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MKIIIX weld yourself cage kit?

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tomd

Joined: 09 Apr 2007
Posts: 7
Location: Scotia, NY

Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2007 3:41 am Post subject: MKIIIX weld yourself cage kit?

Has anyone ever contacted  Kolb to request that the MKIIIX cage be made available in a weld it yourself  form? Say with stock length 4130 tubing and necessary plans to complete the job  at a significant savings. I welded up a WagAero Sportsman fuselage and had fun  doing it. I've read a few threads on substandard welds from the factory so I  would like to do just the whole thing myself. I highly doubt they would go for  this but I wondered if there was an history on the topic.  Thanks.

   [quote][b]

Steve Boetto

Joined: 11 Jan 2006
Posts: 364

Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2007 4:11 am Post subject: MKIIIX weld yourself cage kit?

The factory fuselage is assembled and welded while in an elaborate jig, It  may be difficult to do yourself.   

 Steve  B

Firefly 007/Floats

do not  archive





See w target="_blank">Make AOL Your Homepage.

  [quote][b]

tomd

Joined: 09 Apr 2007
Posts: 7
Location: Scotia, NY

Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2007 1:31 pm Post subject: Re: MKIIIX weld yourself cage kit?

As long as I have the dimensions I can build adequate jigs out wood. Thin wall 4130 is not hard to weld.

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2007 1:53 pm Post subject: MKIIIX weld yourself cage kit?

Subject: Re: MKIIIX weld yourself cage kit?

 > As long as I have the dimensions I can build adequate jigs out wood. Thin 

wall 4130 is not hard to weld.

tomd:



Why copy someone else's work?



If you are that good, you should design your own airplane.



I think it is safe to say, most folks on the Kolb List bought their kits, 

either from TNK, Old Kolb, or a private owner.  We, for the most part, do 

our share by supporting TNK.  It is a very small company with less than a 

hand full of employees.  Without TNK, Kolbs would soon become extent.  I 

have been a Kolb owner and builder for more than 23 years.  Maybe I can fly 

Kolbs another 23 years if I support TNK.



Take care,



john h

mkIII - 2,700+ hours

912ULS - 140.5 hours

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

Rick Lewis

Joined: 03 Jul 2007
Posts: 122
Location: Kingston, Tn.

Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2007 4:26 pm Post subject: Re: MKIIIX weld yourself cage kit?

I'm not sure about any previous welder they may have had but I can tell you one thing for sure, there present welder is superb.  The jigging used in the cage is complex and very rigid and I expect all cages are pretty close to identical.  I am pretty good myself at tig and mig welding but it would be hard for me to consistently make the quality welds Dennis does.  



    The only reason I might want to tackle the job would be the challenge not to save money.  The Plane kit is already reasonably priced and I'm sure there really not making a killing.  If anyone really would like to save money on ther MKIII put a VW Engine on it instead of the Rotax.    



                             Rick Lewis

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2007 5:54 pm Post subject: MKIIIX weld yourself cage kit?

---- Rick Lewis <cktman(at)hughes.net> wrote: 

   If anyone really would like to save money on ther MKIII put a VW Engine on it instead of the Rotax.    

 	  Quote: 	
		   

                              Rick Lewis

 
	




Rick L:



Would that be the only reason to put a VW engine on a MKIII?



john h

mkIII

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

Thom Riddle

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1597
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA (9G0)

Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2007 4:05 am Post subject: Re: MKIIIX weld yourself cage kit?

John H,



With all due respect to your position as probably the guy with most Kolb flying hours,   tomd's request for information about the possibility of getting a kit of materials and detailed dimensions for welding his own, does not demonstrate a "lack of support" for TNK. It was a legitimate question that deserves a straighforward answer. 



Also, "why not design your own plane" has nothing to do with welding up a fuselage from good drawings. Being a retired engineer, I could probably design my own plane that would fly but it would probably handle poorly and be a lot heavier than necessary. I could also make excellent drawings for others to to build it from, if they were stupid enough to try. But I'd have trouble getting two pieces of metal to stick together with my extremely limited welding experience. The two skill sets have nothing to do with each other.



I don't mean to start a pissing match. But tomd's request does not deserve the kind of response you gave it.

_________________
Thom Riddle
Buffalo, NY (9G0)

Don't worry about old age... it doesn't last very long.
- Anonymous

tomd

Joined: 09 Apr 2007
Posts: 7
Location: Scotia, NY

Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 5:20 am Post subject: Re: MKIIIX weld yourself cage kit?

Thank you Mr. Riddle for your input. It was certainly not my intent to "ruffle anyones feathers" with respect to TNK. I am building the plane on a very limited budget so if can save an amount of money welding the cage myself I would like to do so. I plan on the Great Plains VW conversion which should save significantly on the engine investment.



do not archive

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 7:35 am Post subject: MKIIIX weld yourself cage kit?

 	  Quote: 	
		   



 Thank you Mr. Riddle for your input. It was certainly not my intent to 

 "ruffle anyones feathers" with respect to TNK.


	


Thom R/tomd:



 This will probably come as a big surprise, but there are no drawings for 

the MKIII fuselage.  The only jigs and tooling to build a MKIII fuselage are 

at TNK.



 It would be a very time consuming, tedious, and expensive project to 

duplicate a MKIII fuselage, even by a professional aircraft fabricator in a 

well equipped facility.  The cost would be prohibitive, much more so than 

the purchase price of a TNK MKIII fuselage.



tomd might consider purchasing a damaged MKIII to rebuild.  A lot of folks 

do that and there are usually a few around that have suffered from that 

dreaded "Kolb quit", and in a few cases, pilot error.



Recommend tomd contact Travis at TNK to get the full story.



I also recommend we do all we can to support TNK.  If it was not for this 

small company, there would be no more Kolb line of aircraft.  I can assure 

you, TNK knows what it is like to live with a very limited budget.



Speaking of support, the Kolb Homecoming is this Friday, Saturday, and 

Sunday.  Can not remember which one this will be.  It is the only flyin I 

know of that supports the attendees, and not the other way around.  You will 

not have to worry about paying $8.00 for a brat and $2.00 for a bottle of 

water.  TNK furnishes chow for every meal throughout the event.



Hope to see you all there, especially tomd and Thom R.  



BTW:  This hawk (hauck) does not have ruffled feathers, nor does TNK.

john h

mkIII   2,709.8 hours

912ULS 141.3 hours

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

slyck(at)frontiernet.net
Guest

Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 11:26 am Post subject: MKIIIX weld yourself cage kit?

Sometime soon after retirement I started doodling on scratchpads,  

roughing out ideas

for a homebuilt.  I wanted a tandem seater and pusher prop so the  

thing looked

a lot like a Kolbra only with the back seat higher than the front.

Then I discovered Kolbs and decided I didn't want to reinvent the wheel.

Doing a little scouting I found a couple MkIII wrecks, unfortunately,  

this being 1996

there were no Kolbras yet so I had to settle for side-by-side.



I still got to change a few things to personalize it and saved some $$ 

$$ too.

If I was 10 years younger I would start a scratch built design just  

for the fun.



Now I have to be satisfied with the MkIII, the 928, the backhoe, the  

62 bug, etc, etc......

--po' me



Maybe I'll built an ultralight canoe.

BB do not archive

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 11:33 am Post subject: MKIIIX weld yourself cage kit?

> Maybe I'll built an ultralight canoe.

 	  Quote: 	
		   BB do not archive

 
	




Bob B:



You want a copy of my plans?  



john h

mkIII



DO NOT ARCHIVE

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

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