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williamtsullivan(at)ATT.N
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 Posted: Thu Apr 09, 2009 4:19 am Post subject: Stits |
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I am doing some planning before ordering the stits materials for the Firestar. Has anyone used the lightweight fabric- 1.7 ounce? How was the durability? Both sets of the previous coverings were 2.7 ounce. One was Aerothane, and one was Polytone. UV protection is not a prime concern in Connecticut, so I can go with the lighter weight paint jobs. I am going to go with Polytone, not only for weight but for ease of application and repair. Also, I hold the record for bad paint jobs.
Also, if I cover the pod, should I use the heavier fabric there? Lots of minor bashing could be expected while climbing in and out, and abrasion from leaning into it.
Another question, not mentioned in the book- What about UV protection on the inside of the pod fabric? There is no mention of the exterior coating protecting all the way through, and the fabric there is exposed to more sunlight.
Bill Sullivan
Windsor Locks, Ct.
FS 447
[quote][b]
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mdnanwelch7(at)hotmail.co
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| Posted: Thu Apr 09, 2009 4:48 am Post subject: Stits |
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Bill C
I have a LOT of 1.7 oz Poly Fiber left over from my MkIII build. When I first bought my plane from Kolb C the fabric choice was to use 1.7 oz. Later C 2.7 was found to be a better choice for the MkIII. So C I bought lots more fabric (at) 2.7 oz.
I have not taken the time to figure out how much of the 1.7 oz stuff I have C but it appears to be quite a bit. If you're interested C I'd sell it to you at a good price. Send me an email off-list to discuss it C if you want.
I don't think 2.7 oz would be necessary for the fuselage. For rubbing C I don't think it matters much. For a puncture C whatever would poke a hole in 1.7 will surely poke a hole in 2.7.
Yes C I felt the Poly Spray UV coating was more important inside the cabin C compared to the outside. It seems like it would get more sun. I put Poly Spray on ALL my Poly Fabric. 3 coats on the sunny side of the wings C 2 on the bottom C etc.
Mike Welch
do not archive
Date: Thu C 9 Apr 2009 05:14:03 -0700
From: williamtsullivan(at)ATT.NET
Subject: Stits
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
I am doing some planning before ordering the stits materials for the Firestar. Has anyone used the lightweight fabric- 1.7 ounce? How was the durability? Both sets of the previous coverings were 2.7 ounce. One was Aerothane C and one was Polytone. UV protection is not a prime concern in Connecticut C so I can go with the lighter weight paint jobs. I am going to go with Polytone C not only for weight but for ease of application and repair. Also C I hold the record for bad paint jobs.
Also C if I cover the pod C should I use the heavier fabric there? Lots of minor bashing could be expected while climbing in and out C and abrasion from leaning into it.
Another question C not mentioned in the book- What about UV protection on the inside of the pod fabric? There is no mention of the exterior coating protecting all the way through C and the fabric there is exposed to more sunlight.
Bill Sullivan
Windsor Locks C Ct.
FS 447
Windows Live™ SkyDrive: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Check it out. [quote][b]
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frank.goodnight(at)att.ne
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| Posted: Thu Apr 09, 2009 6:05 am Post subject: Stits |
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Hi William ; I covered my firestar 2 with 1.7 oz fabric about a year ago. I fold , unfold, and trailer my
plane every time I fly. I know it's my fault , but it seems like I get a new ,bang, bump , cut,
scrape, or ding every week. 2.7 may not help much but it sure can't hurt. If I were doing it
over again I would use 2.7oz.
I don't know much about a/c covering but I would use polytone because it's easy to repair
and I'm not interested in pretty or shiny. As for uv protection- the whole covering and paint
process- was enough of a pain in the butt that I would use plenty of silver so I would not
have to recover for a LONG LONG time.
I did not cover my cage and don't use a nose bowl or windscreen. The main trouble with
with that is the wind noise interfears with my hand held radio. The A/C flys fine. Maybe
some ultra star drivers can help [ please] .
I share your thoughts about cage cover and uv protection . Why protect the outside of
the fabric when the sun shines on the inside and destroys the fabric from there?
Frank Goodnight
Firstar 2
HKS 75 hrs
On Apr 9, 2009, at 7:14 AM, william sullivan wrote:
[quote] I am doing some planning before ordering the stits materials for the Firestar. Has anyone used the lightweight fabric- 1.7 ounce? How was the durability? Both sets of the previous coverings were 2.7 ounce. One was Aerothane, and one was Polytone. UV protection is not a prime concern in Connecticut, so I can go with the lighter weight paint jobs. I am going to go with Polytone, not only for weight but for ease of application and repair. Also, I hold the record for bad paint jobs.
Also, if I cover the pod, should I use the heavier fabric there? Lots of minor bashing could be expected while climbing in and out, and abrasion from leaning into it.
Another question, not mentioned in the book- What about UV protection on the inside of the pod fabric? There is no mention of the exterior coating protecting all the way through, and the fabric there is exposed to more sunlight.
Bill Sullivan
Windsor Locks, Ct.
FS 447
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williamtsullivan(at)att.n
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| Posted: Thu Apr 09, 2009 10:20 am Post subject: stits |
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Frank- No nose cone on the FS II? What do you use for an instrument panel? Dana flies an Ultrastar without a nose cone or windshield. Visibility unlimited.
Bill Sullivan
Windsor Locks, Ct.
FS 447
[quote][b]
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frank.goodnight(at)att.ne
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| Posted: Thu Apr 09, 2009 10:49 am Post subject: stits |
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Bill, I built a small alu box that is between my knees, just forward of the stick [copy of the one Bryan built for the firefly that won 1st place at sun & fun last year ] it holds my ASI, ALT.Skidball&compass . My EIS & switches are mounted in a 3 x 6 box that is mounted just forward of the
throttle and is level with the top cage rail .it is outside the cage.
Frank Goodnight
Firestar2
HKS 75 hrs
On Apr 9, 2009, at 1:16 PM, william sullivan wrote:
[quote] Frank- No nose cone on the FS II? What do you use for an instrument panel? Dana flies an Ultrastar without a nose cone or windshield. Visibility unlimited.
Bill Sullivan
Windsor Locks, Ct.
FS 447
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williamtsullivan(at)att.n
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| Posted: Thu Apr 09, 2009 11:34 am Post subject: stits |
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Frank- Interesting arrangement. What's your cruise speed? Wind in your face bother you, with no cone or shield? FS II is a lot faster than an Ultrastar.
Bill Sullivan
Windsor Locks, Ct
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slyck(at)frontiernet.net
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| Posted: Thu Apr 09, 2009 11:50 am Post subject: stits |
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Frank- Interesting arrangement. What's your cruise speed? Wind in
your face bother you, with no cone or shield? FS II is a lot faster
than an Ultrastar.
Not always. Ed Steuber's US was fast. Haven't heard from him since
he got a steady job.
BB
ed's ultra
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frank.goodnight(at)att.ne
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| Posted: Thu Apr 09, 2009 12:18 pm Post subject: stits |
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Bill I don't really have a cruise speed dialed in yet , depends on what I"m doing. most of thetime ,slow flight,various stalls,turns about a point,landing off airport, just learning about my
a/c and learning how to fly again after 35 years of being earthbound. 40 to 60 mph is the
range. My longest flight to date was about 100 miles one way I didn't try to maintain a cruise speed 55 mph was about my average.
the wind is not a problem except for the handheld radio[ unless it's cold ]. A lot of my time
is in a benson gyro so I learned to like the open air.
Frank Goodnight
Firestar 2
Brownville,TX
Do not archive
On Apr 9, 2009, at 2:32 PM, william sullivan wrote:
| Quote: | Frank- Interesting arrangement. What's your cruise speed? Wind in your face bother you, with no cone or shield? FS II is a lot faster than an Ultrastar.
Bill Sullivan
Windsor Locks, Ct.
FS 447
| Quote: |
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[quote][b]
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Dana
Joined: 13 Dec 2007
Posts: 1047
Location: Connecticut, USA
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| Posted: Thu Apr 09, 2009 1:24 pm Post subject: stits |
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At 03:32 PM 4/9/2009, william sullivan wrote:
| Quote: | ...Wind in your face bother you, with no cone or shield? FS II is a
lot faster than an Ultrastar.
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In the UltraStar, I wouldn't say the wind _bothers_ me, per se, but it's
fatiguing after awhile. I always fly with some kind of glasses, though,
either sunglasses or clear safety glasses... not only do my eyes tear too
much otherwise, not to mention that a bug'd be painful at 50mph!.
I do have a clear face shield for my helmet, but I was careless with it and
it got scratched... I've since polished it out but I haven't flown again
since then (but Spring's here, yee hah!)
-Dana
--
Change is inevitable, except from a vending machine.
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williamtsullivan(at)att.n
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| Posted: Fri Apr 10, 2009 1:02 pm Post subject: Stits |
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Mike and I were talking off List about the large price difference between ACS cheap 1.8 ounce Dacron, and the Poly Fiber 1.7 ounce at twice the price. Does anyone know why the large difference? Quality control? Does anyone have any experience comparing the two?
Bill Sullivan
Windsor Locks, Conn.
FS 447
[quote][b]
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herbgh(at)nctc.com
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| Posted: Fri Apr 10, 2009 5:20 pm Post subject: Stits |
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reminds me of a story...
fellow comes , with his young daughter ,, from New York(naturally)
 ... to Shelbyville Tenn...Wanting to buy a walking horse for the
young girl....He looked around and found and all black one ...for
25,000 dollars...Looked him over really good and asked " fine horse;
don't you have anything better?'" Come back tomorrow the owner said....
That night they painted the lower legs white...and sold the
horse for 35000.;...
I have used the 1.8 or 1.7 uncert...for 4 projects now...works
good... I tend to think that the heavier the fabric , the more
poly this and that it takes .
A Firefly needs its fabric treated with a 50-50 mix of brush
and spray...after the first coat of poly brush is applied in the
normal way...and use 50-50 til you are satisfied that the uv
protection is good... Two cross coats is good enough IMHO
.. you are trying to make weight after all... and this stuff does add wt...
the cost difference is because of the paper trail that certified
fabric must have I think...mainly... Herb
do not archive...
At 03:59 PM 4/10/2009, you wrote:
| Quote: | Mike and I were talking off List about the large price difference
between ACS cheap 1.8 ounce Dacron, and the Poly Fiber 1.7 ounce at
twice the price. Does anyone know why the large
difference? Quality control? Does anyone have any experience
comparing the two?
Bill Sullivan
Windsor Locks, Conn.
FS 447
|
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ElleryWeld(at)aol.com
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| Posted: Fri Apr 10, 2009 5:36 pm Post subject: Stits |
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1.7 oz uncertified & The certification ink stamped on the fabric with the Certs for the fabric Probably? that would be my thoughts
Ellery
In a message dated 4/10/2009 5:03:29 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, williamtsullivan(at)att.net writes:
| Quote: | Mike and I were talking off List about the large price difference between ACS cheap 1.8 ounce Dacron, and the Poly Fiber 1.7 ounce at twice the price. Does anyone know why the large difference? Quality control? Does anyone have any experience comparing the two?
Bill Sullivan
Windsor Locks, Conn.
FS 447
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A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps!
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williamtsullivan(at)att.n
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| Posted: Fri Apr 10, 2009 5:42 pm Post subject: Stits |
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Ellery- The general opinion is that ink is more expensive than Dacron.
Bill Sullivan
do not archive
[quote][b]
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mdnanwelch7(at)hotmail.co
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DAquaNut(at)aol.com
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| Posted: Sat Apr 11, 2009 7:42 am Post subject: Stits |
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In a message dated 4/10/2009 8:20:23 P.M. Central Daylight Time, herbgh(at)nctc.com writes:
| Quote: | A Firefly needs its fabric treated with a 50-50 mix of brush
and spray...after the first coat of poly brush is applied in the
normal way...and use 50-50 til you are satisfied that the uv
protection is good... Two cross coats is good enough IMHO
... you are trying to make weight after all... and this stuff does add wt...
the cost difference is because of the paper trail that certified
fabric must have I think...mainly... Herb
|
Herb,
That sounds like a great idea! I wish I had heard that idea before I covered My Firefly! Has this process been tested for longevity in the sunlight ? How long has this process been proven to hold up in sunlight compared to the 3 full cross-coats Stits recommends ?
Ed FF #62 ( In Houston )
Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make dinner for $10 or less.
[quote][b]
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pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com
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| Posted: Sun Apr 12, 2009 1:27 am Post subject: Stits |
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ACS cheap 1.8 ounce Dacron, and the Poly Fiber 1.7 ounce at twice the
price. >>
In the Uk we have recently approved for a/s use a covering which is pre coloured. It is applied and then heat shrunk in the way modellers have been doing for some time.
Apparently expensive but cheaper than fabric plus paint and certainly cheaper in terms of time taken.
For what its worth
Pat
[quote][b]
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Dana
Joined: 13 Dec 2007
Posts: 1047
Location: Connecticut, USA
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| Posted: Sun Apr 12, 2009 4:35 am Post subject: Stits |
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At 05:26 AM 4/12/2009, pj.ladd wrote:
| Quote: | ACS cheap 1.8 ounce Dacron, and the Poly Fiber 1.7 ounce at twice the
price. >>
In the Uk we have recently approved for a/s use a covering which is pre coloured. It is applied and then heat shrunk in the way modellers have been doing for some time.
Apparently expensive but cheaper than fabric plus paint and certainly cheaper in terms of time taken. |
Oratex, it's called... one of the guys over on http://homebuiltairplanes.com recently got some samples; he wasn't impressed with the appearance.
-Dana
--
Alpha test version: too buggy to release. Beta test version: still too buggy to release. Release 1.0: alternate pronounciation of beta test version. [quote][b]
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by0ung(at)brigham.net
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| Posted: Sun Apr 12, 2009 6:33 am Post subject: Stits |
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In the Uk we have recently approved for a/s use a covering which is pre coloured. It is applied and then heat shrunk in the way modellers have been doing for some time.
Is it treated someway for UV protection? If so how long should it last if exposed to sunlight?
Boyd Young
[quote][b]
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flykolb(at)pa.net
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| Posted: Sun Apr 12, 2009 8:21 am Post subject: Stits |
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Hi Pat,
Sounds very interesting!
Does the fabric have a name? Source?
Thanks
Dennis
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of pj.ladd
Sent: Sunday, April 12, 2009 5:26 AM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Stits
ACS cheap 1.8 ounce Dacron, and the Poly Fiber 1.7 ounce at twice the
price. >>
In the Uk we have recently approved for a/s use a covering which is pre coloured. It is applied and then heat shrunk in the way modellers have been doing for some time.
Apparently expensive but cheaper than fabric plus paint and certainly cheaper in terms of time taken.
For what its worth
Pat
| Quote: | | http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
0123456789
[quote][b]
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John Hauck
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)
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| Posted: Sun Apr 12, 2009 12:36 pm Post subject: Stits |
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Not saying Herb's method won't work, but it is not the prescribed method for the Polyfiber System.
Personally, I'll continue to cover and process like the book dictates. Don't won't to take chances with improperly processed fabric to save a nickle.
john h
mkIII
[quote] A Firefly needs its fabric treated with a 50-50 mix of brush
and spray...after the first coat of poly brush is applied in the
normal way...and use 50-50 til you are satisfied that the uv
protection is good... Two cross coats is good enough IMHO
... you are trying to make weight after all... and this stuff does add wt...
Herb,
[b]
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John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama |
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