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Firewall Sound insulation kit

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shericom(at)rogers.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 5:18 pm Post subject: Firewall Sound insulation kit

Hi everyone, I'm building a M4/1200 Speedster with a 912 engine (1992) The kit came with a P/N 69013 pre-sewn sound insulation kit for the firewall, I have seen a service letter re heat damage to areas near the exhaust pipes and muffler, it recommends an aluminum heat shield be riveted to sandwich the insulation between it and the firewall. Has anyone done this and does it work, or has anyone in fact used the sound insulation kit at all? Any comments welcome, Thanks, Don



Don Stevenson, Caledon Ontario Canada

shericom(at)rogers.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 5:18 pm Post subject: Firewall Sound insulation kit

Hi everyone, I'm building a M4/1200 Speedster with a 912 engine (1992) The kit came with a P/N 69013 pre-sewn sound insulation kit for the firewall, I have seen a service letter re heat damage to areas near the exhaust pipes and muffler, it recommends an aluminum heat shield be riveted to sandwich the insulation between it and the firewall. Has anyone done this and does it work, or has anyone in fact used the sound insulation kit at all? Any comments welcome, Thanks, Don



Don Stevenson, Caledon Ontario Canada

wingsdown(at)comcast.net
Guest

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 5:38 pm Post subject: Firewall Sound insulation kit

Why cant it be put on the cabin side of the firewall?

Rick



--

shericom(at)rogers.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 6:23 pm Post subject: Firewall Sound insulation kit

Hi Rick, It's pre-sewn and is shaped to fit on the engine side except for the top half which covers both the eng. side and the cabin side like an envelope, Don



wingsdown <wingsdown(at)comcast.net> wrote: 



Why cant it be put on the cabin side of the firewall?

Rick



--

Jim Shumaker

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 106

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 7:06 pm Post subject: Firewall Sound insulation kit

The aluminum heat shield works very well.  I got a roll aluminum from the lumber yard.  It is used for flashing in roofing jobs.  It works very well for shielding.  If you have a gascolator in the engine compartment it should also have aluminum shielding to protect it from the radiated heat from the muffler.

   

  Jim Shumaker



Donald STEVENSON <shericom(at)rogers.com> wrote:

  



Hi everyone, I'm building a M4/1200 Speedster with a 912 engine (1992) The kit came with a P/N 69013 pre-sewn sound insulation kit for the firewall, I have seen a service letter re heat damage to areas near the exhaust pipes and muffler, it recommends an aluminum heat shield be riveted to sandwich the insulation between it and the firewall. Has anyone done this and does it work, or has anyone in fact used the sound insulation kit at all? Any comments welcome, Thanks, Don



Don Stevenson, Caledon Ontario Canada

_________________
Jim Shumaker

Richard Rabbers

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 114
Location: Benton Harbor, MI - USA

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 7:16 pm Post subject: Re: Firewall Sound insulation kit

My model 1 had sound insulation glued to the engine side of the firewall.

An A&P commented regarding the hazard of oil or other flammable accumulation (also hard to clean) and suggested it would be better to mount on the rear(passenger)side.



The 'sandwich' method would work but add the weight of the second aluminum skin. 



I plan to mount insulation on the back side of my firewall.

_________________
Richard in SW Michigan
Model 1 / 618 - full-lotus floats (restoration)

dan(at)azshowersolutions.
Guest

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 8:05 pm Post subject: Firewall Sound insulation kit

Richard, I have heard the same thing concerning oil accumulation and then becoming a fire hazard if the blanket is mounted on the engine side. Has anyone here mounted it to the inside? Is there enough room without interfering with the rudder/brake pedals? 

  Dan B

  Mesa, AZ

  www.azshowersolutions.com/Kitfox1.html 



Richard Rabbers <rira1950(at)yahoo.com> wrote:

  



My model 1 had sound insulation glued to the engine side of the firewall.

An A&P commented regarding the hazard of oil or other flammable accumulation (also hard to clean) and suggested it would be better to mount on the rear(passenger)side.



The 'sandwich' method would work but add the weight of the second aluminum skin. 



I plan to mount insulation on the back side of my firewall.



--------

Richard in SW Michigan

Model 1 / 618 - full-lotus floats (restoration)





Read this topic online here:



http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=28667#28667

Lynn Matteson

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 2778
Location: Grass Lake, Michigan

Posted: Sun Apr 16, 2006 2:52 am Post subject: Firewall Sound insulation kit

I had the same question regarding the firewall insulation, called Frank 

Miller and he said that they don't (didn't) even use it anymore. He 

suggested that if I wanted to use it, mount it on the back side (cabin 

side) of the firewall. That is what I did. I cut the thread that held 

the front and back halves together, removed the upper half ( the side 

that would normally cover the cabin side of the firewall), fitted the 

remaining full piece to the back side of the firewall, and trimmed to 

fit. Because I have a Jabiru engine and Skyfox cowl, my firewall is a 

little shorter height-wise, so I had to trim some off the insulating 

blanket to fit. I then used a U-shaped rubber cowl seal (Aircraft 

Spruce) to dress up the edge of the firewall-blanket transition.



Lynn

Kitfox IV...Jabiru 2200

(12+ hours in Phase I, and counting)



On Saturday, April 15, 2006, at 10:21  PM, Donald STEVENSON wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 <shericom(at)rogers.com>



 Hi Rick, It's pre-sewn and is shaped to fit on the engine side except 

 for the top half which covers both the eng. side and the cabin side 

 like an envelope, Don



 wingsdown <wingsdown(at)comcast.net> wrote: --> Kitfox-List message 

 posted by: "wingsdown"



 Why cant it be put on the cabin side of the firewall?

 Rick

_________________
Lynn
Kitfox IV-Jabiru 2200
N369LM

Lynn Matteson

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 2778
Location: Grass Lake, Michigan

Posted: Sun Apr 16, 2006 3:00 am Post subject: Firewall Sound insulation kit

I had no interference problems with the rudder/brake pedals, because I 

used some type B metal screws, large area washers, and Tinnerman nuts 

in the areas where the blanket wanted to not lay right up against the 

firewall, such as the inside corners of the firewall. It wanted to 

droop there, and the screw/washer/nut combo took care of that.



Lynn

Kitfox IV...Jabiru 2200



On Sunday, April 16, 2006, at 12:03  AM, Dan Billingsley wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 <dan(at)azshowersolutions.com>



 Richard, I have heard the same thing concerning oil accumulation and 

 then becoming a fire hazard if the blanket is mounted on the engine 

 side. Has anyone here mounted it to the inside? Is there enough room 

 without interfering with the rudder/brake pedals?

   Dan B

   Mesa, AZ

   www.azshowersolutions.com/Kitfox1.html

_________________
Lynn
Kitfox IV-Jabiru 2200
N369LM

aldaniels(at)fmtc.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Apr 16, 2006 7:39 am Post subject: Firewall Sound insulation kit

How much does the blanket weigh. Is it worth it to drag it to altitude

every flight. I find most of the noise comes from the prop on the

windshield and other air noise. Some installations need it for heat, but

I am not sure it makes much difference for noise. I used one on my first

project, not on the rest.  Just something to think about.



Dan Billingsley wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  



Richard, I have heard the same thing concerning oil accumulation and then becoming a fire hazard if the blanket is mounted on the engine side. Has anyone here mounted it to the inside? Is there enough room without interfering with the rudder/brake pedals? 

  Dan B

  Mesa, AZ

  www.azshowersolutions.com/Kitfox1.html 



Richard Rabbers <rira1950(at)yahoo.com> wrote:

  



My model 1 had sound insulation glued to the engine side of the firewall.

An A&P commented regarding the hazard of oil or other flammable accumulation (also hard to clean) and suggested it would be better to mount on the rear(passenger)side.



The 'sandwich' method would work but add the weight of the second aluminum skin. 



I plan to mount insulation on the back side of my firewall.



--------

Richard in SW Michigan

Model 1 / 618 - full-lotus floats (restoration)





Read this topic online here:



http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=28667#28667

lcfitt(at)sbcglobal.net
Guest

Posted: Sun Apr 16, 2006 9:01 am Post subject: Firewall Sound insulation kit

This is a good point, I think.



I attended an EAA meeting in Livermore, CA when I was building there and 

they had a sound engineer come for a discussion on noise control.  What came 

out of it is that the only thing that will significantly attenuate noise is 

mass.  for example the firewall will absorb noise, begin to vibrate and then 

become a radiator of noise into the cockpit.  A light weight blanket or what 

ever on the firewall will just add one more layer of vibrating material. 

His suggestion, tongue in cheek, was to make the firewall out of lead or 

maybe concrete if you really want to reduce noise.



The value of the blanket is there, however, as it will absorbe some of the 

higher frequency noise that tends to be reflected around inside the 

cockpit - something like the effect of carpet and upholstered furnature in a 

room.



In a light weight sound absorbing material he said the best was foam similar 

to Temperfoam, found in expensive seat cushions.  It has a syrupy 

consistency which doesn't transmit sound as well.  He suggested it have a 

thin aluminum barrier on one side.  At the time I found ACS had such a 

product and I put it on my forewall.  How does it work?  It went on fine - 

it is self adhesive, but I don't have a clue if it does any good as my 

experience in other Kitfoxes is minimal at best.



It would probably be great lining an aluminum airplane such as a Vans which 

it seems could be like sitting in an old Victrola horn.



Lowell

---

bmwebb(at)cox.net
Guest

Posted: Sun Apr 16, 2006 1:52 pm Post subject: Firewall Sound insulation kit

Amen to that! A friend's Mustang 2 vibrates like crazy, especially during

taxi. That "horn" behind you really acts like a trumpet.



On my bird, a sheet of stainless steel (thin), with a crushed wool pad

(1/4)" on the backside and fireproof paint on the front would be about as

good as anything. Great fire protection, some noise help, and lightweight. 



I think the best investment would be a set of good ANR headsets.



Surprisingly, my problem is not the motor, rather the brake calipers

chattering on landing rollout with the knobby tires. The FBO mgr said it

sounds like the thing is coming apart when I land.



Great excuse to only use grass, eh?

Bradley



--

jopatco(at)mindspring.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Apr 17, 2006 4:30 am Post subject: Firewall Sound insulation kit

The original kit Avid included one inch rather high density sound deadening

foam which was to be glued to the back of the cockpit side of the fire

wall. I did not think it made much difference until I flew one without it.

The un dampened fire wall set up its own frequency and became another sound

generator. 

 	  Quote: 	
		   [Original Message]

 From: Alan & Linda Daniels <aldaniels(at)fmtc.com>

 To: <kitfox-list(at)matronics.com>

 Date: 4/16/2006 9:45:46 AM

 Subject: Re: Re: Firewall Sound insulation kit



 

<aldaniels(at)fmtc.com>
	


 	  Quote: 	
		  

 How much does the blanket weigh. Is it worth it to drag it to altitude

 every flight. I find most of the noise comes from the prop on the

 windshield and other air noise. Some installations need it for heat, but

 I am not sure it makes much difference for noise. I used one on my first

 project, not on the rest.  Just something to think about.



 Dan Billingsley wrote:



 >

<dan(at)azshowersolutions.com>
	


 	  Quote: 	
		   >

 >Richard, I have heard the same thing concerning oil accumulation and

then becoming a fire hazard if the blanket is mounted on the engine side.
	


Has anyone here mounted it to the inside? Is there enough room without

interfering with the rudder/brake pedals? 

 	  Quote: 	
		   >  Dan B

 >  Mesa, AZ

 >  www.azshowersolutions.com/Kitfox1.html 

 >

 >Richard Rabbers <rira1950(at)yahoo.com> wrote:

 >  

 >

 >My model 1 had sound insulation glued to the engine side of the firewall.

 >An A&P commented regarding the hazard of oil or other flammable

accumulation (also hard to clean) and suggested it would be better to mount
	


on the rear(passenger)side.

 	  Quote: 	
		   >

 >The 'sandwich' method would work but add the weight of the second

aluminum skin. 
	


 	  Quote: 	
		   >

 >I plan to mount insulation on the back side of my firewall.

 >

 >--------

 >Richard in SW Michigan

 >Model 1 / 618 - full-lotus floats (restoration)

 >

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 >Read this topic online here:

 >

 >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=28667#28667

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