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447 fuel line, again

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Steve Boetto

Joined: 11 Jan 2006
Posts: 364

Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2007 11:57 am Post subject: 447 fuel line, again

Just the other day I realized that the fuel line pump ball combo on my  Flats Skiff is the same one that came with it 8 years ago. And that I had one  hanging on the wall from a prior boat twice that old. Both are still soft and  pliable and work fine.

  

 The 447 is a different set up than most other engines in that your are  running mixed fuel through the lines rather than straight gas. If you used Auto  fuel line the oil tends to breakdown the rubber. The clear UL line is only good  for about a year.

  

 I just got back from the Yamaha boat shop and the counter guy there  confirms what I thought.  The Yamaha Fuel Bulb set  P/N 6Y1-24306-55  is far better than anything on the market. For 32 bucks you get 10 foot of line  and a superior pump bulb. or you can buy the hose by the foot for $3.60. 

  

 I plan to splice in a bypass loop and install as normal. If anyone  knows of a better source for this hose let me know.

  

 Steve

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jindoguy(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2007 12:17 pm Post subject: 447 fuel line, again

Try Bing alcohol resistant fuel line from any of the usual suppliers, it's about $1.20 a foot, or you can get the Tygothane line Lockwood sells for $.70 a foot.



Rick



do not archive



 On 8/16/07, N27SB(at)aol.com (N27SB(at)aol.com) <N27SB(at)aol.com (N27SB(at)aol.com)> wrote:[quote]      Just the other day I realized that the fuel line pump ball combo on my  Flats Skiff is the same one that came with it 8 years ago. And that I had one  hanging on the wall from a prior boat twice that old. Both are still soft and  pliable and work fine.

  

 The 447 is a different set up than most other engines in that your are  running mixed fuel through the lines rather than straight gas. If you used Auto  fuel line the oil tends to breakdown the rubber. The clear UL line is only good  for about a year.

  

 I just got back from the Yamaha boat shop and the counter guy there  confirms what I thought.  The Yamaha Fuel Bulb set  P/N 6Y1-24306-55  is far better than anything on the market. For 32 bucks you get 10 foot of line  and a superior pump bulb. or you can buy the hose by the foot for $3.60. 

  

 I plan to splice in a bypass loop and install as normal. If anyone  knows of a better source for this hose let me know.

  

 Steve

 do not archive



 AOL.com.

  [quote][b]  http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List http://forums.matronics.com 

when you live at the airport.  [quote][b]

Steve Boetto

Joined: 11 Jan 2006
Posts: 364

Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2007 12:31 pm Post subject: 447 fuel line, again

Thanks Rick, but both of those look like they need to be replaced in about  a year.

  

 Steve

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a58r(at)verizon.net
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2007 12:32 pm Post subject: 447 fuel line, again

 "Better hose", try Mark Smith mark(at)trikite.com (mark(at)trikite.com)



 regards,

Bob N.    FireFly 070 Old Kolb

http://www.angelfire.com/rpg/ronoy/

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 [quote][b]

Steve Boetto

Joined: 11 Jan 2006
Posts: 364

Posted: Fri Aug 17, 2007 10:22 am Post subject: 447 fuel line, again

After some research on the internet it looks like the tubing I am using is  probably VITON. No wonder it cost so much. It is a good choice for the  application because of its high resistance to UV and practically all solvents  and fuels. But  it's a bit pricey at around $5/ft from McMaster-Carr. On  the other hand you may not ever have to replace it.

  

 steve

  

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JetPilot

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1246

Posted: Wed Aug 22, 2007 9:09 pm Post subject: Re: 447 fuel line, again

Some of the guys around here use fuel lines made for Boats,  the marine fuel line is UV resistant, much better than the clear ultralight plastic type lines,  much stronger, and well worth it at even 5 times the cost.  



When it comes to my plane, I would never try to save a few dollars for a fuel line that may deteriorate and leak over time.  



Mike

_________________
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!!

Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S

Steve Boetto

Joined: 11 Jan 2006
Posts: 364

Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2007 3:34 am Post subject: 447 fuel line, again

In a message dated 8/23/2007 1:10:19 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  orcabonita(at)hotmail.com writes:

  	  Quote: 	
		  Mike

	


 

 What are they using?

  

 steve

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jindoguy(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2007 4:42 am Post subject: 447 fuel line, again

Mike, Even the best plastic deteriorate over time. On all my machines, whether they fly or not, I inspect the fuel and pulse lines regularly and just replace them when I think they need it. I get my line from the Bing Agency, primarily because it's just up the road, right here in Kansas. Different philosophy, I guess. 

To make replacement easier, I coat the barbed fittings with lithium grease before I slide the line on. Keeps me from having to cut the line off the fitting when the time comes.



Rick



 On 8/23/07, N27SB(at)aol.com (N27SB(at)aol.com) <N27SB(at)aol.com (N27SB(at)aol.com)> wrote:[quote]       In a message dated 8/23/2007 1:10:19 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  orcabonita(at)hotmail.com (orcabonita(at)hotmail.com) writes:

  	  Quote: 	
		  Mike

	


 

 What are they using?

  

 steve

 do not archive



 AOL.com.

  [quote][b]  http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List http://forums.matronics.com 

when you live at the airport.  [quote][b]

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2007 5:03 am Post subject: 447 fuel line, again

Hi Rick:

  

 Personally, I would not put grease on my barbed fuel  fittings.  I do not want them to be easily removed.  If I have to cut  them off, when the time comes, so be it.

  

 Undoubtedly, the "grease'em up" system works for you or  you would not use it.

  

 I use neoprene rubber fuel line on my MKIII and  912ULS.  Have not used plastic in years.  I have heard there is some  problem using premixed fuel/oil with some black neoprene line, but also heard  marine grade fuel line will work with that combo.  I have used marine fuel  line before.  It is much heavier, thicker wall, than regular Gates auto  fuel line.  Capable of making tight bends without collapsing.

  

 UV, heat, and fuel will eventually get any flexible fuel  line, but the black neoprene rubber line will far outlast plastic.

  

 Does anyone know why the UL community decided to use  plastic fuel line instead of black neoprene rubber?

  

 john h

 mkIII

  

 [quote]    To make replacement easier, I coat the    barbed fittings with lithium grease before I slide the line on. Keeps me from    having to cut the line off the fitting when the time comes.



Rick

[b]

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

ez(at)embarqmail.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2007 5:26 am Post subject: 447 fuel line, again

On Aug 23, 2007, at 9:03 AM, John Hauck wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   Does anyone know why the UL community decided to use plastic fuel  

 line instead of black neoprene rubber?


	




Well ya gotta keep the air-vehicles separate from the air-craft some  

how and since air-vehicles are not  

automobiles ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Oh, I just lost my ,,,  

train,,, of thought,

What were we talking about?





positively  do not archive

jindoguy(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2007 6:12 am Post subject: 447 fuel line, again

John, Don't confuse easier with easily. They're still a pain to pull off, much harder than the fittings on Mikuni fuel pumps and the Rotax pulse port fitting, and I never rely on anything less than a good safety wire wrap as a hose clamp. 



Rick



On 8/23/07,  Eugene Zimmerman <ez(at)embarqmail.com (ez(at)embarqmail.com)> wrote: 	  Quote: 	
		    --> Kolb-List message posted by: Eugene Zimmerman <ez(at)embarqmail.com (ez(at)embarqmail.com)>

On Aug 23, 2007, at 9:03 AM, John Hauck wrote: 



 	  Quote: 	
		   Does anyone know why the UL community decided to use plastic fuel 

 line instead of black neoprene rubber?


	




Well ya gotta keep the air-vehicles separate from the air-craft some

how and since air-vehicles are not

automobiles ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Oh, I just lost my ,,,  



	


-- 

Rick Girard

"Ya'll drop on in"

takes on a whole new meaning

when you live at the airport.  [quote][b]

Steve Boetto

Joined: 11 Jan 2006
Posts: 364

Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2007 6:24 am Post subject: 447 fuel line, again

In a message dated 8/23/2007 9:04:32 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com writes:

  	  Quote: 	
		      

   I use neoprene rubber fuel line on my MKIII and    912ULS.  Have not used plastic in years.  I have heard there is some    problem using premixed fuel/oil with some black neoprene line, but also heard    marine grade fuel line will work with that combo.  I have used marine    fuel line before.  It is much heavier, thicker wall, than regular Gates    auto fuel line.  Capable of making tight bends without    collapsing.

    

	


 

 Hi John,  You and I have discussed this before, I even tried using  auto line but as you know it did not work for us lowly mixgas types.  The  fuel line I am talking about appears to be superior to auto line. It is not the  big clunky stuff for under the hull install, it is very flexible and non  collapsing. 

  

 I do not need to test this hose because I have already used it for years  exposed to UV and mixed fuel on skiffs.  The added bonus is that for those  using a pump bulb, The bulb on the Yamaha assy seems to be the same material and  is far superior to any I have seen.

 I think that standard auto hose is great for unmixed fuel but this is the  best thing that I have seen for fuel/oil mix.

  

 steve



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rlaird

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 373
Location: Houston

Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2007 11:58 am Post subject: 447 fuel line, again

I use fuel-injection line that is compatible with all fuels with any

mixes: SAE 30R9 (one popular mfg is Gates).  Most NAPA stores will

have an SAE 30R9 equivalent.  Also, I haven't used it, but check out

Areoquip FC332...



  http://www.hosexpress.com/hose/socketless/FC332.htm



  -- Robert

On 8/23/07, N27SB(at)aol.com <N27SB(at)aol.com> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  

 In a message dated 8/23/2007 9:04:32 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

 jhauck(at)elmore.rr.com writes:

 I use neoprene rubber fuel line on my MKIII and 912ULS.  Have not used

 plastic in years.  I have heard there is some problem using premixed

 fuel/oil with some black neoprene line, but also heard marine grade fuel

 line will work with that combo.  I have used marine fuel line before.  It is

 much heavier, thicker wall, than regular Gates auto fuel line.  Capable of

 making tight bends without collapsing.

 Hi John,  You and I have discussed this before, I even tried using auto line

 but as you know it did not work for us lowly mixgas types.  The fuel line I

 am talking about appears to be superior to auto line. It is not the big

 clunky stuff for under the hull install, it is very flexible and non

 collapsing.



 I do not need to test this hose because I have already used it for years

 exposed to UV and mixed fuel on skiffs.  The added bonus is that for those

 using a pump bulb, The bulb on the Yamaha assy seems to be the same material

 and is far superior to any I have seen.

 I think that standard auto hose is great for unmixed fuel but this is the

 best thing that I have seen for fuel/oil mix.



 steve

 ________________________________

_________________
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Robert Laird
formerly: MkIIIc w/ 912ULS & Gyrobee
current: Autogyro Cavalon w/ 914ULS
Houston, TX area
http://www.Texas-Flyer.com

Steve Boetto

Joined: 11 Jan 2006
Posts: 364

Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:43 pm Post subject: 447 fuel line, again

Thanks Robert, I will check it out

  

  

 steve

  

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d-m-hague(at)comcast.net
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2007 1:39 pm Post subject: 447 fuel line, again

At 09:03 AM 8/23/2007, John Hauck wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		   

 Does anyone know why the UL community decided to use plastic fuel line instead of black neoprene rubber? 	


 I'm guessing it's because the clear line makes it possible to see air bubbles if any are present, which can be pretty important in keeping a 2-stroke healthy.



 Funny... Aircraft Spruce sells the blue Bing urethane fuel line, which one presumes is good if the carburetor manufacturer sells it... it's what I bought for my US.  OTOH, over on the Quicksilver list where I used to hang out for awhile, they hate the blue line, preferring (I think) the yellow Tygon fuel line, which I've used with no problems on my PPG (you still have to replace it every few years).  McMaster sells the yellow Tygon, and they also sell a cheaper generic yellow fuel line, which hardens up much faster than the genuine Tygon.



 When I bought a primer bulb (Suzuki, I think) from a boat dealer a few years ago it came with some very nice looking gray tubing (which I never used as it was too short).



                                 -Dana

 --

 --

 Children seldom misquote you. In fact, they usually repeat word for word what you shouldn't have said.    [quote][b]

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