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No slats

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mksoucy(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 20, 2009 6:22 pm Post subject: No slats

New to list. Is anyone out there flying with no slats and how's it working out. 



Thanks



Mike



Sent from my iPod

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John Bolding

Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 281

Posted: Thu Aug 20, 2009 7:12 pm Post subject: No slats

hundreds of posts on the subject.





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mksoucy(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 8:22 am Post subject: No slats

John ,

 Thanks for the response, I did check out some posts in the archives. Fishing has not been that good lately so I do not want to open a can of worms so I will rephrase my question.

 Has anyone out there flown both with and without slats (vg's) and returned to slats and why.  Feel free to contact me off list if you prefer, your input would be appreciated as I hope to close my wings this winter. I also saw mention of vg's on elevator does this help if you want keep that training wheel up front in the air longer? The more you find out the more questions.

  

 Thanks

  

 mike



--- On Thu, 8/20/09, John Bolding <jnbolding1(at)teleshare.net> wrote:



 [quote]

From: John Bolding <jnbolding1(at)teleshare.net>

Subject: Re: No slats

To: zenith701801-list(at)matronics.com

Date: Thursday, August 20, 2009, 11:04 PM



 --> Zenith701801-List message posted by: "John Bolding" <jnbolding1(at)teleshare.net (jnbolding1(at)teleshare.net)>



hundreds of posts on the subject.





---

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John Bolding

Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 281

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 11:42 am Post subject: No slats

My experience is pretty limited as I flew Brett's airplane  about 39 hrs with slats and 1 hour without + VG's on wing and elevator. Control  response at low speed was MUCH better and elevator effectiveness was daylight  and dark.

 An hour is NOT even close to enough time to do a proper  test but if you do a search for Joe Spencer's posts he has done as much testing  as Gilpin , almost anyway.

 I think I remember one fellow a yr ago that put his slats  back on but his name evades me (lot's of things evade me lately). MANY have left  them off and cut off the brackets.

 What we DON'T have is someone flying the full airfoil yet,  either with or without VG's. 

  

 LO&SLO   John

  

 ---

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edleg

Joined: 11 Jun 2009
Posts: 14

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 12:19 pm Post subject: Re: No slats

Two things: 



1. There is a 801 owner in alaska (maybe Bill Wilcox ??) who has vg's on his wings, but puts the slats back on for hunting season, to get the max shortfield performance. Otherwise I guess he flies with slats off.



2. If the wings were built without slats to begin with, what airfoil nose would you build to, assuming you could design/build new nose ribs?



thx.

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John Bolding

Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 281

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 2:24 pm Post subject: No slats

The complete airfoil if you cover up the slots is 65018. Chris made a couple 

of small changes, flattened out the upper surface a little in the area of 

the upper spar cap to make building easier and removed a slight undercamber 

right under the nose for the same reason. Riblett told me to leave the 

undercamber in. Long story.



  What you get when you remove the slats is a bastard but works surprisingly 

well (to me anyway) considering the blunt nose. No need to design anything, 

the 65018 airfoil profile is here in the files,  3rd item submitted by R.S. 

Hoover . If you look over in the photos section lo and behold a picture of 

the standard nose rib and a full airfoil nose rib side by side for your 

comparing pleasure.



What this nose rib HOPEFULLY does is move the center of lift forward a 

little/some/a lot (you choose) to balance an engine slightly/somewhat/much 

(you choose) heavier than the Rotax. I also THINK that there is a good 

chance induced drag will be down so cruise speed can be obtained at a lower 

power setting but that is more wishful thinking than reality at this point. 

We'll see.

It also gives you  about 12 sq. feet more wing. 'Course you knew all that as 

it's been hashed out here so many times everybody is sick of hearing it 

again.



This mod hasn't been tried yet but I made the offer to provide the nose ribs 

to anyone who wanted to take the leading edge off their flying 701 and 

install a full 65018 leading edge, nobody has bit yet so I guess it'll be 

me. Mods to this airplane are not taken lightly (by me anyway), it has a 

stellar record if built per plans and there is really no valid reason to 

mess with it. I just take the word "Experimental" at face value.



You didn't mention but we're talking 701 here, correct?

John



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edleg

Joined: 11 Jun 2009
Posts: 14

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 3:34 pm Post subject: Re: No slats

John,



yes, 701 or (possibly 801).



There is a photos section? Besides what gets attached to messages? If so, where/how do I access?



thx



-Ed-

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John Bolding

Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 281

Posted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 4:42 pm Post subject: No slats

MY APOLOGIES !!   I forgot we were on the matronics list,  on the YAHOO 

group "701 Builders" all those previous directions makes sense, not here. I 

belong to too many groups, old age has something to do with it too.

As far as I've read only 2-3 801 guys tried removing slats and results were 

not as stellar as on the 701. I'm not the guy to ask about that airplane.

Sorry for the confusion, I'll straighten up,     my wife will be tickled.

LO&SLO   John



---

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