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raymondj(at)frontiernet.n
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 Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 6:04 am Post subject: Home built Help and Jon Croke/......ok that is all |
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Just to be clear, does Jon have any official affiliation with any of the
Zenith/Zenair companies? What are his qualifications to be giving
advice on this subject?
Raymond Julian
Kettle River, MN.
(Working on 801 stab)
Art Gibeaut wrote:
[quote]
OK guys, what do you say we stop fanning the fire, and let this die.
Here's my "one man's opinion" and I'm not trying to influence anyone; Jon is a great guy and has been of immense help to me on my 701. I own all of his 701 DVD's and he has always promptly answered my questions, either by email or on the phone no matter how stupid they were. I too will keep the DVD's as a record and remembrance of the fun I've had on this project. But that's just me, and I'm in no way judging anyone else.
My point is this; he is an excellent resource and his work is invaluable to present and future builders. I think we can all agree that we want him to continue his excellent work, so what do you say we all just stop beating this to death and get back to building. We're not the 601 crowd. How about it? Please?
--- On Wed, 10/7/09, Ken Ryan <keninalaska(at)gmail.com> wrote:
> From: Ken Ryan <keninalaska(at)gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: Home built Help and Jon Croke/......ok that is all
> To: zenith701801-list(at)matronics.com
> Date: Wednesday, October 7, 2009, 6:20 PM
> David,
>
> I agree that Jon's sending that message was an unwise
> move. It was an over-reaction to someone selling his
> videos. Not smart ...
>
> But now you are over-reacting to Jon's over-reaction.
> Hear me out ...
>
> If you read his message dispassionately, it was really
> quite benign. All he was saying was "Hey, if everybody
> does this, then my business won't have a chance, and
> there won't be any videos in the future." None of
> the viciousness that you have attributed to it was in his
> message.
> As to his cancelling your order, my guess would be that it
> might have been more of a reaction to your spirited posts
> than your selling his videos.
>
> I've talked to Jon a number of times and I believe
> he's a good guy, and I will continue to do business with
> him.
> Will I sell his videos when I'm done? No, but not
> because he doesn't want me to. I'll keep them
> because they are a good video record of how my airplane is
> put together. I believe they are worth keeping for future
> reference.
> Ken Ryan
> CH 750, tail complete, moving slowly and deliberately
>
> On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 2:32 PM,
> <skyguynca(at)skyguynca.com>
> wrote:
>
>
> Guys I am sorry that Jon chose to take this public on the
> forum. He
>
> basically said by selling my new/unused videos I am taking
> money from him
>
> and going to drive him out of business. Then he
> cancel's my order for the
>
> CH750 DVD's....wow talking about driving someone out of
> business, he is
>
> doing that for himself.
>
> Well I am going to take a more legal channel with Jon since
> we had a
>
> contract and he accepted it when he said he would ship my
> videos today and
>
> then decided to not ship them at all.
>
> Thanks for all your support guys, one thing I suggest:
>
> If doing business with Homebuit Help or Jon Croke, get
> everything in writing
>
> because you can see where being a customer got me.
>
> David M.
>
> --
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bobkat
Joined: 07 Sep 2008
Posts: 143
Location: Bismarck, ND
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| Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 6:47 am Post subject: Home built Help and Jon Croke/......ok that is all |
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I think he's just a guy who had built Zenith aircraft before, so carefully
filmed every detail of the construction of one, then sold the videos.
I had good enough technical service from Zenith, but sometimes with one
exception, I felt I was interrupting their day and taking up their valuable
time. Once or twice I felt I was being scolded for not understanding
something, even though I had previously built two aircraft and had flown a
few thousand hours over 30 years.
After I discovered the videos and consulted Jon by e-mail or phone, I found
he knew every nut and bolt and has all kinds of neat tricks he passed along
to me for constructing various frustrating head scratching parts. I found
it much easier to talk to Jon about 'how to' details than the Zenith guys.
Not knocking the Zenith guys at all, they gave good information but it was
just easier for me and personally I got a lot of good info and tricks of the
trade from him. Only one time I received a return e-mail but that was
several months later and only contained a short cryptic unhelpful reply.
So I personally think Jon is performing a darned good public service to
builders who choose to use him and would hate to see him go out of business.
I suggested to Zenith and Jon that that his videos should be included in the
kit price and be part of the kit. This would be a tremendous resource and
time saver for us all, even the Zenith tech support phone people. Never
heard from Zenith about it. Presumably opens a liability hassle for them.
Again, not taking sides - just my experiences......
Wind finally went down in ND so time to go and fly and let you guys keep
building out there! Trust me, all those hours of building are worth it! My
last post, too.
Bob
---
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