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yak52
Joined: 25 Oct 2007
Posts: 50
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 Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 12:23 pm Post subject: Polk City crash |
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The NTSB has updated the report. For those who haven't read it, an interesting paragraph speaks volumes.
"During a telephone interview, the previous owner of the airplane stated that
when flying the airplane with a single occupant in the left seat, it was normal
to trim the aileron fully in a right wing down direction in order to maintain
lateral balance"
Those of us who have actually flown the airplane know that this is indicative of
some serious misconfiguration in the construction of the airframe. The aileron
trim is extremely sensitive and never requires more than minimal change off
level to maintain trim. It is hard to imagine even attempring to fly the
airplane with that much trim dialed in.
[quote][b]
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davgray(at)sbcglobal.net
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| Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 3:21 pm Post subject: Polk City crash |
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My experience is as follows:
I fly the 601XL with hingeless ailerons.
The amount of trim required is affected by the weight of a single pilot, whether you have had time to burn off some of the fuel in the left tank (about 4 gallons in my case), my airspeed (80-90 mph requires more trim than 120 mph) and some additional is needed to overcome the stiffness of the hingeless design. I usually have 2/3 of the trim in when at pattern speeds with equal fuel in the tanks and flying alone. This aircraft flys perfectly straight when the passenger and fuel weight is balanced.
With the electric trim system, there is nothing difficult about adjusting the trim or flying the aircraft with different flight speeds and loads. In fact it is incredibly fun to maneuver when the air is dead calm and I am getting exactly the performance that I have set up. This is the best time to appreciate the smoothness of the control system. With a shorter wingspan than a 'C' brand the aileron trim will need to deflect an additional amount to compensate for the same pilot due to the shorter arm.
The aircraft is nimble and a pleasure to fly.
Gary Ray
davgray(at)sbcglobal.net (davgray(at)sbcglobal.net)
601XL, WW Corvair, 0.060 over, Roy Szarafinski's 5th Bearing, Falcon Heads
[quote] ---
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daveaustin2(at)primus.ca
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| Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:42 pm Post subject: Polk City crash |
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My 601HDS has been like that for 15 years and I haven't crashed yet..
Dave Austin 601HDS - 912
[quote][b]
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Scotsman
Joined: 27 Aug 2007
Posts: 89
Location: Johannesburg, South Africa
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| Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 11:40 pm Post subject: Re: Polk City crash |
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Also interesting is the report's finding that an inferior quality of material for the spar cap was not used and that it was T6061. Really opens up more questions than answers but does at less end the inferior material version.
j
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sdthatcher
Joined: 13 Mar 2008
Posts: 91
Location: Port Saint Lucie
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| Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2009 9:53 am Post subject: Re: Polk City crash |
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I wouldn't worry too much about the fact that a full trim deflection is used to maintain a neutral roll of the aircraft. If you look at the moments about the longitudinal axis, you have the pilot (approximately 220 lbs at 1 ft) that provides a moment of 220 lb-ft plus the weight of the trim tab motor, etc which yields about 20 lb-ft plus the light that yields about 20 lb-ft for a total of 260 lb-ft. Now you're trying to maintain neutral roll by full trim as well as partial down aileron in the amount of 260 lb-ft. That is the equivalent of 26 lbs located about 10 feet from the aircraft center line, which should not be a significant load at all and would not be of much concern in my opinion.
It would appear that, depending on pilot weight, locations of extras such as trim motor, landing lights, and rigging that a number of different trim settings might be needed for a single pilot flying left seat only. I just wished I thought that far ahead and would have placed the trim and lights on the right wing rather than the left!
Oh, Jay... I do fly with full aileron deflection to compensate for my weight when flying left seat only and unfortunately I weigh more than 220 as well! I may have to change the rigging at some point so that I can fly solo without that much trim.
Scott Thatcher
N601EL w/ 27 hours
[quote="yak52"]The NTSB has updated the report. For those who haven't read it, an interesting paragraph speaks volumes.
�
"During a telephone interview, the previous owner of the airplane stated that
when flying the airplane with a single occupant in the left seat, it was normal
to trim the aileron fully in a right wing down direction in order to maintain
lateral balance"
Those of us who have actually flown the airplane know that this is indicative of
some serious misconfiguration in the construction of the airframe. The aileron
trim is extremely sensitive and never requires more than minimal change off
level to maintain trim. It is hard to imagine even attempring to fly the
airplane with that much trim dialed in.
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_________________
Scott Thatcher, Port Saint Lucie, FL
601XL with Corvair, Registered as E-LSA
N601EL, EAA203 140 hours and not flying currently. |
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Juan Vega Jr
Joined: 13 Jan 2009
Posts: 157
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| Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2009 3:29 pm Post subject: Polk City crash |
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this is a very light weight aircraft and will fly hands off when properly trimmed. It will ned some trim with one passenger, however that can be negated by ing with you tools or you gear to the right of you. Also fly the left tank off first and you will enjoy many hours of great hands off flying.
Juan
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