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Kellym
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1705
Location: Sun Lakes AZ
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 Posted: Mon May 27, 2013 4:00 pm Post subject: how can I find out the gear reduction for the governor driv |
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The only thing that determines what gear reduction you need is whether
you have a narrow deck version or a wide deck. Which one you have
depends on the core used to build the engine, not who assembled it.
You can easily tell by the cylinder hold down bolts. Narrow deck have
hollow allen key bolts. Wide deck has conventional hex nuts on studs.
The governor Van's sells has reduction for narrow deck. (despite the
fact that all new engines Vans sells are wide deck). While adjustments
can be made to make the Vans governor work on a wide deck, it still
won't be correct. Jim Ayers has often posted here the correct
information. A wide deck engine is supposed to get a P-860-5 MT governor.
More detail on the differences at
http://www.generalaviationnews.com/2009/10/ask-paul-wide-deck-vs-narrow-deck-engines/
On 5/27/2013 3:51 PM, Mike Whisky wrote:
| Quote: |
I own an TMXIO-540 and wonder what the governor reduction drive is, I don`t have my engine documentation currently with me. Does anyone know who has an TMX-io540 Red/Gold? I just want to be sure that the P-860-3 MT governor is really the correct one.
Thanks
Mike
--------
RV-10 builder (final assembly)
#511
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=401444#401444
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Kelly McMullen
A&P/IA, EAA Tech Counselor # 5286
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jesse(at)saintaviation.co
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| Posted: Tue May 28, 2013 5:06 am Post subject: how can I find out the gear reduction for the governor driv |
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All TMX engines should be wide deck.
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
jesse(at)saintaviation.com
C: 352-427-0285
F: 815-377-3694
On May 27, 2013, at 7:59 PM, Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
The only thing that determines what gear reduction you need is whether you have a narrow deck version or a wide deck. Which one you have depends on the core used to build the engine, not who assembled it.
You can easily tell by the cylinder hold down bolts. Narrow deck have hollow allen key bolts. Wide deck has conventional hex nuts on studs.
The governor Van's sells has reduction for narrow deck. (despite the fact that all new engines Vans sells are wide deck). While adjustments can be made to make the Vans governor work on a wide deck, it still won't be correct. Jim Ayers has often posted here the correct information. A wide deck engine is supposed to get a P-860-5 MT governor.
More detail on the differences at http://www.generalaviationnews.com/2009/10/ask-paul-wide-deck-vs-narrow-deck-engines/
On 5/27/2013 3:51 PM, Mike Whisky wrote:
>
>
> I own an TMXIO-540 and wonder what the governor reduction drive is, I don`t have my engine documentation currently with me. Does anyone know who has an TMX-io540 Red/Gold? I just want to be sure that the P-860-3 MT governor is really the correct one.
> Thanks
> Mike
>
> --------
> RV-10 builder (final assembly)
> #511
>
>
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> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=401444#401444
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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flying-nut(at)cfl.rr.com
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flying-nut(at)cfl.rr.com
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| Posted: Tue May 28, 2013 8:22 am Post subject: how can I find out the gear reduction for the governor driv |
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I'm not Kelly .... nor do I play him on TV .... but there's a big misconception about WD/ND engines. There's a good treatise here:
http://tinyurl.com/qjk83xk
Linn
On 5/28/2013 11:47 AM, John Cox wrote:
[quote] Kelly, if I read your post correctly, all of the new Lycoming engines sold by VANS of the IO-540 variant are now only Wide Deck and not Narrow Deck. Aren't each of the wide deck jugs heavier and too wide to fit the stock RV-10 fiberglass cowl design? Or is that just for the Angle Valve Heads versus Parallel Valve?
John C.
On Tue, May 28, 2013 at 7:19 AM, Kelly McMullen <apilot2(at)gmail.com (apilot2(at)gmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | Assuming that they are built from new parts kits or WD cores. It didn't occur to me that anyone would still have an engine built from new parts kit, since Lyc priced those out of the market about 18 months ago. As has been noted before, if one has a wide deck engine, then the MT P-860-5 governor is the correct unit of that brand. It is unfortunate that Van's still only supplies the narrow deck P-860-3 governor, when they have never sold a new narrow deck engine. (Lyc stopped making narrow deck more than 10 yrs before Van founded his company).
On Tue, May 28, 2013 at 6:06 AM, Jesse Saint <jesse(at)saintaviation.com (jesse(at)saintaviation.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> RV10-List message posted by: Jesse Saint <jesse(at)saintaviation.com (jesse(at)saintaviation.com)>
All TMX engines should be wide deck.
Jesse Saint
Saint Aviation, Inc.
jesse(at)saintaviation.com (jesse(at)saintaviation.com)
C: [url=tel:352-427-0285]352-427-0285[/url]
F: [url=tel:815-377-3694]815-377-3694[/url]
On May 27, 2013, at 7:59 PM, Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com (kellym(at)aviating.com)> wrote:
> --> RV10-List message posted by: Kelly McMullen <kellym(at)aviating.com (kellym(at)aviating.com)>
>
> The only thing that determines what gear reduction you need is whether you have a narrow deck version or a wide deck. Which one you have depends on the core used to build the engine, not who assembled it.
> You can easily tell by the cylinder hold down bolts. Narrow deck have hollow allen key bolts. Wide deck has conventional hex nuts on studs.
> The governor Van's sells has reduction for narrow deck. (despite the fact that all new engines Vans sells are wide deck). While adjustments can be made to make the Vans governor work on a wide deck, it still won't be correct. Jim Ayers has often posted here the correct information. A wide deck engine is supposed to get a P-860-5 MT governor.
> More detail on the differences at http://www.generalaviationnews.com/2009/10/ask-paul-wide-deck-vs-narrow-deck-engines/
> On 5/27/2013 3:51 PM, Mike Whisky wrote:
>> --> RV10-List message posted by: "Mike Whisky" <rv-10(at)wellenzohn.net (rv-10(at)wellenzohn.net)>
>>
>> I own an TMXIO-540 and wonder what the governor reduction drive is, I don`t have my engine documentation currently with me. Does anyone know who has an TMX-io540 Red/Gold? I just want to be sure that the P-860-3 MT governor is really the correct one.
>> Thanks
>> Mike
>>
>> --------
>> RV-10 builder (final assembly)
>> #511
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=401444#401444
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
> -----
> No virus found in this message.
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05/28/13 [b]
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Kellym
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1705
Location: Sun Lakes AZ
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| Posted: Tue May 28, 2013 12:15 pm Post subject: how can I find out the gear reduction for the governor driv |
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It is more fun when the lovely Miss Rhonda shows John the errors in his
thinking.  )
I don't think there is more than about 1/4" difference between wide and
narrow deck engines. Narrow deck allegedly is about 4 lbs lighter, but
the newest ND case is likely to be approaching 40 yrs old.
Kelly
On 5/28/2013 9:05 AM, BPA wrote:
[quote]
John,
That’s just for the angle head cylinders. Both narrow deck and wide
deck engines fit the RV-10 cowl.
Allen
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Kelly McMullen
A&P/IA, EAA Tech Counselor # 5286
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jkreidler
Joined: 13 Feb 2008
Posts: 151
Location: Sheboygan Falls WI
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| Posted: Wed May 29, 2013 7:50 am Post subject: Re: how can I find out the gear reduction for the governor |
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I understand you can make the MT governor sold by Van's work by changing the arm position and making a few adjustments as that is what we did. But can someone tell me what the operational impact is of having the incorrect one installed? Slower reaction, incorrect pitch for a given power, pitch changes too quickly, etc.? Just because it works doesn't mean it is right, just trying to understand what trade off is being made. -Jason
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Jason Kreidler
4 Partner Build - Sheboygan Falls, WI
Tony Kolar, Kyle Hokel, Wayne Elser, Jason Kreidler
N44YH - Flying - #40617 |
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lessdragprod(at)aol.com
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| Posted: Thu May 30, 2013 8:27 am Post subject: how can I find out the gear reduction for the governor driv |
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The -3 and -5 governors are identical, except for the final adjustments.
For the -3 governor on the wide deck IO-540 engine, the high RPM stop screw has to be turned out quite a bit to get to 2700 RPM from the factory setting of about 2550 RPM. (For the narrow deck IO-540 engine, the initial stop setting on the -3 governor would be at about 2700 RPM.)
The -3 governor on a wide deck IO-540 now has a longer travel to get to the low RPM stop. The governor arm should have full travel from the high RPM stop to the low RPM stop.
Perhaps someone already flying can say if they have full travel (stop to stop) available with Van's governor cable.
Full governor arm travel is helpful to have for the mag check so it is possible to get the expected 450 RPM drop when the governor/propeller is cycled
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Mike Whisky
Joined: 05 Jun 2006
Posts: 336
Location: Switzerland
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| Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 2:35 am Post subject: Re: how can I find out the gear reduction for the governor |
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Thanks everyone for your input. I'll report the adjustments I had to do in order to reach the low an high RPMs.
Mike
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RV-10 builder (flying)
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