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nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
Guest

Posted: Wed Jan 06, 2010 2:06 pm Post subject: List decorum

At 12:55 PM 1/6/2010, you wrote:



  	  Quote: 	
		    

 P.S. You probably didn’t read the part of my last comment (the only in which I didn’t panic) when I said I built and fly one airplane with fuses, one airplane with circuit breakers, and the one I’m currently finishing building have both. Don’t loose your time, just hit the delete button

  

 

  	  Quote: 	
		  May I suggest

that you finish building your aircraft, using resettable circuit

breakers, since this gives you a greater comfort

level.[/b] [/b]

Roger[/b]

	




 	


    Gentlemen, this isn't about "superiority" of anything over

    anything else. It's about meeting design goals for what

    we hope will be a failure tolerant system understood by

    the pilot and sufficiently fitted to meet the missions

    for which the airplane is built.



    The pantry of electro-goodies that can be stirred into

    a host of recipes for success is huge. Just because any

    one of us has a preference over one ingredient vs. another

    should not be taken as an invitation to cast disparaging

    remarks.



    The mission for each of us on the List is to offer/acquire

    understanding of how each ingredient functions in

    particular situations . . . and not to suggest that anyone

    has made a poor choice EXCEPT where we perceive a risk

    for not achieving failure tolerance . . . even if the

    "preferred" system is heavier, costlier, perhaps more

    complex, or uses breakers.



    We have a number of folks putting Z-14 into two-place

    airplanes with missions that will never tax the system's

    ability to mitigate risk. At the same time, for

    each individual on the List who has expressed an interest

    in exploring the possibilities, there are many, Many,

    MANY more who are wiring their airplanes like a 1969

    C-172. Are those folks at extra-ordinary risk for a bad

    day in the cockpit? No, a modern alternator, active notification

    of LV, modern RG battery and a purpose-driven battery

    maintenance program makes them 10x better off than we

    were in 1950 with generators and lead-acid slop-pots.



    The OBAM aviation community, indeed all of light aircraft GA

    is under incremental, relentless attack to simply go away.

    Our collective future is best served by helping every

    OBAM aircraft builder generate and meet design goals consistent

    with the best we know how to do . . . while accommodating their

    preferences.



    Bob . . .       [quote][b]

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trigo(at)mail.telepac.pt
Guest

Posted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 4:26 am Post subject: List decorum

Ditto!  

   

Carlos  

           

  

From: owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-aeroelectric-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Robert L. Nuckolls, III

 Sent: quarta-feira, 6 de Janeiro de 2010 22:04

 To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: List decorum   

  

   

At 12:55 PM 1/6/2010, you wrote:

 

 

   

 

 P.S. You probably didnt read the part of my last comment (the only in which I didnt panic) when I said I built and fly one airplane with fuses, one airplane with circuit breakers, and the one Im currently finishing building have both. Dont loose your time, just hit the delete button

     	  Quote: 	
		  May I suggestthat you finish building your aircraft, using resettable circuitbreakers, since this gives you a greater comfortlevel. 	
  

    	  Quote: 	
		   	
  

    	  Quote: 	
		  Roger 	
  

   



    Gentlemen, this isn't about "superiority" of anything over

    anything else. It's about meeting design goals for what

    we hope will be a failure tolerant system understood by

    the pilot and sufficiently fitted to meet the missions

    for which the airplane is built.

 

    The pantry of electro-goodies that can be stirred into

    a host of recipes for success is huge. Just because any

    one of us has a preference over one ingredient vs. another

    should not be taken as an invitation to cast disparaging

    remarks.

 

    The mission for each of us on the List is to offer/acquire

    understanding of how each ingredient functions in

    particular situations . . . and not to suggest that anyone

    has made a poor choice EXCEPT where we perceive a risk

    for not achieving failure tolerance . . . even if the

    "preferred" system is heavier, costlier, perhaps more

    complex, or uses breakers.

 

    We have a number of folks putting Z-14 into two-place

    airplanes with missions that will never tax the system's

    ability to mitigate risk. At the same time, for

    each individual on the List who has expressed an interest

    in exploring the possibilities, there are many, Many,

    MANY more who are wiring their airplanes like a 1969

    C-172. Are those folks at extra-ordinary risk for a bad

    day in the cockpit? No, a modern alternator, active notification

    of LV, modern RG battery and a purpose-driven battery

    maintenance program makes them 10x better off than we

    were in 1950 with generators and lead-acid slop-pots.

 

    The OBAM aviation community, indeed all of light aircraft GA

    is under incremental, relentless attack to simply go away.

    Our collective future is best served by helping every

    OBAM aircraft builder generate and meet design goals consistent

    with the best we know how to do . . . while accommodating their

    preferences.

 

    Bob . . .      	  Quote: 	
		    that you finish building your aircraft, using resettable circuit 	
0 	  Quote: 	
		  that you finish building your aircraft, using resettable circuit 	
1 	  Quote: 	
		  that you finish building your aircraft, using resettable circuit 	
2 	  Quote: 	
		  that you finish building your aircraft, using resettable circuit 	
3 	  Quote: 	
		  that you finish building your aircraft, using resettable circuit 	
4 	  Quote: 	
		  that you finish building your aircraft, using resettable circuit 	
5 	  Quote: 	
		  that you finish building your aircraft, using resettable circuit 	
6 	  Quote: 	
		  that you finish building your aircraft, using resettable circuit 	
7 	  Quote: 	
		  that you finish building your aircraft, using resettable circuit 	
8 	  Quote: 	
		  that you finish building your aircraft, using resettable circuit 	
9 	  Quote: 	
		  breakers, since this gives you a greater comfort 	
0 	  Quote: 	
		  breakers, since this gives you a greater comfort 	
1 	  Quote: 	
		  breakers, since this gives you a greater comfort 	
2 	  Quote: 	
		  breakers, since this gives you a greater comfort 	
3 	  Quote: 	
		  breakers, since this gives you a greater comfort 	
4 	  Quote: 	
		  breakers, since this gives you a greater comfort 	
5

  

       [quote][b]

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mrspudandcompany(at)veriz
Guest

Posted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 5:24 am Post subject: List decorum

 	  Quote: 	
		  May I suggestthat you finish building your aircraft, using resettable circuitbreakers, since this gives you a greater comfortlevel. Roger 	
  

   



   

 

    The pantry of electro-goodies that can be stirred into

    a host of recipes for success is huge. Just because any

    one of us has a preference over one ingredient vs. another

    should not be taken as an invitation to cast disparaging

    remarks.

 

 

    Bob . . .      	  Quote: 	
		    The above statement was NEVER said to “cast disparaging remarks”.  It was only to encourage that we stop the back and forth of the same statements, “beating the dead horse”, and move on with our learning/teaching process.  I honestly believe that if he feels more comfortable with circuit breakers, then he should install them! Roger 	


  

       [quote][b]

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nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
Guest

Posted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 6:03 am Post subject: List decorum

 	  Quote: 	
		  

  	  Quote: 	
		  The above statement was NEVER said to

“cast disparaging remarks”.  It was only to encourage that we stop

the back and forth of the same statements, “beating the dead horse”, and

move on with our learning/teaching process.  I honestly believe that

if he feels more comfortable with circuit breakers, then he should

install them!

[/b] 	
	


    Which is exactly what he will do with or

    without anyone's encouragement. The

    "disparaging remark" reference went to

    someone's suggestions that perhaps he

    "shouldn't be a pilot".



    As for beating a dead horse . . . this is

    a classroom of 1800+ students and teachers

    at last count. We need to keep in mind that

    while conversations between individuals may

    have been discussed many times in the past,

    folks who read them today may have been on

    the List a short time.



    If we can't make the newbies feel welcome

    and well informed then we degrade into

    a club of elites that discusses only "new"

    topics. The delete button works the same

    way on everybody's computer and nobody is

    being forced to participate in any conversation.

    If anyone is weary of a review of old topics,

    they can certainly start a thread on any new

    topic of their choice.



    Bob  . . .    [quote][b]

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dan(at)familybrown.org
Guest

Posted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 6:37 am Post subject: List decorum

Quoting "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com>:



 	  Quote: 	
		      "disparaging remark" reference went to

    someone's suggestions that perhaps he

    "shouldn't be a pilot".


	


That would be me, and I'm sorry they were taken as disparaging.   

Having never met Mr. Trigo, I certainly have no grounds to question  

his abilities as a pilot.  The questions he was posing, though, (which  

I took as hypothetical) sounded very panicky, and such a panicked  

reaction to losing only one radio doesn't seem consistent with good  

ADM.  I was intending to address the hypothetical response he posed; I  

didn't (and don't) assume that he would actually respond that way.



-- 

Dan Brown, KE6MKS, dan(at)familybrown.org

"Since all the world is but a story, it were well for thee to buy the

more enduring story rather than the story that is less enduring."

  -- The Judgment of St. Colum Cille

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trigo(at)mail.telepac.pt
Guest

Posted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 6:53 am Post subject: List decorum

No hard feelings, Don  

Let’s proceed with our eternal learning process, listening to Bob and other good teachers on this List  

   

Carlos  

   

[quote] --

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trigo(at)mail.telepac.pt
Guest

Posted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 6:53 am Post subject: List decorum

From: Carlos Trigo [mailto:trigo(at)mail.telepac.pt] 

 Sent: quinta-feira, 7 de Janeiro de 2010 14:52

 To: 'aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com'

 Subject: RE: AeroElectric-List: List decorum  

  

   

No hard feelings, Dan  

Let’s proceed with our eternal learning process, listening to Bob and other good teachers on this List  

   

Carlos  

   

[quote] --

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mmayfield

Joined: 09 Oct 2009
Posts: 40
Location: NSW Central Coast, Australia

Posted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 1:23 pm Post subject: Re: List decorum

There are many ways to skin a cat, I think, and going one way or the other doesn't make anyone smarter than anyone else.



The chances are that, if the system is designed well and installed well, anyone using either breakers or fuses will get a relatively long and hassle-free life out of it. Some want breakers, some want fuses. Tom-ay-to, tom-ah-to.......



Just do it properly and don't keep resetting/replacing them when they pop or blow without figuring out why they did!



 Mike

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