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mtherr(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 2:12 pm Post subject: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

Hi folks (especially those of you that are machinists 



I made pulley for my alternator from an aluminum plate.  I have a lathe, but I'm far from being a machinist.



I was pretty proud of me until about half an hour ago.  I made the center hole about .003 to .004 to large in diameter. (ouch!) (I cut .0015 to .002 too much).  Now, the pulley is pretty slack on the shaft. Is there a good way to make it the proper size (adonizing, other means) that will be  reliable... or do I need to start over and use this one as a failure trophy in my workshop?



Thanks!



----------------------------

Michel Therrien CH601-HD, C-GZGQ

  http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601

  http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby

      __________________________________________________________________

Yahoo! Canada Toolbar: Search from anywhere on the web, and bookmark your favourite sites. Download it now

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jaybannist(at)cs.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 2:41 pm Post subject: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

Michel,

 

 We used to send the new kid to the tool crib to request a hole shrinker.  Just a part of a good education. As for myself, I would proudly display a custom-made pulley with all my other "trophies".  Yes, I'm implying that you have indeed made yourself a "trophy". 

 And a hint - This probably won't be the last "trophy" you make.  Re-making a part is always easier than making the first botched one.  Please don't be discouraged by this kind of experience.  We all do it.  Keep after it and you'll get there, trust me.

 

 Jay Bannister

 

 

 

   

 

  

   

 

   

 

  --

Ron Lendon

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 685
Location: Clinton Twp., MI

Posted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 7:10 pm Post subject: Re: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

If it is a permanent mount you can shim the assembly.  Use one piece of shim stock cut to the width of pulley wrapped completely around the shaft except for the area where the key is.



Or just make another one, it's all about learning anyway.

_________________
Ron Lendon
WW Corvair with Roy's Garage 5th bearing
CH 601 XLB
N601LT - Flying
http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon
Corvair Engine Prints:
https://sites.google.com/site/corvairenginedata/

JohnDRead(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 7:41 pm Post subject: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

Hi Michel;

                 The  first was a learning experience, the second will be perfect. Have fun.

  

 Regards,  John



CH701 - Colorado - Jabiru 3300



Cell: 719-494-4567

Home:  303-648-3261   

  



  [quote][b]

flyadive(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 5:51 am Post subject: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

Mike:

  

 VERY GOOD JOB.  It does LQQK nice.  A bit slower and a rounded bit would prevent the score lines on the inside taper.

  

 BUT!  Have you inserted the Woodruff key?  You may find the problem goes away once inserted.  BUT!  Watch out for wobble.  

  

 The next thing you can do is make the center bigger and insert a sleeve.  Or get some shim stock and metal bonding CA glue.  Shim up the difference and you will be good to go.  

  

 How did you do the keyway?  

  

 Barry

  

 



 

 On Sun, Mar 7, 2010 at 5:08 PM, Michel Therrien <mtherr(at)yahoo.com (mtherr(at)yahoo.com)> wrote:

 [quote]Hi folks (especially those of you that are machinists 



I made pulley for my alternator from an aluminum plate.  I have a lathe, but I'm far from being a machinist.

 

I was pretty proud of me until about half an hour ago.  I made the center hole about .003 to .004 to large in diameter. (ouch!) (I cut .0015 to .002 too much).  Now, the pulley is pretty slack on the shaft. Is there a good way to make it the proper size (adonizing, other means) that will be  reliable... or do I need to start over and use this one as a failure trophy in my workshop?

 

Thanks!



----------------------------

Michel Therrien CH601-HD, C-GZGQ

 http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601

 http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby

  



     __________________________________________________________________

Yahoo! Canada Toolbar: Search from anywhere on the web, and bookmark your favourite sites. Download it now

[b]

Juan Vega Jr

Joined: 13 Jan 2009
Posts: 157

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 6:35 am Post subject: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

ron is correct,  a full wrapp shim may work. cheep and easiest way.  recoat or redo just takes more time.



Juan

--

Juan Vega Jr

Joined: 13 Jan 2009
Posts: 157

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 6:42 am Post subject: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

problem with a shim is it will be off balance and cause a vibration.



rebuild or build up the layer and remill.



Juan

--

Juan Vega Jr

Joined: 13 Jan 2009
Posts: 157

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 6:42 am Post subject: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

looking at the picture,  you just need to have a plasma coater add the metal back on. or its cheeper to rebuild new one.

Juan

--

mtherr(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 7:04 am Post subject: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

I bought an expensive broach with the appropriate collet.  So far this is an 80$ pulley and still spending... 



I think the sleeve idea is not bad, but if I have to redo machine work, i might be as good to start over.  And I am not precise enough with my tools to machine a press-fit assembly (.001 or .002 under clearance) with enough assurance.



I am surprised nobody liked the JB Weld approach... after all, I only need .0015" or .002" of it.  That thing has many uses including (for automotive):

- cracked engine blocks 

- transmission & rear-end casings 

- cylinder heads & sleeves 

- axles & hubs 

- valve guides 

- press fit bearings 

- crankshaft pulleys 

- casting defects 

- key ways 

- stripped threads 



It provides nearly 4000 psi of tensile strenght and it is good for up to 500F.  And if it could be good enough, that would save me about 6 hours of re-fabricating one (and buying the stock aluminum to start over).



Is there any warning against that?



----------------------------

Michel Therrien CH601-HD, C-GZGQ

  http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601

  http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby

--- On Mon, 3/8/10, FLYaDIVE <flyadive(at)gmail.com> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   VERY GOOD JOB.  It does LQQK nice.  A bit slower and

 a rounded bit would prevent the score lines on the inside

 taper.

  

 BUT!  Have you inserted the Woodruff key?  You may

 find the problem goes away once inserted.  BUT!  Watch out

 for wobble.  

  

 The next thing you can do is make the center bigger

 and insert a sleeve.  Or get some shim stock and metal

 bonding CA glue.  Shim up the difference and you will be

 good to go.  

  

 How did you do the keyway?  

  

 Barry

  


	


      __________________________________________________________________

The new Internet Explorer® 8 - Faster, safer, easier.  Optimized for Yahoo!  Get it Now for Free! at http://downloads.yahoo.com/ca/internetexplorer/

JohnDRead(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 12:03 pm Post subject: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

Michel;

             I  do not think there are any uses of JB Weld where one would not want to keep the  wheels on the ground!!

  

 Regards,  John



CH701 - Colorado - Jabiru 3300



Cell: 719-494-4567

Home:  303-648-3261   

  



  [quote][b]

n4546v(at)mindspring.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 12:03 pm Post subject: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

do not archive



Is knurling an option?  If you are only seeking .002", even .002" per side, 

it shouldn't take much to raise that much material in AL with an ID knurling 

tool.



Don't know the cost of the tool, maybe someone has one to loan.



ganurling, kanarling, you know, those little diamond shapes that raise metal 

above the surface.



Regards,



Randy, Las Vegas



Subject: Re: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

 	  Quote: 	
		   



 I bought an expensive broach with the appropriate collet.  So far this is 

 an 80$ pulley and still spending... 



 I think the sleeve idea is not bad, but if I have to redo machine work, i 

 might be as good to start over.  And I am not precise enough with my tools 

 to machine a press-fit assembly (.001 or .002 under clearance) with enough 

 assurance.

jaybannist(at)cs.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 2:25 pm Post subject: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

Michel,

 

 I have found that JBWeld is great with steel, not so great with aluminum.  I had quite a few failures to bond with aluminum before I reached that conclusion.

 

 Jay Bannister

 

   

 

  

   

 

   

 

  --

flyadive(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 2:25 pm Post subject: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

Plasma coating is NOT the way to go.  There are so many things to wrong with that process:

 1 - It is a hand operation - In this case

 2 - It is inside a through hole - Very difficult to get a uniform coating

 3 - It is OPERATOR dependent

 4 - HEAT is going to be high on the issue list - Again operator dependent

 5 - The part has to be VERY roughly sand blasted 20 to 40 grit - And there is a sharp edge that won't be any more ... More machining.

  

 The idea of using Hard Coat Anodizing is a good one.  But the build up is NOT 100% build up.  

 Example: a coating of 0.002" is ONLY a build up of 0.001" and a penetration of 0.001".  The coating shop calls that a 0.002" Coating.  IF - The hole dimension is off by 0.003" you will need a build up of 0.0015" per side so that means a coating of 0.003"

  THAT is difficult to do on many aluminum's, especially 2024.  I don't recall, what was the  sheave was made from?

 AND don't forget - - - They will have to mask the key-way.  Masking is the costly part of the job.  The rest of the part could be coated.  

  

 Shimming will NOT cause the the sheave to go off balance.  If that was the case the Woodruff Key would cause it to go off balance.  Also the weight distribution is so close to the centripetal center that a much larger mass would be need to cause an out of balance condition.  BUT!  If you have the opportunity to do so... BALANCE the alternator rotor and still if you have the equipment... Do it in the housing.

   

  

 Barry

 



 

 On Mon, Mar 8, 2010 at 9:07 AM, Juan Vega <amyvega2005(at)earthlink.net (amyvega2005(at)earthlink.net)> wrote:

 [quote] --> Zenith-List message posted by: Juan Vega <amyvega2005(at)earthlink.net (amyvega2005(at)earthlink.net)>

looking at the picture,  you just need to have a plasma coater add the metal back on. or its cheeper to rebuild new one.

 Juan

 



--

mtherr(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 3:53 pm Post subject: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

Thanks for the response... The material is 6061-T6.  



The pulley is the one going on the engine side, not the alternator side.  



If I get the part anodized, I could recut the key hole after (?)



----------------------------

Michel Therrien CH601-HD, C-GZGQ

  http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601

  http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby

--- On Mon, 3/8/10, FLYaDIVE <flyadive(at)gmail.com> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   From: FLYaDIVE <flyadive(at)gmail.com>

 Subject: Re: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

 To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com

 Received: Monday, March 8, 2010, 4:47 PM

 Plasma coating is NOT the way to go. 

 There are so many things to wrong with that process:

 1 - It is a hand operation - In this case

 2 - It is inside a through hole - Very difficult to

 get a uniform coating

 3 - It is OPERATOR dependent

 4 - HEAT is going to be high on the issue list - Again

 operator dependent

 5 - The part has to be VERY roughly sand blasted 20 to

 40 grit - And there is a sharp edge that won't be any

 more ... More machining.

  

 The idea of using Hard Coat Anodizing is a good one. 

 But the build up is NOT 100% build up.  

 Example: a coating of 0.002" is ONLY a build up

 of 0.001" and a penetration of 0.001".  The

 coating shop calls that a 0.002" Coating.  IF - The

 hole dimension is off by 0.003" you will need a build

 up of 0.0015" per side so that means a coating of

 0.003"

 

 THAT is difficult to do on many aluminum's,

 especially 2024.  I don't recall, what was the  sheave

 was made from?

 AND don't forget - - - They will have to mask the

 key-way.  Masking is the costly part of the job.  The rest

 of the part could be coated.  

  

 Shimming will NOT cause the the sheave to go off

 balance.  If that was the case the Woodruff Key would cause

 it to go off balance.  Also the weight distribution is so

 close to the centripetal center that a much larger mass

 would be need to cause an out of balance condition.  BUT! 

 If you have the opportunity to do so... BALANCE the

 alternator rotor and still if you have the equipment... Do

 it in the housing.


	


      __________________________________________________________________

Yahoo! Canada Toolbar: Search from anywhere on the web, and bookmark your favourite sites. Download it now

mtherr(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 3:53 pm Post subject: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

Well. this is exactly what I thought about and I did not readilly see consequences... the pulley will be attached very tightly to the shaft using a 1/2" lock nut and washer (it is not just pressed fit..  It has a woodruf key and if the materials wears out (which I don't know how it would do that since there is no relative movement), the most the pulley will move is .002".  All the material around the hole is thick, and solid.  I'm no expert... could it cause the lock nut to unscrew itself?  

----------------------------

Michel Therrien CH601-HD, C-GZGQ

  http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601

  http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby

--- On Mon, 3/8/10, ronlee <rlee468(at)comcast.net> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   Consider the consequences if it should fail. After all this

 isn't going on a garden tractor!

 

 --------

 Ron Lee

 Tucson, Arizona

do not archive
	




      __________________________________________________________________

Get a sneak peak at messages with a handy reading pane with All new Yahoo! Mail: http://ca.promos.yahoo.com/newmail/overview2/

Z601c(at)anemicaardvark.c
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 3:56 pm Post subject: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

The problem with JB Weld is that (as far as I'm aware) it does not have any 

tested, documented properties. At least, not the kind of testing really needed 

for aircraft use. It may work fine; it may not. 



I might consider it for something that was not moving, did not require defined 

structural properties, or was not subjected to vibration. 



I once heard a fellow staunchly defending a repair he made to his prop with JB 

Weld. And that was on a certificated aircraft!



On Monday 08 March 2010 08:40:52 you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 I bought an expensive broach with the appropriate collet.  So far this is

  an 80$ pulley and still spending... 

 

 I think the sleeve idea is not bad, but if I have to redo machine work, i

  might be as good to start over.  And I am not precise enough with my tools

  to machine a press-fit assembly (.001 or .002 under clearance) with enough

  assurance.

 

 I am surprised nobody liked the JB Weld approach... after all, I only need

  .0015" or .002" of it.  That thing has many uses including (for

  automotive): - cracked engine blocks

 - transmission & rear-end casings

 - cylinder heads & sleeves

 - axles & hubs

 - valve guides

 - press fit bearings

 - crankshaft pulleys

 - casting defects

 - key ways

 - stripped threads

 

 It provides nearly 4000 psi of tensile strenght and it is good for up to

  500F.  And if it could be good enough, that would save me about 6 hours of

  re-fabricating one (and buying the stock aluminum to start over).

 

 Is there any warning against that?

 

-- 
	


========================================

                                       Jim B. Belcher

                                       BS,MS Physics

                                            A&P/IA

                      General Radio Telephone Certificate

                               Instrument Rated Pilot

                     Retired Aerospace Technical Manager

                         Semi-proficient Househusband

========================================

Larry Webber

Joined: 05 Jun 2008
Posts: 63
Location: West Kingston Rhode Island

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 6:22 pm Post subject: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

Jim ? would you go flying with that guy and his jb welded prop?



  

 DO NO ARCHIVE



 Larry



  

 	  Quote: 	
		   From: Z601c(at)anemicaardvark.com

 To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: Re: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

 Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 17:31:39 -0600

 

 --> Zenith-List message posted by: Jim Belcher <Z601c(at)anemicaardvark.com>

 

 The problem with JB Weld is that (as far as I'm aware) it does not have any 

 tested, documented properties. At least, not the kind of testing really needed 

 for aircraft use. It may work fine; it may not. 

 

 I might consider it for something that was not moving, did not require defined 

 structural properties, or was not subjected to vibration. 

 

 I once heard a fellow staunchly defending a repair he made to his prop with JB 

 Weld. And that was on a certificated aircraft!

 

 On Monday 08 March 2010 08:40:52 you wrote:

 > --> Zenith-List message posted by: Michel Therrien <mtherr(at)yahoo.com>

 > 

 > I bought an expensive broach with the appropriate collet. So far this is

 > an 80$ pulley and still spending... 

 > 

 > I think the sleeve idea is not bad, but if I have to redo machine work, i

 > might be as good to start over. And I am not precise enough with my tools

 > to machine a press-fit assembly (.001 or .002 under clearance) with enough

 > assurance.

 > 

 > I am surprised nobody liked the JB Weld approach... after all, I only need

 > .0015" or .002" of it. That thing has many uses including (for

 > automotive): - cracked engine blocks

 > - transmission & rear-end casings

 > - cylinder heads & sleeves

 > - axles & hubs

 > - valve guides

 > - press fit bearings

 > - crankshaft pulleys

 > - casting defects

 > - key ways

 > - stripped threads

 > 

 > It provides nearly 4000 psi of tensile strenght and it is good for up to

 > 500F. And if it could be good enough, that would save me about 6 hours of

 > re-fabricating one (and buying the stock aluminum to start over).

 > 

 > Is there any warning against that?

 > 

 -- 

 ========================================

 Jim B. Belcher

 BS,MS Physics

 A&P/IA

 General Radio Telephone Certificate

 Instrument Rated Pilot

 Retired Aerospace Technical Manager

 Semi-proficient Househusband

 ========================================

 

=======================

&g=======
	


[quote] 

 

 

 		 	   		  Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection. '>Sign up now.   	  Quote: 	
		  [b]

_________________
how do you eat an elephant ? one bite at a time

Larry Webber

Joined: 05 Jun 2008
Posts: 63
Location: West Kingston Rhode Island

Posted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 6:36 pm Post subject: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

Michel   why not just insert some precision shim stock to remove play whatever you use to hold pulley on will contain shim stock. if the shim is wrapped around the shaft, the keyway will prevent any oscillationsof pulley , we used this on high rpm machinery 8to 12k rpm for months and months without a single failure and this equipment went thru lots of rapid de-acceleration cycles....   

 for what its worth 

 Larry



  

  To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: Re: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 10:56:20 -0500

From: jaybannist(at)cs.com



 Michel,



I have found that JBWeld is great with steel, not so great with aluminum.  I had quite a few failures to bond with aluminum before I reached that conclusion.



Jay Bannister



 



 

 



 



 --

_________________
how do you eat an elephant ? one bite at a time

flyadive(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 6:12 am Post subject: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

Michel:

  

 I would just ask them to MASK the keyway.  In the business it is know as DOUBLE MASKING one layer of special masking tape and a coating of a liquid masking over the tape.

  

 The cost for masking might be $30 tops ... It is the labor you are paying for.

  

 It sure would be much less time consuming than re-cutting AND ... HERE is the BIG AND ...

 Hard Coat Anodize can have a theoretical Rockwell of over 60.  This makes it VERY difficult to machine AND even if you did machine it, so hard it can dull a carbide bit.  Also penetration part of the hardcoat after machining never is smooth.  Go with the masking.

   

 Barry

 On Mon, Mar 8, 2010 at 5:40 PM, Michel Therrien <mtherr(at)yahoo.com (mtherr(at)yahoo.com)> wrote:

 [quote] --> Zenith-List message posted by: Michel Therrien <mtherr(at)yahoo.com (mtherr(at)yahoo.com)>

Thanks for the response... The material is 6061-T6.



The pulley is the one going on the engine side, not the alternator side.

 

If I get the part anodized, I could recut the key hole after (?)

 

----------------------------

Michel Therrien CH601-HD, C-GZGQ

 http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601

 http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby

 



--- On Mon, 3/8/10, FLYaDIVE <flyadive(at)gmail.com (flyadive(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

 > From: FLYaDIVE <flyadive(at)gmail.com (flyadive(at)gmail.com)>



 > Subject: Re: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)



 > To: zenith-list(at)matronics.com (zenith-list(at)matronics.com)



 	  Quote: 	
		   Received: Monday, March 8, 2010, 4:47 PM

  
	


 > Plasma coating is NOT the way to go. 

 	  Quote: 	
		   There are so many things to wrong with that process:

 1 - It is a hand operation - In this case

 2 - It is inside a through hole - Very difficult to

 > get a uniform coating
	


 	  Quote: 	
		   3 - It is OPERATOR dependent

 4 - HEAT is going to be high on the issue list - Again

 operator dependent

 5 - The part has to be VERY roughly sand blasted 20 to

 40 grit - And there is a sharp edge that won't be any

 > more ... More machining.
	


 	  Quote: 	
		    

 The idea of using Hard Coat Anodizing is a good one. 

 But the build up is NOT 100% build up. 

 Example: a coating of 0.002" is ONLY a build up

 of 0.001" and a penetration of 0.001".  The

 > coating shop calls that a 0.002" Coating.  IF - The
	


 	  Quote: 	
		   hole dimension is off by 0.003" you will need a build

 up of 0.0015" per side so that means a coating of

 0.003"



 > THAT is difficult to do on many aluminum's,
	


 	  Quote: 	
		   especially 2024.  I don't recall, what was the  sheave

 was made from?

 AND don't forget - - - They will have to mask the

 key-way.  Masking is the costly part of the job.  The rest

 > of the part could be coated. 
	


 	  Quote: 	
		    

 Shimming will NOT cause the the sheave to go off

 balance.  If that was the case the Woodruff Key would cause

 it to go off balance.  Also the weight distribution is so

 > close to the centripetal center that a much larger mass
	


 	  Quote: 	
		   would be need to cause an out of balance condition.  BUT! 

 If you have the opportunity to do so... BALANCE the

 alternator rotor and still if you have the equipment... Do

 > it in the housing.
	




      __________________________________________________________________

Yahoo! Canada Toolbar: Search from anywhere on the ========

 

  

 mp; Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ,

 ="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Zenith-List" target="_blank">http:=====

  http://forums.mle, List Admin.

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[b]

flyadive(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 6:24 am Post subject: Reducing a hole diameter? (alternator pulley)

You are correct Michel:

  

 The only thing I can think of that would work against you and it works against all of us is VIBRATION and maybe a back-fire.

  

 Barry

 On Mon, Mar 8, 2010 at 6:18 PM, Michel Therrien <mtherr(at)yahoo.com (mtherr(at)yahoo.com)> wrote:

 [quote]--> Zenith-List message posted by: Michel Therrien <mtherr(at)yahoo.com (mtherr(at)yahoo.com)>

 

Well. this is exactly what I thought about and I did not readilly see consequences... the pulley will be attached very tightly to the shaft using a 1/2" lock nut and washer (it is not just pressed fit..  It has a woodruf key and if the materials wears out (which I don't know how it would do that since there is no relative movement), the most the pulley will move is .002".  All the material around the hole is thick, and solid.  I'm no expert... could it cause the lock nut to unscrew itself?

 



----------------------------

Michel Therrien CH601-HD, C-GZGQ

 http://mthobby.pcperfect.com/ch601

 http://pages.infinit.net/mthobby

 



--- On Mon, 3/8/10, ronlee <rlee468(at)comcast.net (rlee468(at)comcast.net)> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   Consider the consequences if it should fail. After all this

 isn't going on a garden tractor!

 >
	


 	  Quote: 	
		   --------

 Ron Lee

 Tucson, Arizona

do not archive
	




     __________________________________________________________________

Get a sneak peak at messages with a handy reading pane with All new Yahoo! Mail: http://ca.promos.yahoo.com/newmail/overview2/

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