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stiff brakes

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wnorth(at)sdccd.edu
Guest

Posted: Mon May 29, 2006 10:41 am Post subject: stiff brakes

Most likely is the pedal rocker pivots are too stiff and the small

compensating valve spring in the master cyl can't open, thereby pushing the

pedal back that last bit. (These are NOT the pedal swing pivots which allow

for rudder movement) After a bit they either bleed down, or the system cools

and reduces fluid pressure.



Check by getting the brakes to the stiff condition then pull back on the

tops of the pedals to force them fully back and see if that loosens the

brakes. (This also assumes the pedal rocker action has enough swing

clearence to let the master cyls fully extend.)



If this is the case the best fix is to loosen those pivots some as another

spring is something that could break/jam/whatever at the wrong time.



Air in the line would not cause this as the compensating port allows for air

or fluid to return immediately. Is also not likely to be gunk in the caliper

as that would probably not get better after a few minutes. The same would

also be true for the too tight pins that retain the floating calipers.



The one other option is the matco style parking brake valve could be not

fully opening both poppets thereby acting like one way check valves, if one

is installed. If the above test doesn't make it better remove the pants and

get them stiff, then open the bleeder for a tad and see if they loosen. This

will tell you if the P brake is holding the pressure on. (you could also try

working the P-brake valve when they are stiff and see if that suddenly

loosens them.)



W

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lifeofreiley2003(at)yahoo
Guest

Posted: Tue May 30, 2006 6:42 am Post subject: stiff brakes

Did you read this Charles?

   

  According to Wheeler North we must be smoking crack. We never even fixed the brakes on the airplanes we worked on, as bleeding the brakes or even straightening up a caliper and brake line that was forcing a sideways bind could never have caused the brakes to have an issue! I guess is was a miracle...

   

  Darrell

   

  "do not archive"

   

   

  



Wheeler North <wnorth(at)sdccd.edu> wrote:

  



Most likely is the pedal rocker pivots are too stiff and the small

compensating valve spring in the master cyl can't open, thereby pushing the

pedal back that last bit. (These are NOT the pedal swing pivots which allow

for rudder movement) After a bit they either bleed down, or the system cools

and reduces fluid pressure.



Check by getting the brakes to the stiff condition then pull back on the

tops of the pedals to force them fully back and see if that loosens the

brakes. (This also assumes the pedal rocker action has enough swing

clearence to let the master cyls fully extend.)



If this is the case the best fix is to loosen those pivots some as another

spring is something that could break/jam/whatever at the wrong time.



Air in the line would not cause this as the compensating port allows for air

or fluid to return immediately. Is also not likely to be gunk in the caliper

as that would probably not get better after a few minutes. The same would

also be true for the too tight pins that retain the floating calipers.



The one other option is the matco style parking brake valve could be not

fully opening both poppets thereby acting like one way check valves, if one

is installed. If the above test doesn't make it better remove the pants and

get them stiff, then open the bleeder for a tad and see if they loosen. This

will tell you if the P brake is holding the pressure on. (you could also try

working the P-brake valve when they are stiff and see if that suddenly

loosens them.)



W





		

---------------------------------

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charlieray(at)optonline.n
Guest

Posted: Tue May 30, 2006 3:14 pm Post subject: stiff brakes

The wonders never cease to amaze me.  Airplanes that fix themselves! 

Avionics fixed by UPS!!!



Do not archive.



Charles

---

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lifeofreiley2003(at)yahoo
Guest

Posted: Tue May 30, 2006 4:17 pm Post subject: stiff brakes

Yes, on the UPS fix...has happened a multiple times. In my 14 years of being around aircraft, flying, building, owning a flight school and performing maintenance on my aircraft there's no way I can know anything. But, who really cares...

   

  Darrell 

   

  "DO NOT ARCHIVE"

   

  



Charles Reiche <charlieray(at)optonline.net> wrote:

  



The wonders never cease to amaze me. Airplanes that fix themselves! 

Avionics fixed by UPS!!!



Do not archive.



Charles

---

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dbris200(at)sbcglobal.net
Guest

Posted: Tue May 30, 2006 4:38 pm Post subject: stiff brakes

Darrell,



I saw nothing in Wheeler's post that should cause this kind of nasty 

reply. It was very good information about another possible cause for 

this problem and did not attack anybody or their ideas. We've run enough 

good people off this list with this kind of comment and I for one, would 

like to see it stop. Say something constructive or keep it to yourself.



Dave B



Darrell Reiley wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  



Did you read this Charles?

   

  According to Wheeler North we must be smoking crack. We never even fixed the brakes on the airplanes we worked on, as bleeding the brakes or even straightening up a caliper and brake line that was forcing a sideways bind could never have caused the brakes to have an issue! I guess is was a miracle...

   

  Darrell

   

  "do not archive"

   

   

  



Wheeler North <wnorth(at)sdccd.edu> wrote:

  



Most likely is the pedal rocker pivots are too stiff and the small

compensating valve spring in the master cyl can't open, thereby pushing the

pedal back that last bit. (These are NOT the pedal swing pivots which allow

for rudder movement) After a bit they either bleed down, or the system cools

and reduces fluid pressure.



Check by getting the brakes to the stiff condition then pull back on the

tops of the pedals to force them fully back and see if that loosens the

brakes. (This also assumes the pedal rocker action has enough swing

clearence to let the master cyls fully extend.)



If this is the case the best fix is to loosen those pivots some as another

spring is something that could break/jam/whatever at the wrong time.



Air in the line would not cause this as the compensating port allows for air

or fluid to return immediately. Is also not likely to be gunk in the caliper

as that would probably not get better after a few minutes. The same would

also be true for the too tight pins that retain the floating calipers.



The one other option is the matco style parking brake valve could be not

fully opening both poppets thereby acting like one way check valves, if one

is installed. If the above test doesn't make it better remove the pants and

get them stiff, then open the bleeder for a tad and see if they loosen. This

will tell you if the P brake is holding the pressure on. (you could also try

working the P-brake valve when they are stiff and see if that suddenly

loosens them.)



W





		

---------------------------------

Be a chatter box. Enjoy free PC-to-PC calls  with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.

- The Matronics RV-List Email Forum -

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List

lifeofreiley2003(at)yahoo
Guest

Posted: Tue May 30, 2006 7:12 pm Post subject: stiff brakes

Maybe you need to read his reply again...!

   

  <snip>

   

  Air in the line would not cause this as the compensating port allows 

for air

or fluid to return immediately. Is also not likely to be gunk in the 

caliper

as that would probably not get better after a few minutes. The same 

would

also be true for the too tight pins that retain the floating calipers.



  <snip>

   

  This reply is not accurate as it solved our probelm! This is a problem I've dealt with more than once even with hand lever handicap modified levers in RV's...

   

  I'm done...

   

  warmest regards,

   

   

  Darrell

   

  "do not archive"

   

  



"D.Bristol" <dbris200(at)sbcglobal.net> wrote:

  



Darrell,



I saw nothing in Wheeler's post that should cause this kind of nasty 

reply. It was very good information about another possible cause for 

this problem and did not attack anybody or their ideas. We've run enough 

good people off this list with this kind of comment and I for one, would 

like to see it stop. Say something constructive or keep it to yourself.



Dave B



Darrell Reiley wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  


	


 	  Quote: 	
		  

Did you read this Charles?

 

 According to Wheeler North we must be smoking crack. We never even fixed the brakes on the airplanes we worked on, as bleeding the brakes or even straightening up a caliper and brake line that was forcing a sideways bind could never have caused the brakes to have an issue! I guess is was a miracle...

 

 Darrell

 

 "do not archive"

 

 

 



Wheeler North wrote:

 



Most likely is the pedal rocker pivots are too stiff and the small

compensating valve spring in the master cyl can't open, thereby pushing the

pedal back that last bit. (These are NOT the pedal swing pivots which allow

for rudder movement) After a bit they either bleed down, or the system cools

and reduces fluid pressure.



Check by getting the brakes to the stiff condition then pull back on the

tops of the pedals to force them fully back and see if that loosens the

brakes. (This also assumes the pedal rocker action has enough swing

clearence to let the master cyls fully extend.)



If this is the case the best fix is to loosen those pivots some as another

spring is something that could break/jam/whatever at the wrong time.



Air in the line would not cause this as the compensating port allows for air

or fluid to return immediately. Is also not likely to be gunk in the caliper

as that would probably not get better after a few minutes. The same would

also be true for the too tight pins that retain the floating calipers.



The one other option is the matco style parking brake valve could be not

fully opening both poppets thereby acting like one way check valves, if one

is installed. If the above test doesn't make it better remove the pants and

get them stiff, then open the bleeder for a tad and see if they loosen. This

will tell you if the P brake is holding the pressure on. (you could also try

working the P-brake valve when they are stiff and see if that suddenly

loosens them.)



W





 

---------------------------------

Be a chatter box. Enjoy free PC-to-PC calls with Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.

 

 

 





 




	




      "Do Not Archive"

   

  Darrell Reiley 



RV7A "Reiley Rocket"

  N622DR  Reserved

   

  





		

---------------------------------

Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. PC-to-Phone calls for ridiculously low rates.

- The Matronics RV-List Email Forum -

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List

jabowenjr(at)hotmail.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Jun 03, 2006 8:11 am Post subject: stiff brakes

Does not play well with others?



Jim Bowen

 	  Quote: 	
		  From: Darrell Reiley <lifeofreiley2003(at)yahoo.com>

Reply-To: rv-list(at)matronics.com

To: rv-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: Re: stiff brakes

Date: Tue, 30 May 2006 20:09:40 -0700 (PDT)






Maybe you need to read his reply again...!



   <snip>



   Air in the line would not cause this as the compensating port allows

for air

or fluid to return immediately. Is also not likely to be gunk in the

caliper

as that would probably not get better after a few minutes. The same

would

also be true for the too tight pins that retain the floating calipers.



   <snip>



   This reply is not accurate as it solved our probelm! This is a problem 

I've dealt with more than once even with hand lever handicap modified 

levers in RV's...



   I'm done...



   warmest regards,

   Darrell



   "do not archive"



"D.Bristol" <dbris200(at)sbcglobal.net> wrote:

   



Darrell,



I saw nothing in Wheeler's post that should cause this kind of nasty

reply. It was very good information about another possible cause for

this problem and did not attack anybody or their ideas. We've run enough

good people off this list with this kind of comment and I for one, would

like to see it stop. Say something constructive or keep it to yourself.



Dave B



Darrell Reiley wrote:



 >



 >

 >Did you read this Charles?

 >

 > According to Wheeler North we must be smoking crack. We never even fixed 

the brakes on the airplanes we worked on, as bleeding the brakes or even 

straightening up a caliper and brake line that was forcing a sideways bind 

could never have caused the brakes to have an issue! I guess is was a 

miracle...

 >

 > Darrell

 >

 > "do not archive"

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >Wheeler North wrote:

 > 

 >

 >Most likely is the pedal rocker pivots are too stiff and the small

 >compensating valve spring in the master cyl can't open, thereby pushing 

the

 >pedal back that last bit. (These are NOT the pedal swing pivots which 

allow

 >for rudder movement) After a bit they either bleed down, or the system 

cools

 >and reduces fluid pressure.

 >

 >Check by getting the brakes to the stiff condition then pull back on the

 >tops of the pedals to force them fully back and see if that loosens the

 >brakes. (This also assumes the pedal rocker action has enough swing

 >clearence to let the master cyls fully extend.)

 >

 >If this is the case the best fix is to loosen those pivots some as 

another

 >spring is something that could break/jam/whatever at the wrong time.

 >

 >Air in the line would not cause this as the compensating port allows for 

air

 >or fluid to return immediately. Is also not likely to be gunk in the 

caliper

 >as that would probably not get better after a few minutes. The same would

 >also be true for the too tight pins that retain the floating calipers.

 >

 >The one other option is the matco style parking brake valve could be not

 >fully opening both poppets thereby acting like one way check valves, if 

one

 >is installed. If the above test doesn't make it better remove the pants 

and

 >get them stiff, then open the bleeder for a tad and see if they loosen. 

This

 >will tell you if the P brake is holding the pressure on. (you could also 

try

 >working the P-brake valve when they are stiff and see if that suddenly

 >loosens them.)

 >

 >W

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >---------------------------------

 >Be a chatter box. Enjoy free PC-to-PC calls with Yahoo! Messenger with 

Voice.

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >





       "Do Not Archive"



   Darrell Reiley



RV7A "Reiley Rocket"

   N622DR  Reserved



---------------------------------

Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. PC-to-Phone calls for ridiculously low rates.

- The Matronics RV-List Email Forum -

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV-List

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