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Nose ear hard retract/fail to retract

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altman51

Joined: 17 Sep 2012
Posts: 14
Location: Savannah, GA

Posted: Sun Dec 13, 2015 1:08 pm Post subject: Nose ear hard retract/fail to retract

The last couple of flights in my CJ the nose gear has "hard retracted - slaming into the gear well. Yesterday when I took off it would not retract. Air pressure was 40ATM. Post was up lights indicated it was down. Both mains retracted normally. Recycled gear down, then up the mains went down normally and when retracted the nose retracted "hard". re-extended, all gear extended and landed with no problems. Any experience/suggestions?



Wayne Altman

Savannah, GA

dsavarese0812(at)bellsout
Guest

Posted: Mon Dec 14, 2015 3:44 am Post subject: Nose ear hard retract/fail to retract

Sounds like a nose gear actuator may need rebuilding or replacing.  You may want to put the airplane on jacks and do a few gear extention/retractions.  Listen carefully around the bottom of the nose gear actuator for what will sound like air leaking.  Also, with it being in the hangar and on jacks, you may also be able to hear air leaking out of the front gear selector with it in the down or up position.  This is an indication that the air pressure in the actuator is going by the seals.  



Dennis



       From: altman51 <waltman51(at)comcast.net>

 To: yak-list(at)matronics.com 

 Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2015 4:08 PM

 Subject: Nose ear hard retract/fail to retract

  

 

--> Yak-List message posted by: "altman51" <waltman51(at)comcast.net (waltman51(at)comcast.net)>



The last couple of flights in my CJ the nose gear has "hard retracted - slaming into the gear well. Yesterday when I took off it would not retract. Air pressure was 40ATM. Post was up lights indicated it was down. Both mains retracted normally. Recycled gear down, then up the mains went down normally and when retracted the nose retracted "hard". re-extended, all gear extended and landed with no problems. Any experience/suggestions?



Wayne Altman

Savannah, GA





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av8ter

Joined: 25 Apr 2015
Posts: 27

Posted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 11:16 am Post subject: Re: Nose ear hard retract/fail to retract

possibly consider the restrictor plate on the retract side. It be should located in the rear cockpit, left side of the plane not too far from the gear handle on a blue white blue line at a 4 way connector. A popular schematic (attached) shows this restrictor in a position to affect all 3 gear. My interpretation of the Chinese schematic (also attached) shows it on the nose gear side only. Don't know which is correct or where yours is.

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altman51

Joined: 17 Sep 2012
Posts: 14
Location: Savannah, GA

Posted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 1:19 pm Post subject: Re: Nose ear hard retract/fail to retract

Av8ter...thanks for the info - will check it out

av8ter

Joined: 25 Apr 2015
Posts: 27

Posted: Wed Dec 23, 2015 11:12 am Post subject: Re: Nose ear hard retract/fail to retract

For what it's worth. These restrictor plates are about the size and shape as a contact lens and have a very small hole in the center. It is real easy to undo a gear line and have it fall out and never notice it. Many times they stay tucked inside the b-nut so you have to tap it to get it loose or take a look in to see if it's there (and maybe gunked up.)



I know the parts book references it a shock absorber or something similar , but I don't believe there is a picture. Doug sells blank plates and will provide you with a nominal hole size to drill. The hole size can be changed to increase or decrease speed of retraction/extention

altman51

Joined: 17 Sep 2012
Posts: 14
Location: Savannah, GA

Posted: Wed Dec 23, 2015 12:18 pm Post subject: Re: Nose ear hard retract/fail to retract

I have some restrictors from Doug...will look to see if II need a new one there...thanks for the reply!

wlannon(at)shaw.ca
Guest

Posted: Wed Dec 23, 2015 8:44 pm Post subject: Nose ear hard retract/fail to retract

Wayne;



Meant to respond earlier.  Did you get it on jacks as Dennis suggested?

It appears you are experiencing two different problems, likely from the same 

source.  First: "nose gear would not retract". Second: "nose gear retracted 

hard".



The first (gear wont retract) is usually due to internal failure of the 

(firewall) check valve allowing main air pressure to leak into the emergency 

side pressurizing the down side of the actuators.   But since your problem 

is nose gear only this likely does not apply.



The second (nose gear retracted hard) is totally opposite and indicates zero 

back pressure in the actuator.



All I can think of that could possibly malfunction to both situations is the 

nose gear emergency valves.  Both should be tested and probably disassembled 

for corrosion inspection.  If you find something nasty here you should 

consider the rest of the gear system.  The air line restrictors are not the 

problem.



Walt



--

altman51

Joined: 17 Sep 2012
Posts: 14
Location: Savannah, GA

Posted: Thu Dec 24, 2015 2:45 am Post subject: Re: Nose ear hard retract/fail to retract

Will put it on jacks after Christmas and check it out ... thanks for the input will post results here

av8ter

Joined: 25 Apr 2015
Posts: 27

Posted: Sat Jan 09, 2016 10:57 am Post subject: Re: Nose ear hard retract/fail to retract

Hi Walt, that's good info. I misread that his gear "hard retracted" thinking it was slamming up.....

altman51

Joined: 17 Sep 2012
Posts: 14
Location: Savannah, GA

Posted: Sun Jan 17, 2016 2:12 pm Post subject: Re: Nose ear hard retract/fail to retract

Did much trouble shooting - checked pneumatics to see if air was going to all the proper places. It was. Eliminated everything that we could and concluded that Dennis, Doug and some others we right in concluding that the nose gear actuator was bad. R and R the actuator,  jacked it up and retraction was perfect. The removed actuator was locked, could not get it to move. Back in Business!!!

jbsoar(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Jan 17, 2016 3:02 pm Post subject: Nose ear hard retract/fail to retract

Where are the potential leak points in just the compression/starting system? Â 



On Sunday, January 17, 2016, altman51 <waltman51(at)comcast.net (waltman51(at)comcast.net)> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  --> Yak-List message posted by: "altman51" <[url=javascript:;]waltman51(at)comcast.net[/url]>

 

 Did much trouble shooting - checked pneumatics to see if air was going to all the proper places. It was. Eliminated everything that we could and concluded that Dennis, Doug and some others we right in concluding that the nose gear actuator was bad. R and R the actuator,Â  jacked it up and retraction was perfect. The removed actuator was locked, could not get it to move. Back in Business!!!

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=452068#452068

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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jblake207(at)comcast.net
Guest

Posted: Sun Jan 17, 2016 3:06 pm Post subject: Nose ear hard retract/fail to retract

That's great news. We need to get with Matt Lazar and do some serious flying next month. I'm open to hosting you guys or meet somewhere with the intent of knocking off the winter rust. What say you guys? JB



Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID



altman51 <waltman51(at)comcast.net> wrote:



--> Yak-List message posted by: "altman51" <waltman51(at)comcast.net>



Did much trouble shooting - checked pneumatics to see if air was going to all the proper places. It was. Eliminated everything that we could and concluded that Dennis, Doug and some others we right in concluding that the nose gear actuator was bad. R and R the actuator,  jacked it up and retraction was perfect. The removed actuator was locked, could not get it to move. Back in Business!!!





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hess737(at)aol.com
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Posted: Sun Jan 17, 2016 3:31 pm Post subject: Nose ear hard retract/fail to retract

I might actually have time off. Let me know when



Richard HessC 404-964-4885

On Jan 17, 2016, at 5:58 PM, Jon Blake <jblake207(at)comcast.net (jblake207(at)comcast.net)> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  That's great news. We need to get with Matt Lazar and do some serious flying next month. I'm open to hosting you guys or meet somewhere with the intent of knocking off the winter rust. What say you guys? JB

Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID



altman51 <waltman51(at)comcast.net (waltman51(at)comcast.net)> wrote:



--> Yak-List message posted by: "altman51" <waltman51(at)comcast.net (waltman51(at)comcast.net)>



Did much trouble shooting - checked pneumatics to see if air was going to all the proper places. It was. Eliminated everything that we could and concluded that Dennis, Doug and some others we right in concluding that the nose gear actuator was bad. R and R the actuator,  jacked it up and retraction was perfect. The removed actuator was locked, could not get it to move. Back in Business!!!





Read this topic online here:



http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopi====================================================r's Bookstore www.buildersbooks.com-=   --> ht;                         -Matt D==========================p;        - The Yak-List Email Forum -http://forums.matron==========================p;          - List Contributionp;                         ref="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contr========================================

draftsjust417(at)gmail.co
Guest

Posted: Sun Jan 17, 2016 4:58 pm Post subject: Nose ear hard retract/fail to retract

Great info, thanks!

 Glad to hear all is back to normal.  

Justin Drafts

 N280NC On Jan 17, 2016 1:33 PM, "altman51" <waltman51(at)comcast.net (waltman51(at)comcast.net)> wrote: 	  Quote: 	
		  --> Yak-List message posted by: "altman51" <waltman51(at)comcast.net (waltman51(at)comcast.net)>

 

 Did much trouble shooting - checked pneumatics to see if air was going to all the proper places. It was. Eliminated everything that we could and concluded that Dennis, Doug and some others we right in concluding that the nose gear actuator was bad. R and R the actuator,Â  jacked it up and retraction was perfect. The removed actuator was locked, could not get it to move. Back in Business!!!

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=452068#452068

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 ===========

 br> fts!)

 r> > w.buildersbooks.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">www.buildersbooks.com

 rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution

 Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  -Matt Dralle, List Admin.

 ===========

 List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List

 ===========

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Viperdoc

Joined: 19 Apr 2014
Posts: 484
Location: 08A

Posted: Sun Jan 17, 2016 5:18 pm Post subject: Nose ear hard retract/fail to retract

Where do you want to meet. Not AUO. My YAK brakes do not like long down hill form taxis.

Doc



Sent from my iPad



On Jan 17, 2016, at 5:20 PM, Richard Hess <hess737(at)aol.com (hess737(at)aol.com)> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  I might actually have time off. Let me know when



Richard HessC 404-964-4885

On Jan 17, 2016, at 5:58 PM, Jon Blake <jblake207(at)comcast.net (jblake207(at)comcast.net)> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  That's great news. We need to get with Matt Lazar and do some serious flying next month. I'm open to hosting you guys or meet somewhere with the intent of knocking off the winter rust. What say you guys? JB

Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID



altman51 <waltman51(at)comcast.net (waltman51(at)comcast.net)> wrote:



--> Yak-List message posted by: "altman51" <waltman51(at)comcast.net (waltman51(at)comcast.net)>



Did much trouble shooting - checked pneumatics to see if air was going to all the proper places. It was. Eliminated everything that we could and concluded that Dennis, Doug and some others we right in concluding that the nose gear actuator was bad. R and R the actuator,  jacked it up and retraction was perfect. The removed actuator was locked, could not get it to move. Back in Business!!!





Read this topic online here:



http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopi====================================================r's Bookstore www.buildersbooks.com-=   --> ht;                         -Matt D==========================p;        - The Yak-List Email Forum -http://forums.matron==========================p;          - List Contributionp;                         ref="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contr========================================

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