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cd001633(at)mindspring.co
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 Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 9:40 am Post subject: Flight Review Video - WhirlWind Aviation 3-Blade Propelle |
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Hi Mark,
Your questions are very legitimate and I think would be best answered by contacting Whirlwind Aviation directly at 440.275.1530. When contacting Whirlwind, ask for the General Manager, Jeremy.
As to the governor for the stock M14P engine, the standard Governor is used.
Sam
Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S™ II Skyrocket™, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone.
-------- Original message --------
Subject: RE: Yak-List: Re: Flight Review Video - WhirlWind Aviation 3-Blade Propeller
From: "Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E" <mark.bitterlich(at)navy.mil>
To: yak-list(at)matronics.com
CC:
Sam,
Understood on how the type of flying impacts the reliability of propellers.
What I am honestly interested in is the written information that relates to the tear down inspection intervals recommended by the manufacturer officially and in writing for either the blades, and/or the hub, both of which I refer to as "the propeller".
You also said: "If you fly hard airshow or competition aerobatics, the 250 hours / 1 year would definitely make sense."
What defines "hard" air show aerobatics? Are we talking gyroscopic maneuvers? Are we talking snap rolls? Just what exactly? Competition Aerobatics spans the realm from Sportsman, to Unlimited with a wide margin in the middle.
Whirlwind obviously must have a set policy where some inspections might be "required" and some might be "recommended".
What I am looking at here is a pretty hefty price tag if you purchase the blades, required hub, and ..... does it also require a different prop governor?
In any case, before I plop down 15-18 K$ on a new prop assy., I'd like to read the fine print. Not trying to put anyone on the spot here, I just think the original question is apt, and I am still not quite sure of the answer.
Best Regards,
Mark
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mark.bitterlich(at)navy.m
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| Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 10:10 am Post subject: Flight Review Video - WhirlWind Aviation 3-Blade Propelle |
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I will be glad to do so Sam, but can you still post the information contained in your propeller data sheet?
Thanks.
Mark
p.s. The number seems to be 440-275-1540 I tried 440.275.1530 and got some strange answering machine.
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mark.bitterlich(at)navy.m
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| Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 11:17 am Post subject: Flight Review Video - WhirlWind Aviation 3-Blade Propelle |
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I made the call, (440-275-1540) and talked to Jeremy.
Some points to consider (at least for me) : THIS IS AN EXPERIMENTAL PROPELLOR
1. As such all inspections listed are "recommended" and not mandatory. Whirlwind will send out a "Service Letter" if an inspection moves into the high priority category. In my mind there are pro's and con's here. Lots and LOTS of good things are involved with certified props such as MT models. But an Experimental Prop is the same as an Experimental Airplane as far as the FAA is concerned, which can be a good thing in certain situations in certain "Regions" of the U.S. Just saying.
2. As of TODAY, the recommended tear down period has been extended to 400 hours/5 years. Either or. Again, this is a RECOMMENDED tear down period, since it is an Experimental Prop, this recommendation does not carry the same weight as it does with a Certified Prop. I.E. You are not required to comply with it, but you're not too bright if you do not.
Price is about the same as the certified MT props.
I did not question or discuss blade repair issues or vibration dampening.
Jeremy pointed out some YouTube videos of a Pitts S12 and other aircraft running this prop. Very impressive.
I do have a general question for the folks flying the Whirlwind props on M-14 engines. How did you folks decide to take the leap and go with this prop as compared to say the MT series? Did you pay full price for these props, or did you receive a discount for acting as a test bed?
Mark
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k7wx
Joined: 24 May 2010
Posts: 117
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| Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 12:22 pm Post subject: Flight Review Video - WhirlWind Aviation 3-Blade Propelle |
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Mark,
I was one of the first users of the WhirlWind 2-blade composite prop for the M-14P back in 2010. Paid full price and have been very happy.
The only down side of being an early (first) adaptor was determining the optimum blade angle. The original setting only gave me 82% power on takeoff. Through a little trial and error ended up at 17.5 degrees and it has been a delight ever since. Can't say enough good things about this one.
Warren
On Jul 17, 2012, at 12:15 PM, Bitterlich, Mark G CIV Det Cherry Point, MALS-14 64E wrote:
[quote]
I made the call, (440-275-1540) and talked to Jeremy.
Some points to consider (at least for me) : THIS IS AN EXPERIMENTAL PROPELLOR
1. As such all inspections listed are "recommended" and not mandatory. Whirlwind will send out a "Service Letter" if an inspection moves into the high priority category. In my mind there are pro's and con's here. Lots and LOTS of good things are involved with certified props such as MT models. But an Experimental Prop is the same as an Experimental Airplane as far as the FAA is concerned, which can be a good thing in certain situations in certain "Regions" of the U.S. Just saying.
2. As of TODAY, the recommended tear down period has been extended to 400 hours/5 years. Either or. Again, this is a RECOMMENDED tear down period, since it is an Experimental Prop, this recommendation does not carry the same weight as it does with a Certified Prop. I.E. You are not required to comply with it, but you're not too bright if you do not.
Price is about the same as the certified MT props.
I did not question or discuss blade repair issues or vibration dampening.
Jeremy pointed out some YouTube videos of a Pitts S12 and other aircraft running this prop. Very impressive.
I do have a general question for the folks flying the Whirlwind props on M-14 engines. How did you folks decide to take the leap and go with this prop as compared to say the MT series? Did you pay full price for these props, or did you receive a discount for acting as a test bed?
Mark
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mark.bitterlich(at)navy.m
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| Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2012 6:13 am Post subject: Flight Review Video - WhirlWind Aviation 3-Blade Propelle |
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Good answer!
Thanks for writing it Warren!
Mark
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cd001633(at)mindspring.co
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| Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2012 3:59 pm Post subject: Flight Review Video - WhirlWind Aviation 3-Blade Propelle |
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Mark,
I tried responding to your message and apparently it didn't go through - I'll try again 
Btw, Sorry for the typo on Whirlwind's phone number - my fat fingers on the not-so-smart phone keypad, you know...
Excellent news regarding Whirlwind service interval extension to 400 hours/5 years!
I went back and looked at the logbook of my first three bladed prop from Whirlwind and logbook says I flew it for a total time of 725 hours - during that time I had it serviced only once. The service process was simply taking it to a local Miami Prop shop who disassembled it and sent the blades to Whirlwind for inspection and re-paint (per my request). Two weeks later, during which the prop shop serviced my hub, they reinstalled and statically balanced the blades and I flew the following day - simple and easy (for me).
My story with the new propeller and the Youtube Video is a little different - I already had a spare McCauley hub that I acquired on-line a couple of years ago so this was only a re-blading with servicing the hub job. I told Jeremy at the time, that I intend to do a video review and will tell it like it is to the folks who may be interested in what I have to say about it. I have been a member of the Yak-List since day one, and a member of "The Yak Club" (for those of us who remember ) which preceded our RPA... and was not going to tell our member anything that I haven’t experienced myself. As I mentioned before, I flew behind the Whirlwind 'first generation' hub and propeller for years with zero issues so my trust in their product and their high level of service is based on actual operational experience and ownership over a long time. As you may know, they have been producing 2 and 3 blades propellers for a long time with very good reputation for the Homebuilt segment of the aviation market. Having said all that, I did not have experience with their new blades for the M-14P and wasn't 100% sure the new blades would be as good or better which is the reason I told Jeremy of my intention in doing the video review.
It was very helpful to have a very talented and close flying friend who is a professional business video producer (VTM Productions) who did all the aerial and ground video as well as the setup work - I'm sure you'd agree that is nothing else, it looks professionally done. I had no idea so much goes into producing a good video clip! It was a lot of fun doing it. I may look a little 'stiff' on the video but unfortunately, I have no Hollywood experience.. LOL. This prop really does make me grin when I fly acro or formation which is why I sound a 'bit' excited about it in the video... If you haven't seen the video yet, simply go to youtube.com and search for "Whirlwind Aviation Propeller" or use this link to go there directly: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2sFFD_XNpa4 .
As far as I'm concerned, the Whirlwind propeller for the M-14P is the best available and best value today - best value in price, service, reliability and performance - again, this is only my opinion.
Besides, with all due respect for our international members, This propeller is made in America - and I much prefer supporting an American company and help keeping the jobs here at home - I am sure you feel the same way. So as long as Whirlwind continues to manufacture a superb product, they will get my business
Sam
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mark.bitterlich(at)navy.m
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| Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 7:45 am Post subject: Flight Review Video - WhirlWind Aviation 3-Blade Propelle |
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Thanks for writing this Sam.
Mark
p.s. You make some very strong points, and .... I think you did a pretty darn good job in your video.
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