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beauford
Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Posts: 127
Location: Brandon, FL
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 Posted: Thu Aug 11, 2011 10:00 am Post subject: Fat Pilot Fire Fly Fix |
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Kolbers and Kolbettes:
Have dragged the infernal machine home to the house to give it a good cleanup and pull the annual.
Sadly, as Beauford has gradually sagged further into geezerhood in the ten years since building this thing, he has
inexorably fallen into the pit of personal excess… Stogies, Beefeaters and Colonel Sanders have
had their way with him…
The result is that I now weigh about 40 pale, flaccid belly units more than that mythical 170 pound “typical”
skinny pilot bastard I keep reading about. The Fly senses this somehow… and over the last six years I have worked my way from one
elevator tab with a faint hint of downward twist, to two tabs bent severely enough to kick up dirt clods if I lower the
elevator while taxiing… Unsatisfactory.
I purchased a new pair of stabilizer mounting brackets from Travis and am about to lower the leading edge of the
stab.… It occurred to me that other people on the List must have played with this same adjustment on Fireflys and Firestars,
and I solicit some advice on how sensitive these machines are to stab adjustments. I keep thinking about the stab
trim adjustments on various Pipers I have been humiliated by over the years…they had a four or five inch range, but I suspect
the Kleenex Fly would be somewhat more sensitive in pitch.
I was thinking about an inch for openers… I tentatively plan to drill two sets of holes in the bracket… one set at an inch and the
other at about an inch and three-quarters…
Anyone out there have any advice to offer…? besides laying off the stogies, Beefeaters and Original Crispy, that is…
Any wisdom (preferably based on experience) would be appreciated.
Beauford
FF-076
Brandon, FL
[quote][b]
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Thom Riddle
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1597
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA (9G0)
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| Posted: Thu Aug 11, 2011 10:42 am Post subject: Re: Fat Pilot Fire Fly Fix |
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I wish I could help with your question, Beauford, but lack of specific knowledge keeps me quiet in that regard, but not so on the term "pale".
I've nailed a pale back onto a fence, I've said things that some consider beyond the pale, I've drunk my fair share of pale ale, and I've carried milk from the barn to the house in a pail, but have no idea how much a pale weighs in terms that might be useful for guessing your actual attraction to the earth's center. Can you shed some light on this term? Is it kin to a stone?
Thom, also heavy in the middle.
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_________________
Thom Riddle
Buffalo, NY (9G0)
Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long.
- Anonymous |
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phactor9
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 78
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| Posted: Thu Aug 11, 2011 10:48 am Post subject: Fat Pilot Fire Fly Fix |
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This gentleperson went the other way, but interesting information nonetheless. And I love pictures:
http://www.bcchapel.org/pages/0003/FSIIelevatorbracket.html
A new poll would be fun. Well... maybe not "fun"...
Geezerhood: entering now
Height: 6' 7"
Weight: 235
Stogies: Yup
KFC: chicken livers, especially!
Krispee Kreme, TastyKakes and Little Debbies: got me there, too
Phil H.
--- On Thu, 8/11/11, Beauford <beauford173(at)verizon.net> wrote:
| Quote: |
From: Beauford <beauford173(at)verizon.net>
Subject: Fat Pilot Fire Fly Fix
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Thursday, August 11, 2011, 1:56 PM
Kolbers and Kolbettes:
Have dragged the infernal machine home to the house to give it a good cleanup and pull the annual.
Sadly, as Beauford has gradually sagged further into geezerhood in the ten years since building this thing, he has
inexorably fallen into the pit of personal excess… Stogies, Beefeaters and Colonel Sanders have
had their way with him…
The result is that I now weigh about 40 pale, flaccid belly units more than that mythical 170 pound “typical”
skinny pilot bastard I keep reading about. The Fly senses this somehow… and over the last six years I have worked my way from one
elevator tab with a faint hint of downward twist, to two tabs bent severely enough to kick up dirt clods if I lower the
elevator while taxiing… Unsatisfactory.
I purchased a new pair of stabilizer mounting brackets from Travis and am about to lower the leading edge of the
stab.… It occurred to me that other people on the List must have played with this same adjustment on Fireflys and Firestars,
and I solicit some advice on how sensitive these machines are to stab adjustments. I keep thinking about the stab
trim adjustments on various Pipers I have been humiliated by over the years…they had a four or five inch range, but I suspect
the Kleenex Fly would be somewhat more sensitive in pitch.
I was thinking about an inch for openers… I tentatively plan to drill two sets of holes in the bracket… one set at an inch and the
other at about an inch and three-quarters…
Anyone out there have any advice to offer…? besides laying off the stogies, Beefeaters and Original Crispy, that is…
Any wisdom (preferably based on experience) would be appreciated.
Beauford
FF-076
Brandon, FL
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[quote][b]
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Richard Pike
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 1671
Location: Blountville, Tennessee
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| Posted: Thu Aug 11, 2011 12:07 pm Post subject: Re: Fat Pilot Fire Fly Fix |
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Why not attach a bit of ballast at the aft end of the tail boom? Perhaps a few fender washers stacked along either side of the tail wheel?
Considering the difference in moment arms, and assuming that the - ahem - flaccid 40 pounds is centered at X distance in front of the CG, it shouldn't take a great deal of lead, depleted uranium, or similar substance at the Y distance aft of the CG to make the Fly fly more evenly. Probably a couple minutes with the weight and balance sheet and a pocket calculator will let you know if this is a good idea or not.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
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rickofudall
Joined: 19 Sep 2009
Posts: 1392
Location: Udall, KS, USA
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| Posted: Thu Aug 11, 2011 1:14 pm Post subject: Fat Pilot Fire Fly Fix |
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Not a Fire Fly, but a IIIX with multiple hole brackets, I'd suggest 1/2" increments.As something to try before a bracket replacement, use some duct tape to seal the gap between the horizontal stabilizer and the boom tube. You might find that removing the interference drag caused by those slots increases the tail effectiveness enough to fix the problem. Cheap and simple and you can always do the bracket change afterward.
Just a thought.
Rick Girard
If 60 is the beginning of Geezerhood, I'm less than two months away.
On Thu, Aug 11, 2011 at 1:44 PM, Phil <phactor9(at)yahoo.com (phactor9(at)yahoo.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | This gentleperson went the other way, but interesting information nonetheless. And I love pictures:
http://www.bcchapel.org/pages/0003/FSIIelevatorbracket.html
A new poll would be fun. Well... maybe not "fun"...
Geezerhood: entering now
Height: 6' 7"
Weight: 235
Stogies: Yup
KFC: chicken livers, especially!
Krispee Kreme, TastyKakes and Little Debbies: got me there, too
Phil H.
--- On Thu, 8/11/11, Beauford <beauford173(at)verizon.net (beauford173(at)verizon.net)> wrote:
| Quote: |
From: Beauford <beauford173(at)verizon.net (beauford173(at)verizon.net)>
Subject: Kolb-List: Fat Pilot Fire Fly Fix
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com (kolb-list(at)matronics.com)
Date: Thursday, August 11, 2011, 1:56 PM
Kolbers and Kolbettes:
Have dragged the infernal machine home to the house to give it a good cleanup and pull the annual.
Sadly, as Beauford has gradually sagged further into geezerhood in the ten years since building this thing, he has
inexorably fallen into the pit of personal excess Stogies, Beefeaters and Colonel Sanders have
had their way with him
The result is that I now weigh about 40 pale, flaccid belly units more than that mythical 170 pound typical
skinny pilot bastard I keep reading about. The Fly senses this somehow and over the last six years I have worked my way from one
elevator tab with a faint hint of downward twist, to two tabs bent severely enough to kick up dirt clods if I lower the
elevator while taxiing Unsatisfactory.
I purchased a new pair of stabilizer mounting brackets from Travis and am about to lower the leading edge of the
stab. It occurred to me that other people on the List must have played with this same adjustment on Fireflys and Firestars,
and I solicit some advice on how sensitive these machines are to stab adjustments. I keep thinking about the stab
trim adjustments on various Pipers I have been humiliated by over the yearsthey had a four or five inch range, but I suspect
the Kleenex Fly would be somewhat more sensitive in pitch.
I was thinking about an inch for openers I tentatively plan to drill two sets of holes in the bracket one set at an inch and the
other at about an inch and three-quarters
Anyone out there have any advice to offer? besides laying off the stogies, Beefeaters and Original Crispy, that is
Any wisdom (preferably based on experience) would be appreciated.
Beauford
FF-076
Brandon, FL
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get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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Zulu Delta
Mk IIIC
Thanks, Homer GBYM
It isn't necessary to have relatives in Kansas City in order to be unhappy.
- Groucho Marx
[quote][b]
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ulflyer(at)verizon.net
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Aug 11, 2011 3:02 pm Post subject: Fat Pilot Fire Fly Fix |
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Not sure why your having a problem. Our FireFly
flew OK with me 5'7" at close 290#. My partner
5'11" about nearly same weight, maybe a little
less, had no problem. Trying to recall if we had
a trim tab, I think we did, I don't think it was
very big. We also had an approx. 29# VLS chute
mounted between the wings. Sure you have the
gear pointed in the right direction, just a
joke. If I recall our instrument panel was about
12# when I weighed it. Had a full size GA type
Altimeter, small G-gage, Air speed, small elec.
variometer (like used in gliders for vert.
speed), compass, and EIS system. We really
didn't have a problem with it, it handled well on
the ground and handled well in the air. Something doesn't sound right.
Seems to me an inch change of the horizontal stab
incidence would be a dramatic change, I think I
would make the bracket for 1/2" and 1". Try the
half first. Do you have gap seals on flaperons
and are they in correct position when under in flight pressure.
jerryb
At 12:56 PM 8/11/2011, you wrote:
| Quote: | Kolbers and Kolbettes:
Have dragged the infernal machine home to the
house to give it a good cleanup and pull the annual.
Sadly, as Beauford has gradually sagged further
into geezerhood in the ten years since building this thing, he has
inexorably fallen into the pit of personal
excess Stogies, Beefeaters and Colonel Sanders have
had their way with him
The result is that I now weigh about 40 pale,
flaccid belly units more than that mythical 170 pound typical
skinny pilot bastard I keep reading about. The
Fly senses this somehow and over the last six
years I have worked my way from one
elevator tab with a faint hint of downward
twist, to two tabs bent severely enough to kick up dirt clods if I lower the
elevator while taxiing Unsatisfactory.
I purchased a new pair of stabilizer mounting
brackets from Travis and am about to lower the leading edge of the
stab. It occurred to me that other people on
the List must have played with this same adjustment on Fireflys and Firestars,
and I solicit some advice on how sensitive these
machines are to stab adjustments. I keep thinking about the stab
trim adjustments on various Pipers I have been
humiliated by over the yearsthey had a four or five inch range, but I suspect
the Kleenex Fly would be somewhat more sensitive in pitch.
I was thinking about an inch for openers I
tentatively plan to drill two sets of holes in
the bracket one set at an inch and the
other at about an inch and three-quarters
Anyone out there have any advice to
offer? besides laying off the stogies,
Beefeaters and Original Crispy, that is
Any wisdom (preferably based on experience) would be appreciated.
Beauford
FF-076
Brandon, FL
|
| | - The Matronics Kolb-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List |
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beauford
Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Posts: 127
Location: Brandon, FL
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| Posted: Fri Aug 12, 2011 5:26 pm Post subject: Fat Pilot Fire Fly Fix |
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Kolbers:
Thanks to those who offered input to the Fat Fly driver problem… Your ideas are sincerely appreciated…
I had worked through some of your suggestions in the last couple of years… ailerons are gap sealed and reflexed, VG’s are
on underside of stabs and various amounts of weight have been tried on the tail… I hate to make the little sucker any heavier,
since it is already fat enough with Florida paint, BRS5, big wheels, etc.… already glides like a bucket of roofing cement…
I had a short conversation with Travis and Brian at the Kolb Works this morning… they recommended working half-inch increments, which
seems to track with the opinions of you folks, so that is what I’ll try. I suspect Brother Girard’s suggestion about gap-sealing the
elevators is a good idea as well…will do that too.
I have the old brackets off and have prepared the new ones. Tomorrow the paint.
The Formidible Mrs. Beauford’s rather indelicate suggestions for addressing the heavy Fly driver problem continue to be delivered at regular intervals as
she passes by my work site out on the driveway griddle… One would think 46 years of matrimonial bliss would count for something… but on second thought…
Thanks again, Gents…
Beauford
FF-076
Steamy Brandon, FL
Do Not Archive
If you forward this e-mail, please remove my name before sending it... I promise to do the same for you...
Thanks...
From: owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Beauford
Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2011 1:56 PM
To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Fat Pilot Fire Fly Fix
Kolbers and Kolbettes:
Anyone out there have any advice to offer…? besides laying off the stogies, Beefeaters and Original Crispy, that is…
Any wisdom (preferably based on experience) would be appreciated.
Beauford
[quote][b]
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Kip
Joined: 13 Jul 2009
Posts: 51
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