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24V Lessons

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jeremy.p.harris(at)boeing
Guest

Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2006 4:38 am Post subject: 24V Lessons

Since the discussion of 24v aircraft has popped up...  I thought you

might be interested in some of the challenges Rick and I have run into

making the RV-10 airplane run on 24V.  The avionics were the easy part

since most are designed to run off 24V.  The tricky items were the 12V

accessories, flap system, indicators, lights, and trim motors.  



Here's a list of some of our modifications:



1.  Flap System - Vans/ Show Planes OEM

	Required new Flap Positing System control box from Show planes

rated at 24V (Approximately $50-100 fee to 	modify)

	New Flap Motor - Had to replace Pitman 12V motor that came in

Van's flap system with a 24V variant of the motor.  Required sending the

assembly and new motor back to manufacturer of flap actuator to get the

new motor installed in the actuator (had to press on a new gear to

shaft) - Cost was shipping and a minor checkout charge



2.  Trim Indicators - Ray Allen LED bar type

	Require 12V power supply - had to create 12V voltage regulators

from Radio Shack - low cost but time consuming



3.  Trim Motors - Ray Allen 

	Trim motors are all 12V.  We are using Blue Mountain Power board

which output 12V to trim system - Without BMA board, another converter

would be required.  



4.  Lighting Dimmer - LC-40 Flight Data Systems

	Stock dimmer Van's sells is not 24V.  Requires a mod be made at

factory to replace some diodes.  Low cost - but time consuming - Best to

order directly from Flight Data Systems and get the 24V one the first

time



5.  Van's Firewall Forward - Alternator

	Alternator in kit is 12V - need 24V...  Have to buy somewhere

else...



6.  Starter - Stock engine through vans will come with 12V starter -

must contact engine manufacturer directly and request 24 volt starter.



7.  Solenoids 

	Ones supplied by Vans are all 12V - need to get 24v from other

supplier



8.  Battery Tray must be modified to fit larger battery (24v battery way

about 2 times the size of 12V

9.  Stock lighting is typically 12V - A regulator was necessary for

baggage lights and other lights planned for the airplane which are not

available in 24V.  



10. Battery Charger - Had to buy a 24V battery charger - more expensive

than the typical 12V model available.  $100-200.  



11. All lights supplied by vans are typically 12V.  Will require

changing out the light bulbs for 24v type.  Can be a little pricey for

a/c bulbs.  However, if you can get them sent to you 24V the first time,

you can eliminate have a useless spare set of 12V bulbs laying around

the shop.  

Pretty much everything else was available in 24v without much issue.

Lighting transformers, pitot tubes, radios, instruments are all

available 24v.  About my only concern remaining would be getting stuck

at some small airport somewhere that there isn't a 24V external power

supply to jump the aircraft.  However, if you have a spare set of jumper

cables and 2 car batteries you can get 24V easy enough.  



Hope this helps any of you planning on going 24V.  



Jeremy P. Harris 

Integrated Missile Defense                                    

BMDS Architectures Lab



The Boeing Company 

Washington, DC 

Desk: (703) 414-6057 Dept: AV-2L-B27T 

Cell: (703) 627-6500 

Fax: (703) 414-6372 

MC: 793C-G007 

Office: 825B 

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Tdawson(at)avidyne.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2006 7:13 am Post subject: 24V Lessons

Here's what we did:



1.-4.) Created a "12V bus" that is fed by a 20 Amp voltage converter.

The Flaps, Trim, and Fuel Pump are connected to this bus.



5.-6.) 24 Volt alternators and starter from B&C Specialties.



7.) As mentioned before, finding good contactors took a little effort,

but got some nice ones from Mouser.



8.) As mentioned before, 2 12V Odyessy batteries used.



9.) Running two 12v LED lights in series for dome lights.



10.) With two 12V batteries, can charge them separately with 12v

charger, or together with 24V.



11.) Not using Van's lights.  Using 24 volt lights in most cases.

Strobe supply takes either voltage.



TDT

40025

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dmasys(at)cox.net
Guest

Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 7:41 am Post subject: 24V Lessons

 	  Quote: 	
		   From: "Harris, Jeremy P" <jeremy.p.harris(at)boeing.com>

 Date: 2006/01/13 Fri AM 07:34:42 EST

 To: <rv10-list(at)matronics.com>

 Subject: 24V Lessons

..long list of 24v issues deleted.

 	  Quote: 	
		   About my only concern remaining would be getting stuck

 at some small airport somewhere that there isn't a 24V 

external power supply to jump the aircraft. 

Like many builders, I am thinking about the advantages and disadvantages of 24v.  I can say, however, that in two years of flying my RV-7A I have inadvertently run the battery down completely three times (by leaving a switch on overnight twice, and an external GPS plugged into the accessory outlet for days the other time).  Of these, two times it was at a small airport where there was no 24v power available.  I got a jump from a little tractor being used to tow airplanes in one case, and a charge from a borrowed 12v car battery charger in the other.

This will probably be the deciding factor for me.  Having lived and learned, and depended upon the kindness of strangers when traveling cross county, I'm pretty strongly incentivized to go with 12 volts.

-Dan Masys

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carl.froehlich(at)cox.net
Guest

Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 12:42 pm Post subject: 24V Lessons

The other aspect is finding a replacement alternator when you are stuck

someplace.  A standard Nippon Densu 60 amp alternator is $80 at any auto

parts store.



Carl Froehlich

RV-10 (empennage)

RV-8A (230 hrs)



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