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Re-registration quirk for E-LSA

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rickofudall

Joined: 19 Sep 2009
Posts: 1392
Location: Udall, KS, USA

Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 11:24 am Post subject: Re-registration quirk for E-LSA

The new requirement to re-register an aircraft every three years has extremely important implications if your airplane flies on an Experimental Light Sport Aircraft airworthiness certificate. It does not matter is you registered your fat ultralight using the provisions of FAR 21-191 i(1) or if you demoted your S-LSA per 21.191 i(3). If you have an E-LSA and you fail to re-register and let the registration expire, there is NO WAY to re-register your aircraft. 21.191 i(1) has expired as of January 31st of this year and demoting an S-LSA using 21.191 i(3) is a one way street. Once an S-LSA is demoted it cannot then be registered as an S-LSA and demoted again. Bottom line is, if you have an E-LSA do not miss re-registering your aircraft or it will be the most expensive $5 you never spent.

Rick Girard

-- 

Zulu Delta

Kolb Mk IIIC

 582 Gray head

4.00 C gearbox

3 blade WD

Thanks, Homer GBYM

It is not bigotry to be certain we are right; but it is bigotry to be unable to imagine how we might possibly have gone wrong.

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_________________
The smallest miracle right in front of you is enough to make you happy....

imap8ntr(at)cox.net
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Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 11:41 am Post subject: Re-registration quirk for E-LSA

Rick,

 Never heard about this  re-registering every three years.   Is this only for E-LSA or for both  that and S-LSA?    I think it has always been a one way street  that if an S-LSA is demoted to and E-LSA than it can never go back but still  never heard about re-registering?

 Thanks

 Ivan

 [quote]   ---

bob(at)fly-ul.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 12:08 pm Post subject: Re-registration quirk for E-LSA

On 12:38 PM 9/9/2010, Ivan wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  Rick,

Never heard about this re-registering every three years.   Is this only for E-LSA or for both that and S-LSA?    I think it has always been a one way street that if an S-LSA is demoted to and E-LSA than it can never go back but still never heard about re-registering?


	


Info here: http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/aircraft_certification/aircraft_registry/reregistration/



Its for all aircraft (this ain't just a light-sport thing). Also, yes, it is possible and legal to convert a previously "demoted" S-LSA, now an E-LSA, back into the S-LSA category. I doubt you'll ever see that happen, because the manufacturer would need to once again "certify" that your aircraft meets all the standards. No manufacturer will want to take on that responsibility/liability. So, legally, its not a one way street, but in all practicality, it kind of is.

--

Bob Comperini

e-mail: bob(at)fly-ul.com

WWW: http://www.fly-ul.com

Roger Lee

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1464
Location: Tucson, Az.

Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 12:15 pm Post subject: Re: Re-registration quirk for E-LSA

This new 3 year registration is for all aircraft, not just LSA. It starts this November and is spread out over the next three years and then it will continue to re-cycle. It goes by months for when you registered the first time and the year you did it has nothing to do with anything. . I have already seen one letter. You should get a letter in the mail from the FAA when you are do provided you didn't lie to them to start with about who and where your plane was registered. If you know your aircraft registration is not correct get it done and the sooner the better. The letter said do nothing if the info was correct in that letter. If it is wrong you must send the corrected info back to the FAA. If you fail to do this you will have your registration canceled and loose your "N" number. There is a grace period in the letter, do not let it expire!

There is a cost which has not been fully settled on yet. Some where between $45 and up from what I hear.



It may take up to 90 days for the FAA to process your registration so if you procrastinate and wait until the last few weeks your grounded until it comes back. They are notifying pilots almost 5-6 months in advance so no one has a complaint about not having enough time.



My registration was issued in Dec. It will expire June 30, 2013 and I am required to re-register between Feb-April of 2013.



A reminder - 

that this new FAA Aircraft RE-REGISTRATION THING starts as early as this November 1st (2010). Aircraft with a MARCH REGISTRATION DATE (any year) are the FIRST to RE-Register your aircraft. Your aircraft registration will expire on March 31st of 2011, but you can start the process of re-registering as early as this November 1st (2010).

The data base needs a complete update US wide and this is the way it is being done. Over the next three years all aircraft will be re-registered. It will help get rid of many problems like what happened to the King's.



Here is where you can find the final rule: 



http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/2010/2010-17572.htm



Here is another info link:



http://www.faa.gov/news/press_releases/news_story.cfm?newsId=11617



Hi Rick,



As far as letting the fat Ultralight aircraft that was converted to ELSA expire, well that won't be an issue. The fat Ultralight timetable to ELSA is done. You either complied or didn't. That dead line is gone. Once you are in the ELSA category you are there and the fat Ultralight has nothing to do with your registration any longer. If you allow your registration for this new FAA re-registration to laps then you would loose your airworthy cert. until you brought it back into an updated status and I think there is a fine, but don't quote me on the fine issue. This is still being shaken out some. I need to get more info on this, too.

FAA registration timetable.pdf

Description:

FAA Registration Timetable

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FAA registration timetable.pdf

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_________________
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Rotax Instructor & Rotax IRC
Light Sport Repairman
Home 520-574-1080 TRY HOME FIRST
Cell 520-349-7056

Last edited by Roger Lee on Thu Sep 09, 2010 12:48 pm; edited 7 times in total

Roger Lee

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1464
Location: Tucson, Az.

Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 12:20 pm Post subject: Re: Re-registration quirk for E-LSA

Hi Bob,



Nice to hear from you again.



Hi All,



Bob is absolutely right about going back to SLSA from ELSA, it can be done, but the original MFG isn't going to sign it off back to SLSA because they don't know what you did to it when it was an ELSA and they aren't going to take that kind or liability on their shoulders. It is legal, but not likely.

_________________
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Rotax Instructor & Rotax IRC
Light Sport Repairman
Home 520-574-1080 TRY HOME FIRST
Cell 520-349-7056

bob(at)fly-ul.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 1:38 pm Post subject: Re-registration quirk for E-LSA

 	  Quote: 	
		   The new requirement to re-register an aircraft every three years has extremely important 

 implications if your airplane flies on an Experimental Light Sport Aircraft airworthiness 

 certificate. It does not matter is you registered your fat ultralight using the 

 provisions of FAR 21-191 i(1) or if you demoted your S-LSA per 21.191 i(3). If you 

 have an E-LSA and you fail to re-register and let the registration expire, there is 

 NO WAY to re-register your aircraft. 


	


Ya know, I'm not sure about this "No way" comment. Your airworthiness certificate is not expiring, just the registration. Without a valid registration, the aircraft of course can't be flown, until the registration is current again (kind of along the lines that you can't fly it without a current annual), right?



Yes, eventually, the FAA will cancel the N-Number, but there is a process (admittedly, a hassle) to get a new N-Number, or to reclaim your "old" one, which is not much different than changing the N-Number on a plane. 



But the bottom line is that big hassles will come your way, if you ignore the re-registration thing. So yes, everyone needs to "comply"



--

Bob Comperini

e-mail: bob(at)fly-ul.com

WWW: http://www.fly-ul.com

Blumax008(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 1:38 pm Post subject: Re-registration quirk for E-LSA

OR, OR, OR....YOU CAN DO LIKE I DO...DON'T REGISTER THE  SON OF A BITCH TO START WITH! 

  

 ALL YOU GOODIE-TWO-SHOES HAVE AT IT! I'M LAUGHING MY  ASS OFF AT ALL THIS BULLSHIT.

  

 GOOD FOR YOU! EAT IT UP! PAY THAT MONEY! OBAMA, PELOSI  & REID NEED ALL THE MONEY YOU DINGBATS CAN THROW AT 'EM!

  

 WHAT A BUNCH OF  IDIOTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

  

  In a message dated 9/9/2010 4:18:02 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  ssadiver1(at)yahoo.com writes:

  	  Quote: 	
		  -->    RotaxEngines-List message posted by: "Roger Lee"    <ssadiver1(at)yahoo.com>



This new 3 year registration is for all    aircraft, not just LSA. It starts this November and is spread out over the    next three years and then it will continue to re-cycle. It goes by months for    when you registered the first time and the year you did it has nothing to do    with anything. . I have already seen one letter. You should get a letter in    the mail from the FAA when you are do provided you didn't lie to them to start    with about who and where your plane was registered. If you know your aircraft    registration is not correct get it done and the sooner the better. The letter    said do nothing if the info was correct in that letter. If it is wrong you    must send the corrected info back to the FAA. If you fail to do this you will    have your registration canceled. There is a grace period in the letter, do not    let it expire!

There is a cost which has not been fully settled on yet.    Some where between $45 and up from what I hear.



A reminder - 

that    this new FAA Aircraft RE-REGISTRATION THING starts as early as this November    1st (2010). Aircraft with a MARCH REGISTRATION DATE (any year) are the FIRST    to RE-Register your aircraft. Your aircraft registration will expire on March    31st of 2011, but you can start the process of re-registering as early as this    November 1st (2010).

The data base needs a complete update US wide    and this is the way it is being done. Over the next three years all aircraft    will be re-registered. It will help get rid of many problems like what    happened to the King's.



--------

Roger Lee

Tucson, Az.

Light    Sport Repairman - Maintenance Rated

Rotax Repair    Center

520-574-1080





Read this topic online    here:



http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=311956#311956





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imap8ntr(at)cox.net
Guest

Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 1:40 pm Post subject: Re-registration quirk for E-LSA

Thanks Roger.

Now I see.  It is only to update the FAA database and will not require us to 

re-register our aircraft EVERY three year period.  Silly me.

Thanks

Ivan

---

Roger Lee

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1464
Location: Tucson, Az.

Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 3:58 pm Post subject: Re: Re-registration quirk for E-LSA

Hi Ivan,



I might have not phrased it well. We will all be in a three year continuous cycle and it starts this November. Every three years you will need to update the info for your plane. This is sort of like paying for your car's license plates every year, it's just that the plane's will be every three years. As it stands right now and provided it doesn't change and we all know it could, if the info in your letter is all correct then you don't need to do anything. If there is any discrepancy, i.e. wrong address, then you send the letter back in with the correction. Maybe you sold the plane and the paperwork on the other person's end got messed up or the seller didn't report the sale,  or the plane is trash, who knows, but they are trying to do a better job in keeping up a more current and accurate database.  

I really don't blame them for trying not to be so screwed up in their database. They have never done anything like this so it will be a major eye opener.

_________________
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Rotax Instructor & Rotax IRC
Light Sport Repairman
Home 520-574-1080 TRY HOME FIRST
Cell 520-349-7056

imap8ntr(at)cox.net
Guest

Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 4:22 pm Post subject: Re-registration quirk for E-LSA

Hi Roger

Thanks for your explanation.  This has all been new to me.  I am glad I am 

the original owner of my plane. 



Just as a funny aside:  I got a letter a couple of months ago from the FAA 

asking me to check if all the info was correct. (My plane is registered in 

May.)  It was funny because all was correct except that my name was spelled 

incorrectly in the letter.  On all my FAA docs and also in the FAA database 

online my name is spelled correctly.  I hope this dumb goof is not a warning 

of the poor diligence to come.



When I renewed my passport the government could not find it.  After much 

detective work I found out that they put my first name in as BOTH my first 

and last name and thus could not find it in their database.



This inconsitent quality of work by the governement databases really 

concerns me and I hope this doesnt become a fiasco.



Hopefully,

Ivan

---

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