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Bliss

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goff

Joined: 18 Jan 2007
Posts: 71

Posted: Wed Sep 25, 2013 8:31 am Post subject: Bliss

Pleasure is sometimes so easily achieved. Blue skies, fluffy clouds, the sea, islands, fields and a little homebuilt Europa. Enjoy:



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4CAuoBoM1o



Goff

steven.pitt2(at)ntlworld.
Guest

Posted: Wed Sep 25, 2013 9:05 am Post subject: Bliss

The quality of the film is stunning. I will have to see what Father 

Christmas can bring this year!

Steve

---

carl(at)flyers.freeserve.
Guest

Posted: Wed Sep 25, 2013 10:29 am Post subject: Bliss

Brilliant footage  - I need to get one of those (Go Pros). 



We purchased a VIO pov but no image stabiliser so totally useless in the

Europa.



Do you have an HD version of the clip.



--

robert.hitchcock(at)virgi
Guest

Posted: Wed Sep 25, 2013 9:52 pm Post subject: Bliss

Hi Goff



Super quality. The panorama is great. 



Where is the camera position?

You have solved the image shake issue. How? Is it a feature of the camera?



Regards



Bob



On 25 Sep 2013, at 19:28, "Carl Pattinson" <carl(at)flyers.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:



[quote] 

 

 Brilliant footage  - I need to get one of those (Go Pros). 

 

 We purchased a VIO pov but no image stabiliser so totally useless in the

 Europa.

 

 Do you have an HD version of the clip.

 

 --

goff

Joined: 18 Jan 2007
Posts: 71

Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 4:10 am Post subject: Re: Bliss

Carl,



Yes I do have the HD original. It's even better than the YouTube posting, which degrades the original a bit.



Bob,



I'm not sure what you mean by image shake. Do you mean vibration from the prop and the fuselage? The GroPro is mounted to the cabin roof, just aft of the seats. I don't think it has built in image stabilising software, so it must be my smooth flying!!



If you mean the absence of prop strobing, that's down to a little neutral density filter popped inside the GoPro case in front of the lens. I cut a piece the size and shape of a one euro coin from a sheet of theatrical lighting filter acetate. Works wonders.



Goff

davidjoyce(at)doctors.org
Guest

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2013 1:21 am Post subject: Bliss

Carl, Does your prop need balancing? Regards, David Joyce, 

G-XSDJ

On Sun, 29 Sep 2013 09:30:52 +0100

  "Carl Pattinson" <carl(at)flyers.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:

[quote] 

<carl(at)flyers.freeserve.co.uk>

 

 Hi Goff,

 

 Apologies for the delay in responding - your email was 

lost in the pile of

 Europa related stuff that was in my mailbox.

 

 I have been trying (off and on) to get good in cockpit 

quality for the last

 5 years.

 

 It seems that as soon as you mount a camera to the 

aircraft structure this

 picks up the vibrations on the airframe.  I have used a 

Sanyo video cam, a

 VIO POV camera and latterly my Canon EOS 650.

 

 Both the Sanyo and the Canon have Image stabilisers and 

are very effective

 in reducing the camera shake - the problem is they both 

have relatively

 narrow lens angles (so you can't get the whole cockpit 

in frame). I did buy

 a wide angle adapter for the Sanyo but it isn't that 

wide angle and degrades

 the image quality. In all other respects it makes a 

decent job of in cockpit

 video.

 

 The VIO (http://vio-pov.com/) has a similar really wide 

angle to the GoPro

 and the quality is superb but as soon as you attach the 

lens to anywhere in

 the cockpit you get bad camera shake. If mounted on my 

headset (side of ear

 cup) the shake goes away but as a pilots head scans the 

horizon frequently

 its very difficult footage to watch - also the camera is 

too far forward and

 you lose the cockpit panorama. The strange image you get 

with the rotating

 prop is a bit annoying but nothing I cant live with. I 

think VIO have since

 brought out a software fix for this anyway. If not I 

will definitely look at

 mounting a piece of ND filter in front of the lens.

 

 I have looked at various ways of isolating the 

vibrations but as yet nothing

 worked. It seems that the built in stabiliser systems 

are the only way

 forward. I believe the latest GoPro cameras have this 

built in (it may just

 be in the processing software).

 

 Unfortunately I am (or rather was) a professional 

photographer and tend to

 be a little more picky than most - so my fault. Now that 

I am retired I

 should have more time to look at the problem - im sure 

there is a simple way

 of tackling the problem.

 

 Again, congratulations on the video footage at Bembridge 

- I realised that

 your original footage would have been better quality but 

was just curious to

 see how much better the original was.

 

 Thanks for getting back to me.

 

 Kind regards,

 Carl

 

 --

grahamsingleton(at)btinte
Guest

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2013 1:31 am Post subject: Bliss

Good question David!

Graham

        From: David Joyce <davidjoyce(at)doctors.org.uk>

 To: europa-list(at)matronics.com 

 Sent: Sunday, 29 September 2013, 10:20

 Subject: Re: Re: Bliss

--> Europa-List message posted by: "David Joyce" <davidjoyce(at)doctors.org.uk (davidjoyce(at)doctors.org.uk)>

Carl, Does your prop need balancing? Regards, David Joyce, G-XSDJ

On Sun, 29 Sep 2013 09:30:52 +0100

 "Carl Pattinson" <carl(at)flyers.freeserve.co.uk (carl(at)flyers.freeserve.co.uk)> wrote:

[quote] --> Europa-List message posted by: "Carl Pattinson" <carl(at)flyers.freeserve.co.uk (carl(at)flyers.freeserve.co.uk)>

 Hi Goff,

 Apologies for the delay in responding - your email was lost in the pile of

 Europa related stuff that was in my mailbox.

 I have been trying (off and on) to get good in cockpit quality for the last

 5 years.

 It seems that as soon as you mount a camera to the aircraft structure this

 picks up the vibrations on the  airframe.  I have used a Sanyo video cam, a

 VIO POV camera and latterly my Canon EOS 650.

 Both the Sanyo and the Canon have Image stabilisers and are very effective

 in reducing the camera shake - the problem is they both have relatively

 narrow lens angles (so you can't get the whole cockpit in frame). I did buy

 a wide angle adapter for the Sanyo but it isn't that wide angle and degrades

 the image quality. In all other respects it makes a decent job of in cockpit

 video.

 The VIO (http://vio-pov.com/) has a similar really wide angle to the GoPro

 and the quality is superb but as soon as you attach the lens to anywhere in

 the cockpit you get bad camera shake. If mounted on my headset (side of ear

 cup) the shake goes away but as a pilots head scans the horizon frequently

 its very difficult  footage to watch - also the camera is too far forward and

 you lose the cockpit panorama. The strange image you get with the rotating

 prop is a bit annoying but nothing I cant live with. I think VIO have since

 brought out a software fix for this anyway. If not I will definitely look at

 mounting a piece of ND filter in front of the lens.

 I have looked at various ways of isolating the vibrations but as yet nothing

 worked. It seems that the built in stabiliser systems are the only way

 forward. I believe the latest GoPro cameras have this built in (it may just

 be in the processing software).

 Unfortunately I am (or rather was) a professional photographer and tend to

 be a little more picky than most - so my fault. Now that I am retired I

 should have more time to look at the problem - im sure there is a simple way

 of tackling the problem.

 Again, congratulations on the video footage at Bembridge - I realised that

 your original footage would have been better quality but was just curious to

 see how much better the original was.

 Thanks for getting back to me.

 Kind regards,

 Carl

 --

carl(at)flyers.freeserve.
Guest

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2013 2:11 am Post subject: Bliss

Ouch !

 

It depends on which prop you are referring to – in the last year my Europa has flown with four (yes four!) different props. Someone (who shall remain nameless) keeps ground looping the plane and has trashed 2 Woodcomp props. Its confusing but we put the original Warp prop on for a while so that’s how I end up with a total of four. Just waiting for the insurance renewal in October – can’t imagine what 2 claims for £3,500 each will do.

 

We have just fitted the most recent replacement Woodcomp SR3000 prop (the third one) which Kevin Dilks picked up at the factory in The Checz Republic last week and it was balanced by them after assembly.

 

Regarding the balance I have one of Mark Burtons dynamic PB3 balancers – whenever we fit a new prop it is checked for balance and we always manage to get the target into the inner ring – bullseye  (which is classed as very good).

 

So sadly it aint the balance – wish it was as simple as that.

 

The fact of the matter is that most modern video cameras have stabilisation included as standard and this deals with most vibration associated issues. As it’s the norm many manufacturers don’t mention it as a selling point. Im pretty sure the GoPro Hero 3 has an image stabiliser built in.

 

For some reason VIO didn’t include it in their camera but I am hoping that a simple anti vibration mount will deal with the worst of the vibration and the rest can be processed out when I edit the original footage.  I have Sonys Vegas Movie studio to edit my clips and this has camera shake software – this helps but doesn’t cure the problem entirely (and degrades the quality).

 

It’s something I would like to sort out in the future but not top of my list of priorities.

 

From: owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-europa-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of GRAHAM SINGLETON

Sent: 29 September 2013 10:31

To: europa-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: Re: Re: Bliss

 

Good question David!

Graham

 

From: David Joyce <davidjoyce(at)doctors.org.uk (davidjoyce(at)doctors.org.uk)>

To: europa-list(at)matronics.com (europa-list(at)matronics.com) 

Sent: Sunday, 29 September 2013, 10:20

Subject: Re: Re: Bliss

--> Europa-List message posted by: "David Joyce" <davidjoyce(at)doctors.org.uk (davidjoyce(at)doctors.org.uk)>



Carl, Does your prop need balancing? Regards, David Joyce, G-XSDJ

On Sun, 29 Sep 2013 09:30:52 +0100

"Carl Pattinson" <carl(at)flyers.freeserve.co.uk (carl(at)flyers.freeserve.co.uk)> wrote:

[quote] --> Europa-List message posted by: "Carl Pattinson" <carl(at)flyers.freeserve.co.uk (carl(at)flyers.freeserve.co.uk)>

 

 Hi Goff,

 

 Apologies for the delay in responding - your email was lost in the pile of

 Europa related stuff that was in my mailbox.

 

 I have been trying (off and on) to get good in cockpit quality for the last

 5 years.

 

 It seems that as soon as you mount a camera to the aircraft structure this

 picks up the vibrations on the airframe.  I have used a Sanyo video cam, a

 VIO POV camera and latterly my Canon EOS 650.

 

 Both the Sanyo and the Canon have Image stabilisers and are very effective

 in reducing the camera shake - the problem is they both have relatively

 narrow lens angles (so you can't get the whole cockpit in frame). I did buy

 a wide angle adapter for the Sanyo but it isn't that wide angle and degrades

 the image quality. In all other respects it makes a decent job of in cockpit

 video.

 

 The VIO (http://vio-pov.com/) has a similar really wide angle to the GoPro

 and the quality is superb but as soon as you attach the lens to anywhere in

 the cockpit you get bad camera shake. If mounted on my headset (side of ear

 cup) the shake goes away but as a pilots head scans the horizon frequently

 its very difficult footage to watch - also the camera is too far forward and

 you lose the cockpit panorama. The strange image you get with the rotating

 prop is a bit annoying but nothing I cant live with. I think VIO have since

 brought out a software fix for this anyway. If not I will definitely look at

 mounting a piece of ND filter in front of the lens.

 

 I have looked at various ways of isolating the vibrations but as yet nothing

 worked. It seems that the built in stabiliser systems are the only way

 forward. I believe the latest GoPro cameras have this built in (it may just

 be in the processing software).

 

 Unfortunately I am (or rather was) a professional photographer and tend to

 be a little more picky than most - so my fault. Now that I am retired I

 should have more time to look at the problem - im sure there is a simple way

 of tackling the problem.

 

 Again, congratulations on the video footage at Bembridge - I realised that

 your original footage would have been better quality but was just curious to

 see how much better the original was.

 

 Thanks for getting back to me.

 

 Kind regards,

 Carl

 

 --

goff

Joined: 18 Jan 2007
Posts: 71

Posted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 1:52 am Post subject: Re: Bliss

Carl,



I'll try and email you the original edit, so you can compare.



Goff

goff

Joined: 18 Jan 2007
Posts: 71

Posted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 9:36 am Post subject: Re: Bliss

Carl,



I mounted the GoPro in my Mooney for the first time today. Got lots of vibration and jerky footage. So I must be lucky where I mount it in the Europa.



Vibration comes from the suspension on the ground, the direct result of engine power and fuselage buffet when slowing up by raising the nose.



How's your anti-vibration device coming along?



Goff

carl(at)flyers.freeserve.
Guest

Posted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 6:12 am Post subject: Bliss

Hello Goff,



Apologies for the delay in responding but I have been away on holiday in

Ibiza with the family and have just returned. I didn’t have access to any of

my files so couldn’t send anything.



Firstly I am sorry to hear about your radiator problems - hopefully you will

be on your way towards sorting these out by now. My Europa is imminently due

some major repairs/ servicing in that the undercarriage bearings and shock

absorbers need replacing (and the engines annual service). An easy enough

job though as with most things Europa its difficult to access. I am also

aware that despite the Loctite fix/ modwe are starting to develop play in

one of the tail plane attachments so at best this will involve crawling down

the back end and dismantling the tail plane tube assembly (I have done this

twice before - not an easy job).



I had hoped to send you some video clips to show the before and after

results but the files are pretty large (even after editing) - about 10mb and

20mb respectively. I know many email systems don’t like such large files and

I haven’t got anything sorted with you tube as yet. Although I have been

messing about for several years trying to get some decent flying footage it

has always been sporadic due mainly to work commitments. Fortunately I am

now retired (as of July) so will hopefully have more time to perfect this

art. I purchased a copy of Sony Vegas Studio but have yet to master even the

basics of editing - perhaps the program is more sophisticated than I really

need - but having paid the money I am loathe to purchase something else (I

know we are only talking about £20 - £50) but if I have something that does

the job then its extra cost (and im a pensioner lol !)



I can see you have got to grips with editing and adding the music soundtrack

- so far that bit is beyond me.



Regarding the anti vibration mount I put one together and tried it out a

couple of weeks ago - the results were very promising but as you can see

from the photos attached the mount itself is unduly cumbersome. This is

mainly due to my mounting a remote pan/ tilt head on the anti vibration pad.

So there is a bit of work to be done there. The pan/tilt head is very handy

to make minor adjustments but probably unnecessary.



I will update you when I have made some more progress.



I did see there was a guy selling a relatively cheap mount on Ebay (he was

in Israel) but the results on his you tube video were impressive.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q57e0-dc2w8  . Unfortunately I have lost the

Ebay link to this and cant find the ad again - he was only selling these for

about £20 which was pretty reasonable.



I am also looking at the option of using my Canon DSLR (which has very high

quality video) and has an inbuilt in stabiliser. I have found an android

application that allows remote control of the camera from my phone (via an

USB cable) so other than mounting the camera in the aircraft should be

relatively simple (the anti vibration mount wouldn’t be needed). This could

then be operated easily in flight.



I note that GoPro have their own Android/ Apple application that allows

remote control of your GOPro camera from a phone/ tablet device. I think its

free from what I recall.



Anyway I will update you once I have made some progress and we can compare

notes.



Kind regards,

Carl



PS: Where are you based (ie: your aircraft)  - White Waltham (im guessing)

???



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carl(at)flyers.freeserve.
Guest

Posted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 6:25 am Post subject: Bliss

Found it at last !



http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ANTI-VIBRATION-300-camera-mount-heli-multicopter-/

111180765933?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item19e2e3daed



I think its on Ebay UK as well.



Regards,

Carl



--

carl(at)flyers.freeserve.
Guest

Posted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 9:16 am Post subject: Bliss

APOLOGIES ALL - This was meant to be a private message - please ignore the

previous postings (unless it's of interest).



--

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