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Peter H
Joined: 20 Mar 2007
Posts: 197
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 Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 1:53 pm Post subject: REFIT INTAKE PIPES |
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Lynn,
The first pic attached was my first attempt to make a new induction system
using off the shelf SS bends and Tees.
It was a failure because it is too big.
Manifold pressure hovered close to 1 atmosphere and although the engine
would run it was about impossible to tune and was very sluggish.
The second pic shows a system that works OK but I started out to make it for
equal pipes. Working on hands and knees on the hangar floor is too hard. I
got 4 equal and two less than equal but it works fine.
Again using available SS bends I cut and fit each section then taped it with
packaging tape. When each section was complete I removed it and got it TIG
welded.
It would be possible to make all 6 equal but not the way I did it.
I am not sure it would make much difference to EGT spread because the pipes
are not going to be all the same shape, consequently next time I would use
the head section of the existing intake pipes and make up connecting
sections to the plenum. I think the way forward is to make an updraft plenum
with symmetrical outlets much like Pete.
I found a source for the SS bends at cost about AUD9.00 each if you need it
let me know.
Regards
Peter
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Lynn Matteson
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 2778
Location: Grass Lake, Michigan
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| Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 6:24 pm Post subject: REFIT INTAKE PIPES |
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I'm still waiting for your pictures to download...I'm on dial-up, so
it takes some time...but what I had in mind was using the existing
upper half of the pipes, and I'm hoping that the lower halves could
be rotated within their respective rubber couplers, and would just
point downwards and fit into a plenum what I would construct around
it...in a perfect world. Of course, that's probably not going to
happen, and when I find that out, I might just cancel that thought
and build a new set of lower pipes that would connect with the uppers
and with a newly-constructed plenum. If the whole project looks like
it wouldn't work, I would still be happy with the way things are
right now.
According to Andy Silvester, the plenum should be about 1100 cc's in
volume (about half of the engines' displacement) ....how big was
yours? Of course, I'm talking 1100 cc's for my 2200.
Now the pictures are viewable, and I see that you built two separate
"headers" or plenums for the intake, with a connector tube. With the
2200 engine, I think the plenum will fit into the oil pan "notch",
and hopefully not require too much additional intake tubing length to
reach it.
I agree about working on the hangar floor...not the most comfortable
way to design and build something. While we're on the subject, I used
to build exhaust headers for other people's race cars and my own, and
I'd sometimes have to gas-weld areas on the pipes using a mirror and
figuring out how to manipulate the torch and filler rod
backwards...talk about testing your patience!
Oh, by the way, when I asked the other day about whether your NACA-
cut exhaust pipes were aluminum or steel, it's obvious from these
shots that they are stainless. It must have been the reflections, or
light angles on the other shots that had me confused. Or else these
shots show the color of having been run.
Thanks, Peter for your input.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 770.6 hrs
Countdown to 1000 hrs~230 to go
Sensenich 62"x46" Wood prop
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
Rotec TBI-40 injection
Status: flying
On Sep 15, 2009, at 5:49 PM, Peter Harris wrote:
| Quote: | Lynn,
The first pic attached was my first attempt to make a new induction
system
using off the shelf SS bends and Tees.
It was a failure because it is too big.
Manifold pressure hovered close to 1 atmosphere and although the
engine
would run it was about impossible to tune and was very sluggish.
The second pic shows a system that works OK but I started out to
make it for
equal pipes. Working on hands and knees on the hangar floor is too
hard. I
got 4 equal and two less than equal but it works fine.
Again using available SS bends I cut and fit each section then
taped it with
packaging tape. When each section was complete I removed it and got
it TIG
welded.
It would be possible to make all 6 equal but not the way I did it.
I am not sure it would make much difference to EGT spread because
the pipes
are not going to be all the same shape, consequently next time I
would use
the head section of the existing intake pipes and make up connecting
sections to the plenum. I think the way forward is to make an
updraft plenum
with symmetrical outlets much like Pete.
I found a source for the SS bends at cost about AUD9.00 each if you
need it
let me know.
Regards
Peter
|
| | - The Matronics JabiruEngine-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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_________________
Lynn
Kitfox IV-Jabiru 2200
N369LM |
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Peter H
Joined: 20 Mar 2007
Posts: 197
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| Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 9:10 pm Post subject: REFIT INTAKE PIPES |
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Lynn the first pic which shows two separate "headers" was a failure because
it was too big.
The second pic uses headers closer to the original setup and it works fine.
My plenum which relates to pic 2 was only about 1L.
I think the rule of thumb referred by Andy probably means "including the
capacity of the headers"
As I posted before I could not get a low enough vac pressure for
satisfactory running of the dual header setup.
The dual header setup could be made smaller and it lends itself to dual
throttle bodies.
Based on what I have done so far I am going to stay with the single throttle
body and a symmetrical plenum of not more than 2L.
Yes I think you can retain the upper part of each header and adapt the ends
to suit the plenum.
Peter
--
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Lynn Matteson
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 2778
Location: Grass Lake, Michigan
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| Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2009 4:16 am Post subject: REFIT INTAKE PIPES |
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Hi Peter-
With what I've learned from using the Rotec TBI so far, this unit
flows more than enough air to suit the 2200, so a single unit
throttle body on a single plenum is the way I'm going to proceed.
I've been toying with the idea of just bringing my plane home from
the hangar, pulling the engine, and building the intake manifold
right here in my nice, cozy, heated workshop. I could have the plane
back home here, the engine out, and on my workbench in less than a
day, and be able to operate on it in comfort. I think that's the way
to go, what with fall approaching, and chillier weather on its way.
You mentioned the SS bends...I found 1-1/2" SS bends at Aircraft
Spruce, but not the 1-1/4" which I think the intake tubes are. I
haven't done a search for the smaller tubes yet, so I *would* like to
have the address for the tubes that you offered, Peter. I'm also
wondering why aluminum tubes wouldn't be suitable for the lower ends
of the intake tubes. It seems to me like they would work ok.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 770.6 hrs
Countdown to 1000 hrs~230 to go
Sensenich 62"x46" Wood prop
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
Rotec TBI-40 injection
Status: flying
On Sep 16, 2009, at 1:02 AM, Peter Harris wrote:
| Quote: |
<peterjfharris(at)bigpond.com>
Lynn the first pic which shows two separate "headers" was a failure
because
it was too big.
The second pic uses headers closer to the original setup and it
works fine.
My plenum which relates to pic 2 was only about 1L.
I think the rule of thumb referred by Andy probably means
"including the
capacity of the headers"
As I posted before I could not get a low enough vac pressure for
satisfactory running of the dual header setup.
The dual header setup could be made smaller and it lends itself to
dual
throttle bodies.
Based on what I have done so far I am going to stay with the single
throttle
body and a symmetrical plenum of not more than 2L.
Yes I think you can retain the upper part of each header and adapt
the ends
to suit the plenum.
Peter
|
| | - The Matronics JabiruEngine-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?JabiruEngine-List |
|
_________________
Lynn
Kitfox IV-Jabiru 2200
N369LM |
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