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mustangsally(at)semo.net
Guest

Posted: Sat Apr 01, 2006 5:19 am Post subject: New member/ owner

Let me  introduce myself. I just picked up a mid 90's unfinished firestar. 

I may be asking questions in the future.



I currently fly a CWII Challenger and have for about 6 years. I am in SE 

Missouri and fly from my own strip.



How hard or challenging is to go from a nose wheel plane to the Kolb? I 

haven't ever flown a tail wheel.



Jerry Deckard

slyck(at)frontiernet.net
Guest

Posted: Sat Apr 01, 2006 5:43 am Post subject: New member/ owner

Jerry, spend a couple sessions driving it up and down your strip.

That should do it.   Pay attention to how well your tail wheel responds

and adjust it if necessary.  The flying/landing part is no big deal.

Fly it to within a foot or so of the ground.  Forklifts are tougher to 

handle.

-BB  do not archive

On 1, Apr 2006, at 8:16 AM, Jerry Deckard wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 <mustangsally(at)semo.net>



 Let me  introduce myself. I just picked up a mid 90's unfinished 

 firestar.

 I may be asking questions in the future.



 I currently fly a CWII Challenger and have for about 6 years. I am in 

 SE

 Missouri and fly from my own strip.



 How hard or challenging is to go from a nose wheel plane to the Kolb? I

 haven't ever flown a tail wheel.



 Jerry Deckard

dhkey(at)msn.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Apr 01, 2006 6:05 am Post subject: New member/ owner

Make sure you are landing into the wind for a while. Look at the far end of 

the runway when you get close to landing and when you are high speed 

taxiing. Over correcting was my biggest problem at first, if it's going 

crooked then make tiny rudder adjustments, not one big one. If you have your 

own field then cut the runway a little wider. Make sure you're not drifting 

across the runway center line on final or before touch down. After a month 

none of this advise will be important to you any more, it's easy.

 	  Quote: 	
		  From: "Jerry Deckard" <mustangsally(at)semo.net>

Reply-To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com

To: <kolb-list(at)matronics.com>

Subject: New member/ owner

Date: Sat, 1 Apr 2006 07:16:59 -0600






Let me  introduce myself. I just picked up a mid 90's unfinished firestar.

I may be asking questions in the future.



I currently fly a CWII Challenger and have for about 6 years. I am in SE

Missouri and fly from my own strip.



How hard or challenging is to go from a nose wheel plane to the Kolb? I

haven't ever flown a tail wheel.



Jerry Deckard

John Jung

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 108
Location: Surprise, AZ, USA

Posted: Sat Apr 01, 2006 7:46 am Post subject: Re: New member/ owner

 	  mustangsally(at)semo.net wrote: 	
		  How hard or challenging is to go from a nose wheel plane to the Kolb? I 

haven't ever flown a tail wheel.



Jerry Deckard 	




Jerry,



Most people say it is a non-issue. It is at most, a very small issue. I got a few landing in a Mark II before flying a Firestar (my first tail draggger), and it was mostly for peace of mind or confidence. It would not have been necessary. It just helped to relax me.



do not archive

_________________
John Jung
Firestar II N6163J
Surprise, AZ

planecrazzzy
Guest

Posted: Sat Apr 01, 2006 8:24 am Post subject: Re: New member/ owner

I don't know how much "time" you had before you were having problems

like the ones you stated..... ( Your SCARING the guy )



 But it sounds personal....Most of us Never came close to having that

kind of difficultly.... 

  To the "main Question"  - It would help a little to get some tailwheel training......?  You should give a little "forward stick"....Fly the tail ,

 and "rotate" when ready.... ( It seems to work for me )

  Or you could haul it to the Great Salt Lakes and have Plenty of room....

 He he he.... ( but watch out for those Mountains on the edges )



               Gotta Fly...

                              Mike in MN / N381PM

.

.

.



 	  dhkey(at)msn.com wrote: 	
		  Make sure you are landing into the wind for a while. Look at the far end of 

the runway when you get close to landing and when you are high speed 

taxiing. Over correcting was my biggest problem at first, if it's going 

crooked then make tiny rudder adjustments, not one big one. If you have your 

own field then cut the runway a little wider. Make sure you're not drifting 

across the runway center line on final or before touch down. After a month 

none of this advise will be important to you any more, it's easy.

.

.

.



	
[/quote]

Thom Riddle

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1597
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA (9G0)

Posted: Sat Apr 01, 2006 8:33 am Post subject: Re: New member/ owner

Jerry,



One thing that has not been mentioned is this. Try not to use the brakes too hard for stopping. The CG on most Kolbs is very close to the main gear so hard braking can put your nose on the ground. Ususally not much damage but it is embarassing. On a grass strip, unless it is really short, you should not need brakes for stopping, unless you are headed downwind. I would say that most of us have done at least one noseover in a Kolb.



Thom in Buffalo

do not archive

dhkey(at)msn.com
Guest

Posted: Sat Apr 01, 2006 10:13 am Post subject: New member/ owner

Wow Mike(planecrazy) you're a real jackass huh?

Yes, I'm pointing out some issues I had when I started flying my Kolb, sure 

you can say they are my personal problems. Yes it was tricky for me to make 

the adjustment to steering with the tail wheel, reminded me of steering the 

red flyer wagons as a kid. When I made small corrections it really helped. 

Maybe it was my plane, maybe it was me. I guess you have to get used to 

people not being as smart and skilled as you.

Someday you might even aspire to go further in your training than your 

Private License.

 	  Quote: 	
		  From: "planecrazzzy" <planecrazzzy(at)yahoo.com>

Reply-To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com

To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: Re: New member/ owner

Date: Sat,  1 Apr 2006 08:24:57 -0800

I don't know how much "time" you had before you were having problems

like the ones you stated..... ( Your SCARING the guy )

  But it sounds personal....Most of us Never came close to having that

kind of difficultly....

   To the "main Question"  - It would help a little to get some tailwheel 

training......?  You should give a little "forward stick"....Fly the tail ,

  and "rotate" when ready.... ( It seems to work for me )

   Or you could haul it to the Great Salt Lakes and have Plenty of room....

  He he he.... ( but watch out for those Mountains on the edges )

                Gotta Fly...

                               Mike in MN / N381PM

.

.

.

dhkey(at)msn.com wrote:

 > Make sure you are landing into the wind for a while. Look at the far end 

of

 > the runway when you get close to landing and when you are high speed

 > taxiing. Over correcting was my biggest problem at first, if it's going

 > crooked then make tiny rudder adjustments, not one big one. If you have 

your

 > own field then cut the runway a little wider. Make sure you're not 

drifting

 > across the runway center line on final or before touch down. After a 

month

 > none of this advise will be important to you any more, it's easy.

 > .

 > .

 > .

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

 >

--------

The more people I know....

The more I like MY DOG

.

.

.

.

.Do not archive

Read this topic online here:

http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=25765#25765

Richard Pike

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 1670
Location: Blountville, Tennessee

Posted: Sat Apr 01, 2006 10:16 am Post subject: New member/ owner

Along with this, do not start your takeoff by firewalling the throttle 

when sitting still. When you begin your takeoff, give it about half 

throttle for a second or two until it gets up to about 15 mph before 

going to full throttle. Otherwise that high thrust line might overcome 

inertia by having your Kolb looking like a hog rooting for acorns...



Richard Pike

MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)

Thom Riddle wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   



 Jerry,



 One thing that has not been mentioned is this. Try not to use the brakes too hard for stopping. The CG on most Kolbs is very close to the main gear so hard braking can put your nose on the ground. Ususally not much damage but it is embarassing. On a grass strip, unless it is really short, you should not need brakes for stopping, unless you are headed downwind. I would say that most of us have done at least one noseover in a Kolb.



 Thom in Buffalo

 do not archive





 Read this topic online here:



 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=25769#25769

_________________
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0

Forgiving is tough, being forgiven is wonderful, and God's grace really is amazing.

planecrazzzy
Guest

Posted: Sat Apr 01, 2006 10:51 am Post subject: Re: New member/ owner

Woof...



 	  dhkey(at)msn.com wrote: 	
		  Wow Mike(planecrazy) you're a real jackass huh?

	
[/quote]

Russ Kinne

Joined: 27 Jan 2006
Posts: 182

Posted: Sat Apr 01, 2006 11:53 am Post subject: New member/ owner

Woof not HeeHaw??



do not archive



On Apr 1, 2006, at 1:51 PM, planecrazzzy wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 <planecrazzzy(at)yahoo.com>



 Woof...





 dhkey(at)msn.com wrote:

> Wow Mike(planecrazy) you're a real jackass huh?

>



 --------

 The more people I know....

 The more I like MY DOG

 .

 .

 .

 .

 .Do not archive





 Read this topic online here:



 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=25795#25795

mustangsally(at)semo.net
Guest

Posted: Sat Apr 01, 2006 5:31 pm Post subject: New member/ owner

I have seen a couple of nose overs on take off. Doesn't look bad just 

embarrassing.

Jerry

---

Don G

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 156
Location: Central Illinois

Posted: Sat Apr 01, 2006 7:28 pm Post subject: Re: New member/ owner

Welcome Jerry Deckard...hmm  that name sounds familiar...and a challenger huh?....have you ever brought that bird up to central Illinois to any Fly-ins?

_________________
Don G.
Central Illinois
Kitfox IV Speedster
Luscombe 8A
RV9A

neilsenrmf(at)comcast.net
Guest

Posted: Sat Apr 01, 2006 8:40 pm Post subject: New member/ owner

Welcome Jerry



You will not have any problems with the Kolb. Those of us that came from the 

GA world have had problems with landing our Kolbs because of the lack of 

inertia and lots of drag but you are used to it so it shouldn't be a 

problem. Keep your speed and power up till you are a few inches from the 

ground. As you get comfortable slowly progress to less power on approach.



As for tail wheels it's a non issue. I had a problem once landing down wind 

on a paved strip but it was a stupid thing to do. I didn't ground loop but 

it did get exciting. Stay on grass till you're comfortable and it will not 

be a problem.



As for going up on your nose. It can happen but common sense goes a long way 

here. One of our members, that hadn't flown yet, felt the need to build a 

monster hoop for his plane but it isn't necessary. We really tried to advise 

him that it wasn't needed but..... If you ease in the power till your 

elevators start working you will not have a problem. Again just use a bit of 

common sense.



Rick Neilsen

Redrive VW powered MKIIIc

---

jbhart(at)onlyinternet.ne
Guest

Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 6:17 am Post subject: New member/ owner

At 07:29 PM 4/1/06 -0600, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  



I have seen a couple of nose overs on take off. Doesn't look bad just 

embarrassing.

Jerry


	


Jerry,



When you see guys at EAA Chapter 453, please tell them hello.



Jerry a member of EAA Chapter 453 in Painton, MO at the time I was in MO.  

He may have seen me put my FireFly on its nose.  It was my first take off 

from a grass strip.  I thought I pushed the throttle in the same as I had at 

Perryville, but it was too much for grass.  The wheel drag and the high 

thrust line got me.  I remember sitting there wondering what is going on.  

This thing is a shaken and quaken, the tail was up and it was not coming 

loose from the ground.  Then I felt  my self sinking and the tail starting 

to come up further on its own. I moved the stick back against the stop and 

nothing happened.  I did not get the throttle backed off in time and over I 

went on the nose.  It was a repeat of my sailplane days.  I just kept it 

straight until it came to a stop.  I had 54 miles to get home as the sun was 

going down.  So, I put my right leg out and gave a little push.  As the tail 

started to come down, I gave a little push on the throttle to keep it from 

banging.  And then I advanced the throttle slowly, made a nice lift off and 

headed on home.



This lead to VG's, never taking off with the tail up, and always holding the 

stick back against the stop, and teasing the throttle.  I have not had a 

nose over on takeoff since the first one.  But I have nosed it over twice 

while taxiing in tall grass and adverse wind conditions.  Experience is a 

great teacher.



Jack B. Hart FF004

Winchester, IN

Dave Bigelow

Joined: 29 Jan 2006
Posts: 103
Location: Kamuela, Hawaii

Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 9:18 pm Post subject: Re: New member/ owner

Jerry,

The transition to the Firestar will not be a big deal.  Taxi it around to get a feel for the steering.  On takeoff, slowly move the throttle forward to full power, and hold the stick slightly aft of neutral.  You do not need to lift the tail - just let it lift off from the three point attitude.  If your bird is 503 equipped, the take off is more like a launch than a roll.  If you are on grass, be careful advancing the throttle until your ground speed is 10-15 mph.  I haven't noticed that there is much of a nose over tendency with the Firestar unless you are holding the brakes as you run up, or are in pretty high grass.



Landing is pretty much the same as you are used to with the Challenger.  Keep your speed up and some power on until you are within a foot or so from the ground and in the flare.  Keep flying the plane until you are stopped or at a slow taxi speed.



You'll like your Firestar!

_________________
Dave Bigelow
Kamuela, Hawaii
FS2, HKS 700E

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