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Masqqqqqqq(at)aol.com
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 Posted: Sat Aug 29, 2009 1:51 pm Post subject: powered and unpowered weights |
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Here's an odd question:
Just say somebody built an ultralight that was powered by a propeller turned by bicycle pedals. There is no engine. Would this machine need to make the weight of a powered ultralight, 254 pounds, or an unpowered glider, 155 pounds. ?
[quote][b]
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aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com
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| Posted: Sat Aug 29, 2009 6:06 pm Post subject: powered and unpowered weights |
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You've answered your own question, I think."an ultralight that was powered by a propeller turned by bicycle pedals", powered is powered.
Rick
On Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 4:49 PM, <Masqqqqqqq(at)aol.com (Masqqqqqqq(at)aol.com)> wrote:
[quote] Here's an odd question:
Just say somebody built an ultralight that was powered by a propeller turned by bicycle pedals. There is no engine. Would this machine need to make the weight of a powered ultralight, 254 pounds, or an unpowered glider, 155 pounds. ?
| Quote: |
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[b]
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pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com
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| Posted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 1:35 am Post subject: powered and unpowered weights |
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Just say somebody built an ultralight that was powered by a propeller
| Quote: | turned by bicycle pedals.
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It wouldn`t be an ultralight or a glider, but a separate category. Apart from that fact, someone already has.
It was called the `Gossamer something` (i have forgotten and I am too busy to look it up. Party for 60 people in about 90 minutes). it was built as light as possible with an immense wingspan. The power was a highly trained cyclist taught to fly for the occasion.
He made it from Dover to France, mainly in ground effect and collapsed exhausted on the beach.
The human body could not generate enough horse power to get an ordinary ultralight off the ground.
Cheers
Pat
[quote][b]
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rlaird
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 373
Location: Houston
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| Posted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 9:14 am Post subject: powered and unpowered weights |
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The good news is, you won't need a transponder since the engine doesn't create any electrical power. 
On Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 9:04 PM, Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com (aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
[quote]You've answered your own question, I think."an ultralight that was powered by a propeller turned by bicycle pedals", powered is powered.
Rick
On Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 4:49 PM, <Masqqqqqqq(at)aol.com (Masqqqqqqq(at)aol.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | Here's an odd question:
Just say somebody built an ultralight that was powered by a propeller turned by bicycle pedals. There is no engine. Would this machine need to make the weight of a powered ultralight, 254 pounds, or an unpowered glider, 155 pounds. ?
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[b]
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Robert Laird
formerly: MkIIIc w/ 912ULS & Gyrobee
current: Autogyro Cavalon w/ 914ULS
Houston, TX area
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slyck(at)frontiernet.net
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| Posted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 9:23 am Post subject: powered and unpowered weights |
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Strap a big leaf blower to your back. They can provide more continuous thrust than your feet.
You will need a LONG wingspan, lots-o-wires and zero wind.
BB
On 30, Aug 2009, at 1:13 PM, Robert Laird wrote:
| Quote: | The good news is, you won't need a transponder since the engine doesn't create any electrical power.
On Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 9:04 PM, Richard Girard <aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com (aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | You've answered your own question, I think."an ultralight that was powered by a propeller turned by bicycle pedals", powered is powered.
Rick
On Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 4:49 PM, <Masqqqqqqq(at)aol.com (Masqqqqqqq(at)aol.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | Here's an odd question:
Just say somebody built an ultralight that was powered by a propeller turned by bicycle pedals. There is no engine. Would this machine need to make the weight of a powered ultralight, 254 pounds, or an unpowered glider, 155 pounds. ?
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[quote][b]
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zeprep251(at)aol.com
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| Posted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 3:51 pm Post subject: powered and unpowered weights |
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I guess it's just us old timers that remember the Gossamer Condor.No numbers on that aircraft but you had to be an Olympic class cyclist to fly it.
G.Aman
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russ(at)rkiphoto.com
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| Posted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 4:08 pm Post subject: powered and unpowered weights |
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GaryYou're right; only a few of us old-timers recall the Gossamer Condor -- and the Gossamer Albatross and the Solar Challenger, both of which crossed the English Channel.
I guess after the Kremer Prize was awarded, interest dropped off.
Aviation milestones, for sure.
Russ
do not archive
On Aug 30, 2009, at 7:44 PM, zeprep251(at)aol.com (zeprep251(at)aol.com) wrote:
[quote] I guess it's just us old timers that remember the Gossamer Condor.No numbers on that aircraft but you had to be an Olympic class cyclist to fly it.
G.Aman
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zeprep251(at)aol.com
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| Posted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 4:51 pm Post subject: powered and unpowered weights |
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I have no idea what any of them weighed ,been so long.....
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rlaird
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 373
Location: Houston
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| Posted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 5:42 pm Post subject: powered and unpowered weights |
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70 lbs... more info here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gossamer_Condor
On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 7:46 PM, <zeprep251(at)aol.com (zeprep251(at)aol.com)> wrote:
[quote] I have no idea what any of them weighed ,been so long.....
--
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_________________
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Robert Laird
formerly: MkIIIc w/ 912ULS & Gyrobee
current: Autogyro Cavalon w/ 914ULS
Houston, TX area
http://www.Texas-Flyer.com |
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John Hauck
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)
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| Posted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 6:13 pm Post subject: powered and unpowered weights |
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How does this subject relate with building and flying Kolb aircraft?
Without adding DO NOT ARCHIVE, it goes in the Kolb archives so someone can find info on it in years to come.
Don't get your panties in a wad or I will start talking about VG's and fuel filters.
john h - Just curious!
mkIII
DO NOT ARCHIVE
[quote]
70 lbs... more info here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gossamer_Condor
[b]
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jbhart(at)onlyinternet.ne
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| Posted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 6:24 pm Post subject: powered and unpowered weights |
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Date: Sun, 30 Aug 2009 20:46:46 -0400
From: zeprep251(at)aol.com
I have no idea what any of them weighed ,been so long.....
-------------------------
Gossamer Condor and Gossamer Albatross both weighed 209 pounds empty.
Estimated power to fly was .48 hp.
Jack B. Hart FF004
Winchester, IN
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jbhart(at)onlyinternet.ne
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| Posted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 6:40 pm Post subject: powered and unpowered weights |
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Date: Sun, 30 Aug 2009 20:46:46 -0400
From: zeprep251(at)aol.com
I have no idea what any of them weighed ,been so long.....
-------------------------
Gossamer Condor and Gossamer Albatross both weighed 209 pounds empty.
Correction - should have written loaded full up.
Estimated power to fly was .48 hp.
Jack B. Hart FF004
Winchester, IN
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JetPilot
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1246
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| Posted: Mon Aug 31, 2009 8:07 am Post subject: Re: powered and unpowered weights |
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[quote="Masqqqqqqq(at)aol.com"]Here's an odd question:
Just say somebody built an ultralight that was powered by a propeller turned by bicycle pedals. There is no engine. Would this machine need to make the weight of a powered ultralight, 254 pounds, or an unpowered glider, 155 pounds. ?
If you build a pedal powered " Ultralight " that is anywhere near 254 pounds, it would never fly using only human power... So its a non issue.
Its been done before, and the planes have been under 100 pounds to be able to fly with the power of an Olympic class bicycle rider.
Mike
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"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S |
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JetPilot
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1246
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| Posted: Mon Aug 31, 2009 11:59 am Post subject: Re: powered and unpowered weights |
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Masqqqqqqq(at)aol.com,
Condor weighed in at 70 pounds... Human powered is not a glider, it is using power to fly as opposed to updrafts, or being towed or launched off a hill, so I would not try to impose glider rules.
Forgive my initial response, we are trying to create nice and kinder list here  The question does not make much sense to me, as chances of a human powered ultralight ever flying at more than 155 pounds is very close to zero. Remember, a plane actually has to get into the air to worry about FAA rules, and hovercraft and similar ground effect craft do not count !!
Mike
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"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S |
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1planeguy(at)kilocharlie.
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| Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 12:14 pm Post subject: powered and unpowered weights |
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The regulations will be academic anyway...if it isn't VERY light and an
immense wingspan human power will not get it off the ground...pound for
pound us humans are pretty pitiful engines
Jeremy
Richard Girard wrote:
| Quote: | You've answered your own question, I think.
"an ultralight that was powered by a propeller turned by bicycle
pedals", powered is powered.
*
*
*Rick
*
On Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 4:49 PM, <Masqqqqqqq(at)aol.com
<mailto:Masqqqqqqq(at)aol.com>> wrote:
*Here's an odd question:*
**
* Just say somebody built an ultralight that was powered by a
propeller turned by bicycle pedals. There is no engine. Would
this machine need to make the weight of a powered ultralight, 254
pounds, or an unpowered glider, 155 pounds. ?*
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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