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Something I didn't want to see

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rv-4

Joined: 03 Apr 2008
Posts: 13
Location: MontrÃ©al

Posted: Thu Apr 01, 2010 6:23 pm Post subject: Something I didn't want to see

Hello Gents

                     Well today I had the misfortune to find a 6 inches crack on the right hand side  of my RV-4 canopy...To say that I really did not need this will be an  understatement as you can imagine.( Specially the second time )

 How it cracked after been on the a/c for 9 years  is beyond me. The a/c had been in storage for the winter inside my  hangar.The only thing that I could imagine being the cause would  be temperature' changes since the temperature has been going up & down  fairly quickly in the last few days / week...

  

 That said, I'm sure I'm not the only one who had that  nasty surprise and I would like to know if some of you guys decided to fix the  crack rather than installing a new canopy? If so, how did you do it and did it  last?

  

 Has anyone of you ever glued a canopy on an RV-4   rather than using pop rivets or screw to hold it in place, if yes how  did you do it and if possible if you have pictures I could look at, to e-mailed  them to me so I could used your experience to re-install ( # 1 solution so far )  the new canopy that I will probably ordered from Van's in the next few  days?? 

  

 Thanks in advance

  

 Bruno Dionne

 rv4(at)videotron.ca (rv4(at)videotron.ca)

 C-GDBH RV-4

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pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.
Guest

Posted: Thu Apr 01, 2010 6:59 pm Post subject: Something I didn't want to see

Bruno wrote:  	  Quote: 	
		           Hello Gents

                      Well today I had the misfortune to find a 6 inches crack on the right hand side of my RV-4 canopy...To say that I really did not need this will be an understatement as you can imagine.( Specially the second time )

   How it cracked after been on the a/c for 9 years is beyond me.

 	
 Oh, that hurts. The canopy is acrylic, and the plasticisers will outgass over time making the canopy brittle.  And it shrinks in this process.  All it takes is a little stress and ......

  	  Quote: 	
		      The a/c had been in storage for the winter inside my hangar.The only thing that I could imagine being the cause would be temperature' changes since the temperature has been going up & down fairly quickly in the last few days / week...

 	
 As the temp drops, the plastic shrinks ..... aggravating the problem.

  	  Quote: 	
		      

   That said, I'm sure I'm not the only one who had that nasty surprise and I would like to know if some of you guys decided to fix the crack rather than installing a new canopy? If so, how did you do it and did it last?

 	
 Well, I'vee been there, done that.  I hit my head on the canopy of my Pitts during an outside snap roll, and that caused a crack from where my head hit to the aft edge of the canopy.  I was aligning the edges of the crack and  ...... another crack from the crack point over my head to the back edge ..... about 6" from the original, letting me hold this big piece of my canopy in my hand.  Not a good day.  I went to a sign shop and bought a can of acrylic glue.  It's like water.  I fit the piece back into the canopy as best I could ..... it didn't fit real good because the stress was gone and the canopy relaxed a bit.  Using a diabetic insulin syringe, I put a little of the glue along the crack ... it really wicks along and almost made the crack disappear  Patience is golden here as excess glue will drip down the canopy .... and make more work.  The edges that didn't meet up well were really noticeable, but the cracks weren't where I see them so I just polished out the crack to make it the best it could be.  It's now a conversation piece when I go places.

  	  Quote: 	
		      

   Has anyone of you ever glued a canopy on an RV-4  rather than using pop rivets

 	
 Pop rivets put major stress on the plastic!!!

  	  Quote: 	
		      or screw to hold it in place,

 	
 Much better.  Make the holes oversize to give the canopy room to 'float' as it ages to reduce stress when the canopy shrinks against the screw.

  	  Quote: 	
		      if yes how did you do it and if possible if you have pictures I could look at, to e-mailed them to me so I could used your experience to re-install ( # 1 solution so far ) the new canopy that I will probably ordered from Van's in the next few days??   

   

 	
 Can't help you there.  I plan on using the same stuff that they use on car windshields now when I put the windows and windshield in my -10.

 Linn

 [quote]    

   Thanks in advance

    

   Bruno Dionne

   rv4(at)videotron.ca (rv4(at)videotron.ca)

   C-GDBH RV-4

    

    

    

 [b]

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thilo.kind(at)gmx.net
Guest

Posted: Fri Apr 02, 2010 2:39 am Post subject: Something I didn't want to see

Hi Bruno,  

   

Very sorry to hear about that. Sounds like a stress cracking caused by inherent stress in the canopy in conjunction with temperature changes, exposure to sunlight, and / or (most likely) use of detergents or solvents on the canopy.  

   

You can glue the crack using special glue for PMMA (acrylic sheet), but the crack will remain visible.  

   

Thilo  

         

  

From: owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bruno

 Sent: Friday, April 02, 2010 04:19

 To: RV-List

 Subject: Something I didn't want to see  

  

     

Hello Gents  

    

                   Well today I had the misfortune to find a 6 inches crack on the right hand side of my RV-4 canopy...To say that I really did not need this will be an understatement as you can imagine.( Specially the second time )  

    

How it cracked after been on the a/c for 9 years is beyond me. The a/c had been in storage for the winter inside my hangar.The only thing that I could imagine being the cause would be temperature' changes since the temperature has been going up & down fairly quickly in the last few days / week...  

    

   

    

That said, I'm sure I'm not the only one who had that nasty surprise and I would like to know if some of you guys decided to fix the crack rather than installing a new canopy? If so, how did you do it and did it last?  

    

   

    

Has anyone of you ever glued a canopy on an RV-4  rather than using pop rivets or screw to hold it in place, if yes how did you do it and if possible if you have pictures I could look at, to e-mailed them to me so I could used your experience to re-install ( # 1 solution so far ) the new canopy that I will probably ordered from Van's in the next few days??   

    

   

    

Thanks in advance  

    

   

    

Bruno Dionne  

    

rv4(at)videotron.ca (rv4(at)videotron.ca)  

    

C-GDBH RV-4  

    

   

    

   

    

   

  

No virus found in this incoming message.

 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

 08:32:00  

       [quote][b]

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khorton01(at)rogers.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Apr 02, 2010 3:00 am Post subject: Something I didn't want to see

Bruno,



Ouch.  That really sucks, especially just at the start of the flying season.



You can probably fix the crack, as described below in a message that was originally posted by RV builder Noel Drew from South Africa.



Good luck,



Kevin



 	  Quote: 	
		   I can share your feelings on a canopy crack.  My RV6 windscreen decided to

 start a crack from the roll bar down some 6 inches that probably started

 from somebody else resting too hard on the edge.  This is an early 1/4 inch

 windscreen that Van offered when the slider was first introduced and to the

 best of my knowledge is no longer obtainable.

 

 I was considering my options when a glider pilot looked at it and said

 "weld" it like the glider owners do.  I suppose there is always a first time

 for everything so I started seeking advice.

 

 I first located some liquid methyl methacrylate monomer that is the raw

 material used in the manufacture of sheet plexiglas.  It is not the glue

 that is sometimes supplied nor is it solvent.  It is called stabilised

 monomer.  Having stop drilled the crack, I cut a V shaped groove on the line

 of the crack leaving a narrow gap at the bottom and about 3/16" wide at the

 top.  I located a thick needle for a hypodermic syringe and was able to lay

 the viscous liquid monomer in the gap with tip of the needle submerged to

 avoid bubbles.  After somewhat of a learning curve I was able to generate a

 reasonable weld.

 

 The problems you will encounter will be bubbles trapped in the liquid, a

 flow of liquid down the slope of the windscreen, the monomer going solid in

 the syringe, needle, and on the surface of the jar it is supplied in.  I

 should mention that the monomer will evaporate and shrink in the groove if

 you do not get it to set quickly by exposing it to ultraviolet radiation.

 At different times I used the sun (very quick) and a crack testing lamp from

 the nearby engine shop.  Less than a minute in Durban's sun will have it too

 stiff to go anywhere while it will remain liquid for hours in the

 ultraviolet free workshop.  After a few false starts that were rectified by

 starting over with the Dremel, the result looked like a metal weld with a

 ridge of plexiglas on both sides.  Careful shaving and sanding gave me a

 surface that polished up very well after it had set properly.

 

 The end result is a line in my canopy that is smooth and transparent but it

 deflects the light as is does not entirely match the colour or refractive

 index of the original material.   I am satisfied with the strength of the

 join and now regard the repair as an honourable scar on my companion and a

 satisfactory compromise to the huge task of replacing the windscreen.


	


On 2010-04-01, at 22:19 , Bruno wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   Hello Gents

                   Well today I had the misfortune to find a 6 inches crack on the right hand side of my RV-4 canopy...To say that I really did not need this will be an understatement as you can imagine.( Specially the second time )

 How it cracked after been on the a/c for 9 years is beyond me. The a/c had been in storage for the winter inside my hangar.The only thing that I could imagine being the cause would be temperature' changes since the temperature has been going up & down fairly quickly in the last few days / week...

 

 That said, I'm sure I'm not the only one who had that nasty surprise and I would like to know if some of you guys decided to fix the crack rather than installing a new canopy? If so, how did you do it and did it last?

 

 Has anyone of you ever glued a canopy on an RV-4  rather than using pop rivets or screw to hold it in place, if yes how did you do it and if possible if you have pictures I could look at, to e-mailed them to me so I could used your experience to re-install ( # 1 solution so far ) the new canopy that I will probably ordered from Van's in the next few days?? 

 

 Thanks in advance

 

 Bruno Dionne

 rv4(at)videotron.ca

 C-GDBH RV-4

- The Matronics RV-List Email Forum -

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

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d-burton(at)comcast.net
Guest

Posted: Fri Apr 02, 2010 5:30 am Post subject: Something I didn't want to see

Hi Bruno,

  

 Take a look at this:

  

 http://www.tapplastics.com/info/adhesives.php?

  

 Get some acrylic and do some practicing.  We  produce flawless near invisible joints using this process.  Once you figure  out the technique you can do a repair like this quickly.  The liquid will  melt the surface of the canopy if you allow it to dribble and run.   Practice first.  If the crack has drawn apart I would use the technique  that Kevin suggested.  

  

 Methyl Chloride is a dangerous carcinogen that people  are far to careless with.  Protect yourself while using it...

  

 DavidB

  



  From: Bruno (rv4(at)videotron.ca) 

 Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2010 7:19 PM

 To: RV-List (rv-list(at)matronics.com) 

 Subject: Something I didn't want to see

 



 Hello Gents

                     Well today I had the misfortune to find a 6 inches crack on the right hand side  of my RV-4 canopy...To say that I really did not need this will be an  understatement as you can imagine.( Specially the second time )

 How it cracked after been on the a/c for 9 years  is beyond me. The a/c had been in storage for the winter inside my  hangar.The only thing that I could imagine being the cause would  be temperature' changes since the temperature has been going up & down  fairly quickly in the last few days / week...

  

 That said, I'm sure I'm not the only one who had that  nasty surprise and I would like to know if some of you guys decided to fix the  crack rather than installing a new canopy? If so, how did you do it and did it  last?

  

 Has anyone of you ever glued a canopy on an RV-4   rather than using pop rivets or screw to hold it in place, if yes how  did you do it and if possible if you have pictures I could look at, to e-mailed  them to me so I could used your experience to re-install ( # 1 solution so far )  the new canopy that I will probably ordered from Van's in the next few  days?? 

  

 Thanks in advance

  

 Bruno Dionne

 rv4(at)videotron.ca (rv4(at)videotron.ca)

 C-GDBH RV-4

  

  

  

    [quote][b]

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aerobubba(at)earthlink.ne
Guest

Posted: Fri Apr 02, 2010 6:22 am Post subject: Something I didn't want to see

Hi Bruno-



I'd suggest checking into Todd's canopies down in Ft. Lauderdale.  Last I

saw, his canopies were thicker, stronger, available in several tints,

customizable, cheaper, and came with a guarantee.  



You can (used to be able to?) find an article on the RV wiki about gluing

canopies.  



glen matejcek

aerobubba(at)earthlink.net

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rv8a2001(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Apr 02, 2010 6:27 am Post subject: Something I didn't want to see

Something to remember the canopy expands and contracts you must give it room to do so. I put my canopy on with screws. The screw was, lets say .150 diameter the hole in the canopy is ~.187. Somebody once said an RV-8 canopy lengthens 3/16 of an inch between 32F and 100F. Thats a bunch of stress if the canopy is not allowed to move.........

 

Scott

RV-8a





From: Bruno <rv4(at)videotron.ca>

To: RV-List <rv-list(at)matronics.com>

Sent: Thu, April 1, 2010 7:19:05 PM

Subject: Something I didn't want to see



      Hello Gents

                     Well today I had the misfortune to find a 6 inches crack on the right hand side  of my RV-4 canopy...To say that I really did not need this will be an  understatement as you can imagine.( Specially the second time )

 How it cracked after been on the a/c for 9 years  is beyond me. The a/c had been in storage for the winter inside my  hangar.The only thing that I could imagine being the cause would  be temperature' changes since the temperature has been going up & down  fairly quickly in the last few days / week...

  

 That said, I'm sure I'm not the only one who had that  nasty surprise and I would like to know if some of you guys decided to fix the  crack rather than installing a new canopy? If so, how did you do it and did it  last?

  

 Has anyone of you ever glued a canopy on an RV-4   rather than using pop rivets or screw to hold it in place, if yes how  did you do it and if possible if you have pictures I could look at, to e-mailed  them to me so I could used your experience to re-install ( # 1 solution so far )  the new canopy that I will probably ordered from Van's in the next few  days?? 

  

 Thanks in advance

  

 Bruno Dionne

 rv4(at)videotron.ca (rv4(at)videotron.ca)

 C-GDBH RV-4

  

  

  

 



 



           [quote][b]

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Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

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