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N1BZRich(at)aol.com
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 Posted: Sat Jan 10, 2009 1:33 pm Post subject: turbulant landing |
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Gary,
What were the actual winds? Degrees off the runway, variable heading, gust factor, etc. Which airport in Tucson were you using? Hey, overall you did a good job. You knew to go around when things didn't look good and you finally got it down safely. Who cares what it looked like it nothing got bent.
Buz
New year...new news. Be the first to know what is making headlines.
[quote][b]
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pennington(at)q.com
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| Posted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 5:08 am Post subject: turbulant landing |
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<?xml:namespace prefix="v" /><?xml:namespace prefix="o" /><![endif]--> Good morning Buz
Thanks for your response.
When I lifted off, winds were North at five, clear blue skies. While aloft, I was too busy trying to hold my plane in the air and upright to notice the winds shown on the EFIS. At the moment I experienced the extremely turbulent updrafts, I was abeam the numbers. That is also the time I begin to drop flaps and reduce throttle for my descent. I'm thinking that with the updrafts and flaps deployed, the lift was just too great to allow a descent. Hence, on my third attempt with no flaps, no power and pushing the nose over, I was able to descend. Mother Nature is a powerful force and she is still in charge. I was at Marana Regional Airport.
Have a great day.
Gary
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dashvii(at)hotmail.com
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| Posted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 12:54 pm Post subject: turbulant landing |
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Gary C
In the situation that you described I would normally use no flaps. It's really important if you have gusty conditions. I would then add speed to compensate for my lack of flaps C and add half the gust factor more. (if you have 15 Gusting 25 C then add 10 knots of airspeed) I hear what some have said about floating and such and now you're adding airspeed. The flaps out on a really gusty day are going to make things ten times harder though. If you practice and plan your no flap landings the Lightning will do it just fine. Even with the extra speed you could very easily get down and stopped on a 4 C000 foot long runway without upping the pucker factor too much.
A few stories that I will pass on about interesting landings:
Flying out of Embry-Riddle in Daytona Beach was always an interesting thing. With about 2 C500 training flights a day it was one of the busiest airports in the world. It reminds me of flying out of Atlanta with 20 people on extended final flying parallel approaches into the parallel runways. We often had controllers squeeze us in between aircraft on final and shuffle us around based on how far the other aircraft were in front of us. One particular time I turned final in a Cessna 172S and we had a turbo Seneca twin in front. He was trying to speed up the Seneca that was barely in the air. He asked me to give him best forward speed. I went right to 129 knots forward speed and to my amazement our ground speed was 165 knots! The controller thanked me and asked me to slow when I closed up that gap C but also wanted to know what kind of Cessna 172 would do a 190 MPH! I know what you're thinking C why was he landing with a tailwind C but if you live on the coast in Florida you know that the winds 20 miles out C such as where final started can be completely different than the coast where you typically get a sea breeze.
Another time I was in a Cessna and the guy in front of us was lingering in the air. We were on instrument approach and had been on a long night flight. We were completely visual at this point and shooting the approach for practice. Well C the controller came on and asked if we could go visual and start a climb same heading and he'd bring us back around to the FAF. I started my climb and intentionally tried to maintain the least ground speed as possible. We got about 2 C000 feet down the runway and were at 1 C500 feet when the controller said C "if you can get it down you're cleared to land." I told him we could if he could grant us a long landing C which he did. (10.5k long runway) I chopped the power to idle C slowed the aircraft down C and put it in a severe side slip until just before landing. We made the midfield taxiway easily.
My worst time trying to get a plane on the ground was probably again C in a Cessna C when I was a Jr. in High School. It can be extremely windy C and gusty in the plains part of Arkansas where I grew up. This happens even more during winter as far as frequency C although we have recorded 100+ MPH straight line winds on multiple occassions ahead of a storm front. I took off C just fine C flew around a while C and coming back in for landing I noticed that I was hauling on downwind and it was bumpy. Turning final I was going up and down. I went around and tried again. This time C no flaps C forward speed up a little. We had winds gusting from 25-45 which was causing some great discomfort on the part of the pilot. The winds weren't straight aligned with the runway either. I got it down fine C but that was a very uncomfortable experience for a young pilot.
My final story is one with a Lightning. I had been flying for several hours and saw a storm coming. I wanted to get as much time as possible in that day so I stayed up. I looked again in about 10 minutes and it was coming a lot faster than I thought. I headed towards the airport as this gust front was approaching. I entered downwind and listened to the ASOS. This was a gust front approaching and it was starting to get really rough aand the sky was turning black. I turned final and I could tell that the winds were switching on me C but I could also see lightning and start to see rain. I wanted to get down on this go if at all possible. I landed with about a 20 knot tailwind and got back to the hangar just as it started to pour.
I believe that if you had your engine stop and then didn't stick the landing then you can be fine. If you want to know how C go out and get your tailwheel endorsement. Brian W.
From: pennington(at)q.com
To: lightning-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: turbulant landing
Date: Sun C 11 Jan 2009 06:07:29 -0700
Good morning Buz
Thanks for your response.
When I lifted off C winds were North at five C clear blue skies. While aloft C I was too busy trying to hold my plane in the air and upright to notice the winds shown on the EFIS. At the moment I experienced the extremely turbulent updrafts C I was abeam the numbers. That is also the time I begin to drop flaps and reduce throttle for my descent. I'm thinking that with the updrafts and flaps deployed C the lift was just too great to allow a descent. Hence C on my third attempt with no flaps C no power and pushing the nose over C I was able to descend. Mother Nature is a powerful force and she is still in charge. I was at Marana Regional Airport.
Have a great day.
Gary
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pennington(at)q.com
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| Posted: Mon Jan 12, 2009 5:58 am Post subject: turbulant landing |
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<?xml:namespace prefix="v" /><?xml:namespace prefix="o" /><![endif]--> Good morning Brian
Thank you for responding. I am headed out to the airport this morning to practice various scenarios and will try your recommendations.
Thanks again and have a great day.
Gary Pennington
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Clive J
Joined: 03 Nov 2007
Posts: 340
Location: UK
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| Posted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 11:34 am Post subject: turbulant landing |
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Gary, sounds like an exciting ride!
My only thought, not knowing the topography was would there have been
somewhere else to go that wouldn't have been so turbulent?. I've just
been surfing Google Earth and maps and it seems to be a fairly hilly
area so that probably wasn't an option for you.
I've only once been caught as you describe. Returning from France to my
home field in the East of England we'd been flying for two hours and
knew there was a storm front moving SE towards our destination. I was
monitoring the ATIS at my local municipal (west of destination) and
there was a steady 8 knots blowing all the while we moved up from the
Channel towards home. When we were 30 miles out it started to get a
little bumpy and then the ATIS swiftly changed to 20 gusting 40 or
somesuch. We turned back to the last airfield we'd flown over to sit it
out only to find I could get anywhere near the ground in enough control
to land.
Only solution was to move further away from the weather and out run it.
15 miles further east is was still a little windy but the gusting was
much reduced and we managed it OK despite a hefty crosswind.
The wife had asked after two approaches to the gusty runway, what do we
do now? I confidently said 'we've enough fuel to get back to France' to
put her at ease and make me feel better, hoping that we could get away
from the front far enough to some smooth air. I was lucky as it was the
case. Also a point to add is the biggest hill in Norfolk UK is 280 feet!
We ate our lunch and flew home 2 hours later in a still air.
As was said before, a slap from Mother nature isn't so pleasant! Another
I learned about flying from that.....
Thanks for sharing yours.
Regards, Clive
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pennington(at)q.com
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| Posted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 4:50 pm Post subject: turbulant landing |
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<?xml:namespace prefix="v" /><?xml:namespace prefix="o" /><![endif]--> Hello Clive
It was good to hear from you and thanks for sharing with me. I hope your day is great.
Gary
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dashvii(at)hotmail.com
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 4:44 pm Post subject: turbulant landing |
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Buz C
You didn't happen to know the pilot C Chesley "Sully" Sullenberger C in the US Air 1549 crash did you? I saw he was an AF F-4 pilot and Academy grad. Looks like he did an awesome job of flying the aircraft as far into the crash as possible. Brian W.
From: pennington(at)q.com
To: lightning-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: turbulant landing
Date: Wed C 14 Jan 2009 17:49:30 -0700
Hello Clive
It was good to hear from you and thanks for sharing with me. I hope your day is great.
Gary
[quote] ---
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N1BZRich(at)aol.com
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| Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 8:04 am Post subject: turbulant landing |
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Hi Brian,
No, I do not know him. But I agree that he did a fantastic job. I am thinking he should now get a "seaplane" rating. He already has one water landing logged.
Blue Skies,
Buz
A Good Credit Score013x1201028747/aol?redir=http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072%26hmpgID=62%26bcd=DecemailfooterNO62"> See yours in just 2 easy steps!
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