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Removing Gills

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ronpenrose

Joined: 16 Jul 2014
Posts: 15
Location: Kansas City Metro (KLXT)

Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2014 5:46 am Post subject: Removing Gills

Hi all. I am a relatively new Yak owner since July. I am in the process of dismantling a few things for painting and having a problem figuring out how to remove the gills framework. I have removed the prop and hub. I am thinking the snout and the cast piece in front of gills needs to come off but cannot figure out how to remove. I did remove the four bolts at the base of the snout but it will not budge and cautious of using too much persuasion.



I have attached pic.



Any hints to going the last mile on this greatly appreciated.

IMG_20141110_074357.jpg

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Ron Penrose
YAK-52 N352BW

Viperdoc

Joined: 19 Apr 2014
Posts: 484
Location: 08A

Posted: Tue Nov 11, 2014 2:46 pm Post subject: Removing Gills

Taking those bolts loose will not let you remove you oil tube ( the snout you refer to). Look at shaft of you oil tube. You will see a nut at the base of the polished tip that pushes oil into and out of the piston in the prop hub. Take the appropriate Mexican Speed wrench (adjustable) to loosen it.  Careful, there is washer at the base. Put a clean rag in you prop shaft to keep FOD out. 

You will have to remove all of those slotted safety wire screws around the ring that supported the defection plate at the base of the hub that you have already removed.

At the 0530 position you will see two ~8 mm bolts that on the back side attaches to a lever that opens and closes you gills. That all has to come off. 

Then if you look around the base of louvers there are ? 11 mm bolts the bolt the ring to the nose case. Slowly loosen them all together so you are going loosen one a little, move to the next one, then the next one until you have all the walked around the ring. That is because over the top of the bolts  is a slot in the perpendicular ring that prevents the bolts from backing completely out if they loosened in flight. 

You also have to take those cooling trumpets off. You will have to take the outer ring braces loose that attach the ring to the nine cylinders. Do not lose those spacers at the base of those L brackets that mounts them to the stud on the cylinders. Impossible to find replacements.

Now that all of that is disconnected you can remove the louvers from the prop hub. Look at your prop hub. You will see two flat sides on an otherwise round flange. You will basically lift up the base ring behind the flange over one of those flat sides in the flange. You then rotate the ring around the flange like you would remove a lid from a gallon of paint if you intended to use the lide again that is. Yes I am talking about warping the base ring to slide it off the prop flange.

Sure you still want to do this?

Have fun.

Doc



Sent from my iPad



 	  Quote: 	
		   On Nov 10, 2014, at 7:46 AM, ronpenrose <rpenrose(at)kc.rr.com> wrote:

 

 

 

 Hi all. I am a relatively new Yak owner since July. I am in the process of dismantling a few things for painting and having a problem figuring out how to remove the gills framework. I have removed the prop and hub. I am thinking the snout and the cast piece in front of gills needs to come off but cannot figure out how to remove. I did remove the four bolts at the base of the snout but it will not budge and cautious of using too much persuasion.

 

 I have attached pic.

 

 Any hints to going the last mile on this greatly appreciated.

 

 --------

 Ron Penrose

 YAK-52 N352BW

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=433318#433318

 

 

 

 

 Attachments: 

 

 http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_20141110_074357_282.jpg

_________________
Viperdoc

ronpenrose

Joined: 16 Jul 2014
Posts: 15
Location: Kansas City Metro (KLXT)

Posted: Tue Nov 11, 2014 3:07 pm Post subject: Re: Removing Gills

Doc,



Thanks. Way more effort than I had hoped. While very tedious, I may elect to paint in place, not ideal but a lot of masking tape, small brush work, etc. may be my choice.  Thanks for taking the time for your detailed response.

Ron

_________________
Ron Penrose
YAK-52 N352BW

Viperdoc

Joined: 19 Apr 2014
Posts: 484
Location: 08A

Posted: Tue Nov 11, 2014 6:37 pm Post subject: Removing Gills

Welcome. Getting ready to re-hang my engine on the 50 and the the louver fun begins in reverse of what I wrote. 

If you are going to paint them you really do need to pull them off the engine. Them you can degrease them and strip them. We pulled the axels out of mine and painted the individual vanes. 

Doc

Sent from my iPad



 	  Quote: 	
		   On Nov 11, 2014, at 5:07 PM, ronpenrose <rpenrose(at)kc.rr.com> wrote:

 

 

 

 Doc,

 

 Thanks. Way more effort than I had hoped. While very tedious, I may elect to paint in place, not ideal but a lot of masking tape, small brush work, etc. may be my choice.  Thanks for taking the time for your detailed response.

 Ron

 

 --------

 Ron Penrose

 YAK-52 N352BW

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=433404#433404

_________________
Viperdoc

mark.bitterlich(at)navy.m
Guest

Posted: Wed Nov 12, 2014 8:05 am Post subject: Removing Gills

Not to mention, putting it all back together and then having it jam closed in flight because of a small error when reassembling the darn thing, thus frying the engine.



On the chance of awakening a sleeping giant, I will say that on my 50, the gills HAVE been removed.  Permanently.  Instead of painted red gill slats, you see a nice big round motor.



That said, I do not fly in sub-freezing temperatures, and I also had to fabricate 4 support rods that mount from the engine to the gill ring to regain the necessary support the gill arrangement normally provides.



Mark





--

ronpenrose

Joined: 16 Jul 2014
Posts: 15
Location: Kansas City Metro (KLXT)

Posted: Wed Nov 12, 2014 12:16 pm Post subject: Re: Removing Gills

Mark, Interesting about removing the gills.  Unfortunately, here in the mid-west I need to close them when to keep everything in green arc!



Doc, I went to the plane today read/re-read your procedures.  I am attaching a pdf with pictures associated with your procedure and a couple of needed clarification areas.  I want to make sure I fully understand before jumping into this if I decide to.  After looking at it today, it does not seem so daunting other than time consuming (but keeping in mind Mark's comment also).



Ron

Removing Gill Framework.pdf

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_________________
Ron Penrose
YAK-52 N352BW

Viperdoc

Joined: 19 Apr 2014
Posts: 484
Location: 08A

Posted: Wed Nov 12, 2014 2:37 pm Post subject: Removing Gills

Ron,

You are dead on with your pix and my description.

Once all of those bolts, braces, and screws are loose the louver ring will be somewhat flexible. Pick a flat side on the prop flange and lift that inner ring up over the top of that flange. You then rotate it around the flange until the whole ring lifts off free. Think about how you take an auto tire off the rime. The Russians made it a little easier by giving you two flat places on the outer side of the prop flange.

Doc



Sent from my iPad



 	  Quote: 	
		   On Nov 12, 2014, at 2:16 PM, ronpenrose <rpenrose(at)kc.rr.com> wrote:

 

 

 

 Mark, Interesting about removing the gills.  Unfortunately, here in the mid-west I need to close them when to keep everything in green arc!

 

 Doc, I went to the plane today read/re-read your procedures.  I am attaching a pdf with pictures associated with your procedure and a couple of needed clarification areas.  I want to make sure I fully understand before jumping into this if I decide to.  After looking at it today, it does not seem so daunting other than time consuming (but keeping in mind Mark's comment also).

 

 Ron

 

 --------

 Ron Penrose

 YAK-52 N352BW

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=433542#433542

 

 

 

 

 Attachments: 

 

 http://forums.matronics.com//files/removing_gill_framework_850.pdf

_________________
Viperdoc

Viperdoc

Joined: 19 Apr 2014
Posts: 484
Location: 08A

Posted: Wed Nov 12, 2014 6:40 pm Post subject: Removing Gills

That is a rigging problem. Measure the length of threads showing on the threaded rod swageged onto the control cable that connects to the lever that opens and closes the louvers. There is a jam nut at the base of the bullet shaped connector threaded onto the end of the control cable. Measure the length of threads from the jam nut to the none threaded length of the shaft. Coming out at a right angle is shaft with a ball at one end that fits in that bullet allowing it to articulate with the control cable. The other end of the shaft has a molded ~5 mm nut on it that flows into a threaded shaft that is screwed into that lever I referred to that is in the 0530 position that opens and closes the vanes on their access in the ring. 

Now saying all of that, as I learned the hard way, you do not have to loosen the bullet on the control cable. Just loosen that threaded on shaft from the louver lever. If memory serves there is also a 5 mm nut on the bolt that threads through the louver lever. 

Fun an games

Doc



Sent from my iPad



[quote] On Nov 12, 2014, at 10:04 AM, Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD <mark.bitterlich(at)navy.mil> wrote:

 

 

 

 Not to mention, putting it all back together and then having it jam closed in flight because of a small error when reassembling the darn thing, thus frying the engine.

 

 On the chance of awakening a sleeping giant, I will say that on my 50, the gills HAVE been removed.  Permanently.  Instead of painted red gill slats, you see a nice big round motor.

 

 That said, I do not fly in sub-freezing temperatures, and I also had to fabricate 4 support rods that mount from the engine to the gill ring to regain the necessary support the gill arrangement normally provides.

 

 Mark

 

 

 

 

 --

_________________
Viperdoc

mark.bitterlich(at)navy.m
Guest

Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2014 6:54 am Post subject: Removing Gills

What is a rigging problem?  The gills jamming shut?  Yes, you're right, it sure can be.  That and a whole list of other things can also cause them to jam, in ANY position.



--

Viperdoc

Joined: 19 Apr 2014
Posts: 484
Location: 08A

Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2014 8:42 am Post subject: Removing Gills

You are correct. There are a whole list of reasons why the the louvers will not fully open or close after re instillation. Assuming all of the vanes have that slotted screw through them at the inner ring they will move correctly. Assuming you did not screw with the three roller bearings on the inner ring ( the same inner ring that those slotted safety wired vane screws are screwed into) the ring will move freely. Assuming those roller bearing are not rusted and pitted the ring will move freely otherwise. Next comes making sure you do not warp the outer ring when you re-install the braces on the cylinder studs. Then it comes to cowling rigging. If the cowling does not seat down on the outer ring freely that can cause the them to bind also. That adjustment is made via the top canopy mounting rods. 

Now have them slam shut? Either there was a failure to reconnect them at the Louver lever on the inner ring. Mechanical failure of the cable ( swageged studs, cockpit lever or louver attachment points) granted you could have missed every slot on the lever slot on the vanes when you put the slotted screws back in but an intelligent person should catch that one.

Now in the 52 shutters slamming shut probably was because the carbon unit on the cockpit end of the shutter control lever failed to set the tension control allowing it to drift closed. Same for the 50. Only there it is a knurled knob on the side of the console that controls the tension on the levers ( cowl levers and the oil cooler door). In either of those cases, it was pilot disconnect that allowed the shutters to close and has nothing to do with "rigging"). 

Doc



Sent from my iPad



[quote] On Nov 13, 2014, at 8:53 AM, Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD <mark.bitterlich(at)navy.mil> wrote:

 

 

 

 What is a rigging problem?  The gills jamming shut?  Yes, you're right, it sure can be.  That and a whole list of other things can also cause them to jam, in ANY position.

 

 --

_________________
Viperdoc

mark.bitterlich(at)navy.m
Guest

Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2014 10:15 am Post subject: Removing Gills

Doc, I used the word "rigging" .... which apparently means sometime different to me than it does to you.  In any case, it is NBD... No Big Deal.



Several M-14P engines that I know of have been ruined by being over-temped with shutters that were stuck closed.  Several.



That was the point I was trying to make, not how to adjust the vanes, take them in or out, whatever.   There is proven potential to ruin your engine if those vanes manage to get closed, and fail "in such a fashion" that they cannot be opened again.  It's happened several times that I know of, and will probably happen again.



Mark

--

ronpenrose

Joined: 16 Jul 2014
Posts: 15
Location: Kansas City Metro (KLXT)

Posted: Thu Jan 08, 2015 11:14 am Post subject: Re: Removing Gills

Thanks to everyone for your insights.  I ended up removing the gills simply by removing the screws at the bottom of the gill and the long screws that go through the gills.  Did my painting thing the reinstalled them.  All is well and works fine as before.  One thing I did note is about half dozen of the long screws were significantly worn where they rotate and make contact with the upper gill hole.  They were worn about 50% through due to the rotation (and possibly lack of lubrication).  I brazed each of them then turned down flush so hopefully that will work for some time to come.  I would hate to tackle a problem where the screw broke in place.  Don't know who it could be removed w/o tearing up the gill.



Anyway thanks to all!!!

_________________
Ron Penrose
YAK-52 N352BW

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