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EAFerguson(at)aol.com
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 Posted: Sat Jan 10, 2009 4:31 pm Post subject: Rough landings |
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In a message dated 1/10/2009 3:07:26 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, pennington(at)q.com writes:
| Quote: | Later, after thinking about the flight , I remembered that under similar atmospheric conditions in my other planes, I would typically use only 10 degrees of flaps and slightly higher approach speeds which allowed a better descent and landing. So, let me ask the experts...."What scenario would you have used under these circumstances"?
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This will surely generate some useful postings. Here's my take for Buz and anybody else with strong opinions to comment upon.
I've had several landings where rough air was a factor. One of note at New Orleans Lakefront airport where I was on the ground rolling out and a gust picked me up about 10'. Added lots of power and went around. Jaburu engine responded with no hesitation, for which I was grateful. Second attempt was almost as rough, but we stayed on the ground. Logged two landings!
In cases like this approach I carry some power on final. That almost requires full flaps or you will float forever. Cut power when stable just above the runway. Hit the flaps up button immediately after touch down to kill lift. Always use long runways, (well try to).
The important point to make here is that the Lightning is a very light aircraft, and it responds more to gusts than heavier types. The gear legs are springy too, and it will bounce. In rough air expect the worst and be prepared to go around as Gary correctly did.
The recent discussion on engines quitting on final is also important. A porpoise with the prop stopped would be a disaster. SO put Mark's extra collar on the throttle cable (I admit I haven't done that yet, but I will).
My hint on rough air takeoffs: Hold it on the ground until 3-5 mph above normal liftoff speed, then pull up to quickly put 10'+ between you and the runway.
OK guys, the firing range is open.
Earl Ferguson
New year...new news. Be the first to know what is making headlines.
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N1BZRich(at)aol.com
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| Posted: Sat Jan 10, 2009 7:37 pm Post subject: Rough landings |
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In a message dated 1/10/2009 7:32:22 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, EAFerguson(at)aol.com writes:
| Quote: | | The gear legs are springy too, and it will bounce. |
Hey World Record Earl,
Good to hear from you. I pretty much agree with all you mentioned except for one part - I do not agree that "springy gear legs" cause an airplane to bounce back in the air on landings. Here are my thoughts on bounced landings:
Bounced landings result from one of the following three things:
1 - the pilot does not arrest the descent by flaring properly and the airplane impacts hard and then rebounds - has to do with the improper flare and not the springy gear legs.
2 - the pilot attempts to touch down at too great an airspeed, while the wing is still developing excess lift and the aircraft skips back into the air - again, not the result of springy gear legs.
3 - the pilot relaxes elevator back pressure at the point of touchdown, reducing the wing's angle of attack from a previously stalled condition to one that will generate enough lift to put the airplane momentarily back into the air.
Now, having said the above, I also must tell everyone that based on you holding a world record in your Lightning, and the fact that you have an "advanced chronology" in years, that I normally pretty much agree with you. But, for those of you that don't know Earl, he was probably not involved in building the pyramids in Egypt, but I think he was a member of their design team. 
Blue Skies,
Buz
PS: Maybe when Nick completes the "drop test" for the upcoming SLSA Lightning he will post the video on their web site. I think that the Lightning's "springy gear legs" will not bounce the Lightning no matter how high they drop it from. They may bend out of shape, but I really doubt it will really bounce.
New year...new news. Be the first to know what is making headlines.
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pennington(at)q.com
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| Posted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 4:48 am Post subject: Rough landings |
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<?xml:namespace prefix="v" /><?xml:namespace prefix="o" /><![endif]--> Good morning Earl
Thanks for the tips. Yesterdays turbulence was probably the most bone jarring I have ever flown through. The weather was very deceiving....no wind, no clouds and clear blue skies.
Have a great day.
Gary Pennington
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EAFerguson(at)aol.com
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| Posted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 5:50 am Post subject: Rough landings |
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In a message dated 1/10/2009 10:38:07 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, N1BZRich(at)aol.com writes:
| Quote: | Hey World Record Earl,
Good to hear from you. I pretty much agree with all you mentioned except for one part - I do not agree that "springy gear legs" cause an airplane to bounce back in the air on landings. Here are my thoughts on bounced landings:
Bounced landings result from one of the following three things:
1 - the pilot does not arrest the descent by flaring properly and the airplane impacts hard and then rebounds - has to do with the improper flare and not the springy gear legs.
2 - the pilot attempts to touch down at too great an airspeed, while the wing is still developing excess lift and the aircraft skips back into the air - again, not the result of springy gear legs.
3 - the pilot relaxes elevator back pressure at the point of touchdown, reducing the wing's angle of attack from a previously stalled condition to one that will generate enough lift to put the airplane momentarily back into the air.
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I knew that was coming! Choice #1 on Buz's list is exactly correct. However, in rough air it's difficult to execute correctly when you are bouncing up and down.
I'm planning to witness the drop test, but it will be a max gross and you won't bounce at that loading. It is more likely to happen with one person up and light fuel load at the end of a flight . Buz, of course weighs way more than I do.
OK Buz, it's your turn!
Earl
New year...new news. Be the first to know what is making headlines.
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