact. Most of the 

people, to whom they sell chargers, don't and want something to keep 

their batteries in tip-top shape even if they can't afford the avgas to 

keep them charged up. He agreed with me, that for my purposes and taking 

into account how I use a charger, that the 12248 would be the most 

versatile of their offerings. The chargers sense ambient temperature and 

so the $20 temp probe is of limited value is what we agreed. Your 

mileage may vary.



By the way, the 12248 is on sale now at Northern Tool for $85, $15 less 

than their regular price and a bunch cheaper than anywhere else I could 

find. They, and VDC for that matter, have been out of stock, but the guy 

said that Northern should be getting theirs in within a week.



Pax,



Ed Holyoke

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ed(at)muellerartcover.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Sep 30, 2008 3:52 pm Post subject: VDC Battery Minders

I think I've voided more warranties then I can remember.



I wonder if a nice 4 position switch would give it a lot of versatility.



Ed



On Sep 30, 2008, at 5:45 PM, Ed Holyoke wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 <bicyclop(at)pacbell.net>



 Howdy,



 Just got off the phone with the tech rep at VDC. Had a chat about the 

 difference between the "aviation adjusted" charger and the straight 

 12248. He says that the aviation specific batteries, ie; Concorde and 

 Gill, use a chemistry with a higher concentration of acid than other 

 batteries and require a different charge profile. He said that the 

 voltage is slightly lower and the time in the second phase of the 

 charge cycle is longer, and the voltage in the float is lower. The 

 de-sulfation circuit is exactly the same in all the models.



 They also make a model of this charger specific to the Hawker Odyssey 

 battery which wants a higher charge voltage and specific charging 

 profile because of the pure lead used for the plates. They also have a 

 model for the Optima battery with it's own charging profile. He said 

 that these are all settable inside the unit via dip switch setting, 

 but not user accessible. I bet you'd void the warranty if you played 

 around with it.



 He stated that leaving any battery hooked up to the wrong profile 

 charger for an extended period of time, say more than 3 months, would 

 damage it. That being said, he agreed that almost any sort of smart 

 charger would work for the occasional recharge of a battery kept 

 reasonably charged by it's vehicle or after a discharge capacity test. 

 If a battery were to be left hooked up the the straight 12248 charger 

 for a longer term float, one could mitigate the potential damage by 

 setting to the "Gell cell" setting which floats at a lower voltage and 

 wouldn't cook the battery off.



 I told him that I didn't want to have to buy 3 or 4 chargers do do all 

 this. The key is that I fly often, nearly daily in fact. Most of the 

 people, to whom they sell chargers, don't and want something to keep 

 their batteries in tip-top shape even if they can't afford the avgas 

 to keep them charged up. He agreed with me, that for my purposes and 

 taking into account how I use a charger, that the 12248 would be the 

 most versatile of their offerings. The chargers sense ambient 

 temperature and so the $20 temp probe is of limited value is what we 

 agreed. Your mileage may vary.



 By the way, the 12248 is on sale now at Northern Tool for $85, $15 

 less than their regular price and a bunch cheaper than anywhere else I 

 could find. They, and VDC for that matter, have been out of stock, but 

 the guy said that Northern should be getting theirs in within a week.



 Pax,



 Ed Holyoke

- The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum -

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

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nuckolls.bob(at)cox.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Sep 30, 2008 5:53 pm Post subject: VDC Battery Minders

At 02:45 PM 9/30/2008 -0700, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  



Howdy,



Just got off the phone with the tech rep at VDC. Had a chat about the 

difference between the "aviation adjusted" charger and the straight 12248. 

He says that the aviation specific batteries, ie; Concorde and Gill, use a 

chemistry with a higher concentration of acid than other batteries and 

require a different charge profile. He said that the voltage is slightly 

lower and the time in the second phase of the charge cycle is longer, and 

the voltage in the float is lower. The de-sulfation circuit is exactly the 

same in all the models.



They also make a model of this charger specific to the Hawker Odyssey 

battery which wants a higher charge voltage and specific charging profile 

because of the pure lead used for the plates. They also have a model for 

the Optima battery with it's own charging profile. He said that these are 

all settable inside the unit via dip switch setting, but not user 

accessible. I bet you'd void the warranty if you played around with it.



He stated that leaving any battery hooked up to the wrong profile charger 

for an extended period of time, say more than 3 months, would damage it. 

That being said, he agreed that almost any sort of smart charger would 

work for the occasional recharge of a battery kept reasonably charged by 

it's vehicle or after a discharge capacity test. If a battery were to be 

left hooked up the the straight 12248 charger for a longer term float, one 

could mitigate the potential damage by setting to the "Gell cell" setting 

which floats at a lower voltage and wouldn't cook the battery off.



I told him that I didn't want to have to buy 3 or 4 chargers do do all 

this. The key is that I fly often, nearly daily in fact. Most of the 

people, to whom they sell chargers, don't and want something to keep their 

batteries in tip-top shape even if they can't afford the avgas to keep 

them charged up. He agreed with me, that for my purposes and taking into 

account how I use a charger, that the 12248 would be the most versatile of 

their offerings. The chargers sense ambient temperature and so the $20 

temp probe is of limited value is what we agreed. Your mileage may vary.



By the way, the 12248 is on sale now at Northern Tool for $85, $15 less 

than their regular price and a bunch cheaper than anywhere else I could 

find. They, and VDC for that matter, have been out of stock, but the guy 

said that Northern should be getting theirs in within a week.


	


    The only reason to put any kind of charger on an

    RG battery is because you ran it down accidently

    and you want to get it back to 80% or more capacity

    before you fly again.



    The self discharge rate on an RG battery is so low

    that you should be able to put your airplane away

    in the fall and come back next spring to crank it right

    up.



    If one insists on plugging the battery in for storage

    every night and the battery was put away charged, the

    charger won't even have a chance to do a full blown

    recharge, top-off-drop-to-float cycle. This

    slicing and dicing of float voltage from a charger

    is mostly smoke and mirrors. Open circuit on a SVLA

    battery at room temperature is right at 13.0 volts.

    Ideal float voltage would be right at 13.0 volts too.

    All you're wanting to do is externally offset the

    internal leakage of the battery. Now if you really

    screw up and float it at say 13.4 volts, the current

    that flows into the battery will be somewhere around

    30 mA on a 17 a.h. battery.



    If you plan on routinely abusing the battery with

    the "wrong charger" then perhaps there is value in

    fine tuning the product. Keep in mind that your

    airplane's electrical system really sucks for

    air as a charging system. The alternator runs full-out

    at recharge at top-off voltage until the recharge current

    "breaks". Top-off voltage is maintained until engine

    shut down. Typical recharge current after 2 hours of

    flight will be on the order of 100 to 500 mA. No pampering

    of the battery with a "float voltage" while in flight!



    If I were chartered with crafting a new regulator

    design, it would be software driven and have

    some smarts that drops to a float voltage after

    recharge is assured . . . increase in service life?

    No idea. Won't launch into a $100K$ test program to

    prove it one way or another.



    I'll suggest that spending the $time$ to optimize

    the recharging/maintaining of batteries in airplanes

    is a lousy return on investment. If your battery

    fails to meet manufacturer's fondest wishes

    for a laboratory-pure service life, it's because

    you have it bolted to an airplane . . . not because

    you've charged it with the wrong charger.



    Batteries used for motive power (golf carts, trolling,

    weed eaters, etc) are another matter. These spend 99%

    of their time on a charger getting replenished from

    a deep-cycle service. You MIGHT see a couple more passes

    around the yard or one more trip out onto the pond

    by fine tuning the technology in the charger.



    If you have a dead battery, charge it with ANYTHING

    and go fly. If you're storing a battery for less than

    60 days, don't beat it up with an unnecessary, less-than-

    ideal charger. If you're storing over the winter,

    take the battery home and put it on a Battery Tender

    out in the garage until spring.



    Bob . . .

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