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kitfoxjunky(at)decisionla
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 Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 8:52 am Post subject: Engine out..deadstick landing required..question on header |
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Thanks Guy
Not sure what you mean by the heavy duty pulse line. Again...not my airplane. From what I could see all the fuel lines are clear plastic...except the lines that go under the seat.
The airplane has flown for several hours since the engine failure. All of it over the home strip. Maybe it actually was bad gas.
I will pass along your feedback.
Gary Walsh
KF IV Anphib 912S
C-GOOT
[url=sans-serif]www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox[/url]
do not archive
Guy Buchanan <gebuchanan(at)cox.net>
Sent by: owner-kitfox-list-server(at)matronics.com
06/25/2012 12:41 PM
Please respond to kitfox-list
To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com
cc:
Subject: Re: Engine out..deadstick landing required..question on header tank location
Really doesn't matter whether 582 or 912. They broth run mechanical fuel pumps, albeit powered differently. The header tank height only becomes relevant when fuel level drops below the level of the engine, i.e. the wing tanks are empty. Then head pressure will reduce, even to negative, as the fuel level drops below the level of the engine. The 582 pump handles this fine, (tested on several occasions, both on the ground and in the air, yikes!) I even did the test where you empty the wing tanks, jack the mains up 12", and run full power for 20 minutes. Worked fine with my system.
There are, of course, a zillion possibilities, almost all rehashed in the archives, from bad fuel system design to the notoriously cloggy "glass" filters frequently found between wing and header tanks. (Personal experience with these.) Got to start at one end and go to the other, starting at clogged cap vents, working through clogged finger strainers due to flaking Kreem, on to swelling lines due to auto fuel, noting any line loops that might vapor lock, checking filters for flow, checking the header tank vent line for vapor locked line loops and closure, any broken valves, and finally the fuel pump itself. Is it weak? Do you have the heavy duty wall thickness pulse line? Is the pulse line too long?
Time to spend some quality time with his aircraft.
Guy Buchanan
Ramona, CA
Kitfox IV-1200 / 912-S / Warp 3cs / 500 hrs. and grounded
Now a glider pilot, too.
On 6/25/2012 6:27 AM, kitfoxjunky(at)decisionlabs.com wrote:
I was looking at the fuel system, and I noted that the header tank is mounted on the tube structure near the back of the seat. It is a plastic tank, and looks to me like the bottom is almost at the floor level. In my KFIV I do not run a 582..I have a 912s, but the header tank is mounted high up behind the baggage area.
Is a header tank not supposed to provide a head of fuel to the engine? How could it do that if it was mounted below the level of the carbs?
Wanted to ask those out there more in the know on the two stroke setups.
-
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-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
[quote][b]
| | - The Matronics Kitfox-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List |
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7suds(at)Chartermi.net
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| Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:04 pm Post subject: Engine out..deadstick landing required..question on header |
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Gary,
I saw it mentioned on one of the earlier posts asking if it could have been an engine cold seizure? I experienced a cold seizure on my Model 4 on the maiden voyage, was in the pattern and the engine quit, I did the standard response of flying the plane until I had the field made then tried to restart and it did. Engine ran great but I pulled it anyway and found scoring in the cylinders from the seizure. I ended up putting in new pistons, rings and honing the cylinders. It might be worth looking at if you are unsure, you can do an initial inspection through the exhaust ports.
Lloyd Cudnohufsky
From: owner-kitfox-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of kitfoxjunky(at)decisionlabs.com
Sent: Monday, June 25, 2012 11:52 AM
To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Engine out..deadstick landing required..question on header tank location
Thanks Guy
Not sure what you mean by the heavy duty pulse line. Again...not my airplane. From what I could see all the fuel lines are clear plastic...except the lines that go under the seat.
The airplane has flown for several hours since the engine failure. All of it over the home strip. Maybe it actually was bad gas.
I will pass along your feedback.
Gary Walsh
KF IV Anphib 912S
C-GOOT
www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox
do not archive
Guy Buchanan <gebuchanan(at)cox.net (gebuchanan(at)cox.net)>
Sent by: owner-kitfox-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-kitfox-list-server(at)matronics.com)
06/25/2012 12:41 PM
Please respond to kitfox-list
To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com (kitfox-list(at)matronics.com)
cc:
Subject: Re: Engine out..deadstick landing required..question on header tank location
Really doesn't matter whether 582 or 912. They broth run mechanical fuel pumps, albeit powered differently. The header tank height only becomes relevant when fuel level drops below the level of the engine, i.e. the wing tanks are empty. Then head pressure will reduce, even to negative, as the fuel level drops below the level of the engine. The 582 pump handles this fine, (tested on several occasions, both on the ground and in the air, yikes!) I even did the test where you empty the wing tanks, jack the mains up 12", and run full power for 20 minutes. Worked fine with my system.
There are, of course, a zillion possibilities, almost all rehashed in the archives, from bad fuel system design to the notoriously cloggy "glass" filters frequently found between wing and header tanks. (Personal experience with these.) Got to start at one end and go to the other, starting at clogged cap vents, working through clogged finger strainers due to flaking Kreem, on to swelling lines due to auto fuel, noting any line loops that might vapor lock, checking filters for flow, checking the header tank vent line for vapor locked line loops and closure, any broken valves, and finally the fuel pump itself. Is it weak? Do you have the heavy duty wall thickness pulse line? Is the pulse line too long?
Time to spend some quality time with his aircraft.
Guy Buchanan
Ramona, CA
Kitfox IV-1200 / 912-S / Warp 3cs / 500 hrs. and grounded
Now a glider pilot, too.
On 6/25/2012 6:27 AM, kitfoxjunky(at)decisionlabs.com (kitfoxjunky(at)decisionlabs.com) wrote:
I was looking at the fuel system, and I noted that the header tank is mounted on the tube structure near the back of the seat. It is a plastic tank, and looks to me like the bottom is almost at the floor level. In my KFIV I do not run a 582..I have a 912s, but the header tank is mounted high up behind the baggage area.
Is a header tank not supposed to provide a head of fuel to the engine? How could it do that if it was mounted below the level of the carbs?
Wanted to ask those out there more in the know on the two stroke setups.
-
-
-Matt Dralle, List Admin.
| Quote: | | http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List |
01234567
[quote][b]
| | - The Matronics Kitfox-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List |
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