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jlpartington(at)reagan.co
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 Posted: Wed Oct 27, 2021 7:49 am Post subject: Still will not start |
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CJ6 motor with auto plugs. New plugs, tested shower of sparks, checked timing AGAIN.
would not fire and no gas on plugs. Replaced carb with off an engine that was running, no change. Tried starting fluid in carb notice no suction at carb.
is there a way that the intake can get blocked or something else that could cause these symptoms?
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strodude(at)gmail.com
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| Posted: Wed Oct 27, 2021 11:51 am Post subject: Still will not start |
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Hi Jim. I might be coming into this late so sorry if I'm asking things you already answered.
I always start with the basics. Are you getting fuel into the cylinders through priming? Are you getting sparks at the actual plugs?
Is it trying to catch at all or are you just turning the prop with the airstarter with no signs of ignition at all?
Best
Darrin
On Wed, Oct 27, 2021, 9:54 AM <jlpartington(at)reagan.com (jlpartington(at)reagan.com)> wrote:
| Quote: |
CJ6 motor with auto plugs. New plugs, tested shower of sparks, checked timing AGAIN.
would not fire and no gas on plugs. Replaced carb with off an engine that was running, no change. Tried starting fluid in carb notice no suction at carb.
is there a way that the intake can get blocked or something else that could cause these symptoms? |
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jlpartington(at)reagan.co
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| Posted: Wed Oct 27, 2021 2:02 pm Post subject: Still will not start |
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Weeks of trying, I have moved 200 miles away, have given the same result.Motor was née to me after a “US” rebuild and conversion to auto plugs (several years ago). I mounted it and got several good runs on her. Sa always, she sat for several months and would not make full power each mag and shower of sparks gave different results.
Removed and fixed mags. Would not start so I do not know if original issues were fixed.
Checked timing several times. Shower of sparks is strong and makes it to each plug. Primer working ( removed and checked) and gas coming out intake drains. Plugs are not getting wet. Changed carb with one that was working, no change.
It did hit on about three on first try today but never after that. Put starting fluid directly into carb and air flow , suction, at the carb could Not be detected.
Frustrating, simple needs. Compression , would not turn over without it. Fire sparking and should pop some even if timing off. So fuel I should have flooded it but….
I have never seen the blower setup but wonder if something in inducing system could fail and cause it to act this way
Pooh’s phone
| Quote: | On Oct 27, 2021, at 2:58 PM, strodude <strodude(at)gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Jim. I might be coming into this late so sorry if I'm asking things you already answered.
I always start with the basics. Are you getting fuel into the cylinders through priming? Are you getting sparks at the actual plugs?
Is it trying to catch at all or are you just turning the prop with the airstarter with no signs of ignition at all?
Best
Darrin
On Wed, Oct 27, 2021, 9:54 AM <jlpartington(at)reagan.com (jlpartington(at)reagan.com)> wrote:
| Quote: |
CJ6 motor with auto plugs. New plugs, tested shower of sparks, checked timing AGAIN.
would not fire and no gas on plugs. Replaced carb with off an engine that was running, no change. Tried starting fluid in carb notice no suction at carb.
is there a way that the intake can get blocked or something else that could cause these symptoms? |
|
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http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List |
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Clouddog
Joined: 02 Jun 2016
Posts: 119
Location: Lebanon, TN
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| Posted: Wed Oct 27, 2021 4:13 pm Post subject: Still will not start |
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My two feeble sense worth.
Walt mentions a mixture issue with a possible weld issue on the drain kit of 4,5 and 6. I would check each intake tube to insure they are snug. Any chance your primer is acting up? I would think if you primed 5 or more time and pulled thru the same amount that you would be getting fuel in a few cylinders to at least get it to fire off. There is also a finger screen on the carb but since you swapped carbs that shouldn't be the problem. You say no suction at the 2 carbs you have tried. That one does not make sense but then a lot of things in this world make no sense to me anymore! Is all your mixture and throttle linkage set correctly? Don't know if you can get something backwards or the mixture is way to lean for starting or the throttle is too far back not opening up the carb. I'll bet when you figure it out your going to shrug your shoulders and slap yourself in the head! That's how I ended up with a short neck and a flat forehead. Sometime the obvious is blinding.
On Wed, Oct 27, 2021, 13:57 W LANNON <wlannon(at)shaw.ca (wlannon(at)shaw.ca)> wrote:
| Quote: |
From: jlpartington(at)reagan.com (jlpartington(at)reagan.com)
To: yak-list(at)matronics.com (yak-list(at)matronics.com)
Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 2021 8:48:59 AM
Subject: Still will not start
CJ6 motor with auto plugs. New plugs, tested shower of sparks, checked timing AGAIN.
would not fire and no gas on plugs. Replaced carb with off an engine that was running, no change. Tried starting fluid in carb notice no suction at carb.
is there a way that the intake can get blocked or something else that could cause these symptoms?
If that is an early Huosai with a lower cylinder intake drain kit mod. installed there is the possibility of a failed weld on one (4,5 or 6) causing a significant mixture change.
Walt
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markbitterlich(at)embarqm
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| Posted: Wed Oct 27, 2021 6:29 pm Post subject: Still will not start |
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All good suggestions from everyone commenting.
Only one input really. Never assume. Run a differential compression test first thing. Listen for air leakage out exhaust, etc. If you're right, you've just wasted some time.
But... recent rebuild, sits for awhile and won't start, no induction indication, when it did run ... did not develop full power, etc.
To me this screams low compression, or the blower is not turning.
Mark
-------- Original message --------
From: Greg Wrobel <clouddog22(at)gmail.com>
Date: 10/27/21 8:17 PM (GMT-05:00)
To: yak-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Yak-List: Still will not start
My two feeble sense worth.
Walt mentions a mixture issue with a possible weld issue on the drain kit of 4,5 and 6. I would check each intake tube to insure they are snug. Any chance your primer is acting up? I would think if you primed 5 or more time and pulled thru the same amount that you would be getting fuel in a few cylinders to at least get it to fire off. There is also a finger screen on the carb but since you swapped carbs that shouldn't be the problem. You say no suction at the 2 carbs you have tried. That one does not make sense but then a lot of things in this world make no sense to me anymore! Is all your mixture and throttle linkage set correctly? Don't know if you can get something backwards or the mixture is way to lean for starting or the throttle is too far back not opening up the carb. I'll bet when you figure it out your going to shrug your shoulders and slap yourself in the head! That's how I ended up with a short neck and a flat forehead. Sometime the obvious is blinding.
On Wed, Oct 27, 2021, 13:57 W LANNON <wlannon(at)shaw.ca (wlannon(at)shaw.ca)> wrote:
| Quote: |
From: jlpartington(at)reagan.com (jlpartington(at)reagan.com)
To: yak-list(at)matronics.com (yak-list(at)matronics.com)
Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 2021 8:48:59 AM
Subject: Yak-List: Still will not start
CJ6 motor with auto plugs. New plugs, tested shower of sparks, checked timing AGAIN.
would not fireand no gas on plugs. Replaced carb with off an engine that was running, no change. Tried starting fluid in carb notice no suction at carb.
is there a way that the intake can get blocked or something else that could cause these symptoms?
If that is an early Huosai with a lower cylinder intake drain kit mod. installed there is the possibility of a failed weld on one (4,5 or 6) causing a significantmixture change.
Walt
|
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http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List |
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dsavarese0812(at)bellsout
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| Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2021 2:43 am Post subject: Still will not start |
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To add to the intake leak theory, do not forget to check the manifold pressure hose between the firewall and the supercharger case at the top of the engine. And don't forget to check the primer hose from the firewall to the standoff on the #2 cylinder intake tube and then over to the primer line fitting in front of the right mag that goes into the supercharger case.
Dennis
On Wednesday, October 27, 2021, 08:15:42 PM EDT, Greg Wrobel <clouddog22(at)gmail.com> wrote:
My two feeble sense worth.
Walt mentions a mixture issue with a possible weld issue on the drain kit of 4,5 and 6. I would check each intake tube to insure they are snug. Any chance your primer is acting up? I would think if you primed 5 or more time and pulled thru the same amount that you would be getting fuel in a few cylinders to at least get it to fire off. There is also a finger screen on the carb but since you swapped carbs that shouldn't be the problem. You say no suction at the 2 carbs you have tried. That one does not make sense but then a lot of things in this world make no sense to me anymore! Is all your mixture and throttle linkage set correctly? Don't know if you can get something backwards or the mixture is way to lean for starting or the throttle is too far back not opening up the carb. I'll bet when you figure it out your going to shrug your shoulders and slap yourself in the head! That's how I ended up with a short neck and a flat forehead. Sometime the obvious is blinding.
On Wed, Oct 27, 2021, 13:57 W LANNON <wlannon(at)shaw.ca (wlannon(at)shaw.ca)> wrote:
| Quote: |
From: jlpartington(at)reagan.com (jlpartington(at)reagan.com)To: yak-list(at)matronics.com (yak-list(at)matronics.com)Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 2021 8:48:59 AMSubject: Still will not start
CJ6 motor with auto plugs. New plugs, tested shower of sparks, checked timing AGAIN.
would not fire and no gas on plugs. Replaced carb with off an engine that was running, no change. Tried starting fluid in carb notice no suction at carb.
is there a way that the intake can get blocked or something else that could cause these symptoms?
If that is an early Huosai with a lower cylinder intake drain kit mod. installed there is the possibility of a failed weld on one (4,5 or 6) causing a significant mixture change.
Walt
|
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http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List |
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dsavarese0812(at)bellsout
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| Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2021 3:11 am Post subject: Still will not start |
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If you don't mind, I'd like to ask a couple of questions please.
- When you removed the mags, were they sent out for overhaul? If yes, by whom?
- What is the model number of the magnetos installed on the engine? M9F, M9-35, etc.
- When the mags were re-installed, what was the timing set to? ie: how many degrees before TDC or after TDC depending on the model of the magneto.
- When the mags were re-installed, what cylinder was used to initially set the raw timing. Raw timing is my term for properly positioning the drive coupling on the bottom of the mag to coincide with the proper magneto timing specification.
The next time you're working on the engine, bring cylinder #4 up to TDC on the compression stroke. Remove the top cover on either one of the magnetos, then lift up the distributor cap and lay it aside. Take a picture of the top of the mag making sure to include the rotor fingers position and the high voltage stick and email them to me at my email address,
dsavarese0812(at)bellsouth.net.
Dennis
On Wednesday, October 27, 2021, 06:04:09 PM EDT, Reagan <jlpartington(at)reagan.com> wrote:
Weeks of trying, I have moved 200 miles away, have given the same result.Motor was née to me after a “US” rebuild and conversion to auto plugs (several years ago). I mounted it and got several good runs on her. Sa always, she sat for several months and would not make full power each mag and shower of sparks gave different results.
Removed and fixed mags. Would not start so I do not know if original issues were fixed.
Checked timing several times. Shower of sparks is strong and makes it to each plug. Primer working ( removed and checked) and gas coming out intake drains. Plugs are not getting wet. Changed carb with one that was working, no change.
It did hit on about three on first try today but never after that. Put starting fluid directly into carb and air flow , suction, at the carb could Not be detected.
Frustrating, simple needs. Compression , would not turn over without it. Fire sparking and should pop some even if timing off. So fuel I should have flooded it but….
I have never seen the blower setup but wonder if something in inducing system could fail and cause it to act this way
Pooh’s phone
| Quote: | On Oct 27, 2021, at 2:58 PM, strodude <strodude(at)gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Jim. I might be coming into this late so sorry if I'm asking things you already answered.
I always start with the basics. Are you getting fuel into the cylinders through priming? Are you getting sparks at the actual plugs?
Is it trying to catch at all or are you just turning the prop with the airstarter with no signs of ignition at all?
Best
Darrin
On Wed, Oct 27, 2021, 9:54 AM <jlpartington(at)reagan.com (jlpartington(at)reagan.com)> wrote:
| Quote: |
CJ6 motor with auto plugs. New plugs, tested shower of sparks, checked timing AGAIN.
would not fire and no gas on plugs. Replaced carb with off an engine that was running, no change. Tried starting fluid in carb notice no suction at carb.
is there a way that the intake can get blocked or something else that could cause these symptoms? |
|
| | - The Matronics Yak-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Yak-List |
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Vic
Joined: 12 Aug 2008
Posts: 116
Location: Southern Bavaria
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| Posted: Thu Oct 28, 2021 6:34 am Post subject: Re: Still will not start |
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Did you check the primer jet for a reasonable spray forming, a poor running down of fuel from there is not great for starting ?
As to no suction on carb, my guess the blower drive may be defective. Take out one intake elbow and look inside for checking the blower rotation, maybe with endoscope, I am not sure one can see it without one - anybody ?
Vic
| | - The Matronics Yak-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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