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Oil Shutoff Valve Chapter 2 Serious Failure

 
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byronmfox(at)gmail.com
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 27, 2010 7:24 am    Post subject: Oil Shutoff Valve Chapter 2 Serious Failure Reply with quote

In the course of our M14P conversion, I decided yesterday to repaint
the oil tank. As we began to remove the oil shutoff valve, a 2" crack
appeared in the oil tank adjacent to the blue AN coupling between the
valve and the tank. In the picture below, note the thin stream of oil
running just aft of the coupling.

It would appear that over time the vibration of the valve's mass using
the coupling as a lever fractured the thin aluminum wall of the tank.
When first installed, the valve should have been secured to the
firewall to inhibit the resulting harmonic. If you have this
installation, check it.

We got lucky yesterday, and we've decided not to reinstall the
valve. ...Blitz
Sent from my iPhone

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jetjockey



Joined: 12 Dec 2006
Posts: 31
Location: Granbury, Texas

PostPosted: Sat Feb 27, 2010 8:38 am    Post subject: Re: Oil Shutoff Valve Chapter 2 Serious Failure Reply with quote

This is a very timely post since I am in the process of installing a Kimball oil shutoff valve right now. I initially planned to install the valve on the oil tank exactly as shown in the picture but removed it because I had serious concerns about vibration and cracking of the oil tank which now seem to be validated. I am currently in the process of evaluating alternate installations. Has anyone else installed a Kimball valve on a CJ with a Housai engine? If so, would you please share your installation details and location along with some pictures, if possible?

Thanks,

Ray


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dougsappllc(at)gmail.com
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 27, 2010 9:48 am    Post subject: Oil Shutoff Valve Chapter 2 Serious Failure Reply with quote

Blitz,If you cannot repair yours I do have some new tanks in stock. �
I would think that a good welder could make a safe long lasting repair. �Especially if after the repair was done a�reinforcement�plate was then welded over this area you would have a double repair, and it would most�likely�last longer than you will even if you reinstall the valve the same way you have it now. �I think the installation dwg which I got from Craig Payne called for the plate to be installed.


Doug

On Sat, Feb 27, 2010 at 7:22 AM, Byron Fox <byronmfox(at)gmail.com (byronmfox(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
[quote] In the course of our M14P conversion, I decided yesterday �to repaint the oil tank. As we began to remove the oil shutoff valve, a 2" crack appeared in the oil tank adjacent to the blue AN coupling between the valve and the tank. In the picture below, note the thin stream of oil running just aft of the coupling.

It would appear that over time the vibration of the valve's mass using the coupling as a lever fractured the thin aluminum wall of the tank. When first installed, �the valve should have been secured to the firewall to inhibit the resulting harmonic. If you have this installation, check it.

We got lucky yesterday, and we've decided not to reinstall the valve. �...Blitz






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byronmfox(at)gmail.com
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 27, 2010 10:49 am    Post subject: Oil Shutoff Valve Chapter 2 Serious Failure Reply with quote

The welder was to come late yesterday after I left Ramona. I'll check with Vladimir. Thanks, B

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On Feb 27, 2010, at 9:47 AM, doug sapp <dougsappllc(at)gmail.com (dougsappllc(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

[quote]Blitz,If you cannot repair yours I do have some new tanks in stock.
I would think that a good welder could make a safe long lasting repair. Especially if after the repair was done a reinforcement plate was then welded over this area you would have a double repair, and it would most likely last longer than you will even if you reinstall the valve the same way you have it now. I think the installation dwg which I got from Craig Payne called for the plate to be installed.


Doug

On Sat, Feb 27, 2010 at 7:22 AM, Byron Fox <[url=mailto:byronmfox(at)gmail.com]byronmfox(at)gmail.com (byronmfox(at)gmail.com)[/url]> wrote:
Quote:
In the course of our M14P conversion, I decided yesterday to repaint the oil tank. As we began to remove the oil shutoff valve, a 2" crack appeared in the oil tank adjacent to the blue AN coupling between the valve and the tank. In the picture below, note the thin stream of oil running just aft of the coupling.

It would appear that over time the vibration of the valve's mass using the coupling as a lever fractured the thin aluminum wall of the tank. When first installed, the valve should have been secured to the firewall to inhibit the resulting harmonic. If you have this installation, check it.

We got lucky yesterday, and we've decided not to reinstall the valve. ...Blitz






Sent from my iPhone

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pilotdog57(at)aol.com
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 27, 2010 2:34 pm    Post subject: Oil Shutoff Valve Chapter 2 Serious Failure Reply with quote

I had a similar situation with US 303 type hose to the oil tank being too stiff and causing the area around the tank nipple to crack. Anything that helps transmit force to the tank is a bad idea- using the softer Russian hose helped solve the problem. Doug Zeissner
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cjpilot710(at)aol.com
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 27, 2010 6:33 pm    Post subject: Oil Shutoff Valve Chapter 2 Serious Failure Reply with quote

I've had a 10 micron Marion filter on my airplane for some 1600 hours. It saved my HS6 engine and has been on my M-14p its entire life. A hose from the pump to the filter and than to the oil cooler, keeps the entire system clean. I mounted the filter on a bracket I designed to fit on the firewall. It WILL SAVE YOUR ENGINE. If you do anything at all, put the filter on first.

Jim "Pappy" Goolsby





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cpayne(at)joimail.com
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 28, 2010 3:59 am    Post subject: Oil Shutoff Valve Chapter 2 Serious Failure Reply with quote

I have the helicopter valve hanging from the oil tank, works OK, but did crack the tank after my first 1/8" plate. I found that it took a 1/4" thick plate across the bottom of the tank to support the load.

If I were to do it again, I would have re-arranged the firewall plumbing and made a place for the valve on the firewall while the engine was off.

More work the first time...less work the second time.

Craig Payne


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barryhancock



Joined: 09 Oct 2008
Posts: 285

PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2010 9:38 am    Post subject: Re: Oil Shutoff Valve Chapter 2 Serious Failure Reply with quote

Gang,

A few more thoughts....

1) We have found no reason to put an oil shutoff on the Housai. It has been our experience that they are not as likely to get hydraulic lock as the M14P's, and don't leak nearly as much oil. Of course, the Housai can lock and that does not in any way mean you shouldn't have diligent preflight precautions.

2) Our installations have both a reinforced oil tank AND use a bracket mounted on the firewall to further reduce the load on the tank.

3) Since my last post I have heard of at least a half dozen of the "plate" style reinforcements leaking. Since we already do our modification on our restorations, and there appears to be a need to address this issue, we are going to offer this in a kit form. It will be a few days until I have pricing and a power point presentation on the installation. Anyone who is interested, please contact me off list and we'll get you the info just as soon as we have it.

Happy Flying,

Barry


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Worldwide Warbirds, Inc.
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